Cast iron Borg Warner T-10

[beermiester]

Hi everyone,I hope this is posted in the right spot. I'm over from Abodies and I need some info on this trans. I believe it's from a 62-63 Mopar. It's a cast iron T-10 that a friend picked up for his Falcon Sprint. It has the wrong tail shaft for his car and after some research it seems to be a early B body 4 speed. It's been on the shelf for years and looks very clean inside. What is the value and is there any way to verify this thing? Thanks for your help, this guy is a ex-circle track racer and is more chevy-ford then Mopar.

 

[lewtot184]

they cam in '63 big block b-bodies. should have the ball and trunnion flange at the rear. they are fairly weak compared to an 833 and were never used in any s/s max wedge cars. they would have value for somebody doing a restoration.

 

[Sonny Black]

they cam in '63 big block b-bodies. should have the ball and trunnion flange at the rear. they are fairly weak compared to an 833 and were never used in any s/s max wedge cars. they would have value for somebody doing a restoration.

Sonny has an original BW T10 in my '63, and I beat it pretty good!
have had no prob'....yet

 

[beermiester]

T-10b

Thanks everyone, I'll try to get some pics tomorrow.






Here are some photos I took this morning. It is not a ball and trunion, but it does look very clean inside.

 

[lewtot184]

Sonny has an original BW T10 in my '63, and I beat it pretty good!
have had no prob'....yet

back in the day a friend had a 63 plymouth and a 63 ex-max wedge dodge. he had a stock 340hp 413 in both. the plymouth had the t-10 and the dodge a t-85. clobbered both trannies. there's a reason the t-10's were never put behind rb engines. i think the new super t-10's today are only rated for 350ftlbs of torque.

 

[2059]

they cam in '63 big block b-bodies. should have the ball and trunnion flange at the rear. they are fairly weak compared to an 833 and were never used in any s/s max wedge cars. they would have value for somebody doing a restoration.

agree.. T-10's were big in small block and low end BB chebbys. Chry. used them for a bit then went to New Process trans.

 

[lewtot184]

up until 1964 the t-10 was the only passenger car 4spd option. there was a reason in 1964 that gm, ford, and chrysler started making their own 4spds.

 

[mopar 3 B]

Use to be able to buy hp gear sets that were better than t10 super stuff. First gear syncro would never hold for long. Other than that I liked the old t10.

 

[cryplydog]

I ripped two T-10's out of my 63 ford 406 car but I was 15 at the time. But I do believe they were to light for Big Block cars plus the shifters were crap and that had a lot to do with it. Still a good box for what they are.

 

[Sonny Black]

I ripped two T-10's out of my 63 ford 406 car but I was 15 at the time. But I do believe they were to light for Big Block cars plus the shifters were crap and that had a lot to do with it. Still a good box for what they are.

But, if you are trying to keep a car period correct and original you need to work with what you have....also I have adapted the stock HURST shift lever to a comp plus shifter & shifts awesome. yes, it was the original T-10 & not rebuilt for near 50 years..now is & operates well...with the Big Block and 1 4BBL...:icon_winkle:
with that said,
if I was going to bruise the car I would put a 5-speed or 6-speed transmission kit , like- TREMEC for cruising & performance:eusa_think:

 

[pturner]

just need to talk about old times with T10

its a T10, but the flange bolt pattern looks screwy for a GM. i think i have rebuilt 40-50 of these in the 70's. we tore them up on almost a weekly basis due to hot-rod shifting. clean inside means nothing if the brass blocking ring teeth and the syncronizer teeth are rounded. they should be pointed and almost sharp to the touch. look in the case bottom for brass and metal filings. they will accumulate in the bottom close to the drain plug. you should be able to slide the locking ring (the ring the shifter fork is in) back and forth, but not so easily, and they should snap into a locked position as they are shifted. front toward input shaft is 1-2 gear and next is 3-4 gear. reverse gear is outside the case in the tail stock housing.
there is no good way to tell is the 1-2 syncronizer will stay in First gear without power being applied. unless you are doing a numbers correct restoration, i would not invest any money in this old transmission.
the super T10 was out sometime about 66-68 (i am guessing) and the syncros were larger diameter with different blocking rings and closer ratios. just be carefull as this trans could be a piece of crap or it might be good, but it is hard to know.
the Pontiacs were full of T10's. The Muncy chevy trans were better, but the Muncy Rock Crusher was the toughest of all. the big block chevy's had them. ot was almost impossible to break.
just my two cents
pt in tennessee

 

[cryplydog]

But, if you are trying to keep a car period correct and original you need to work with what you have....also I have adapted the stock HURST shift lever to a comp plus shifter & shifts awesome. yes, it was the original T-10 & not rebuilt for near 50 years..now is & operates well...with the Big Block and 1 4BBL...:icon_winkle:
with that said,
if I was going to bruise the car I would put a 5-speed or 6-speed transmission kit , like- TREMEC for cruising & performance:eusa_think:

Sonny, I agree with you and would do the same without a doubt and would keep it correct as possible. you do have a rare and awesome car. john

 

[KarNut46]

That's an odd assortment of parts. I had a 63 dodge 440 w/ hp 383 and BW T-10. I think that was the only year that it was offered. They had a limited # of 3 speed units behind 413 cars in 62. That trans has the long pilot bearing area on input shaft but has a coarse clutch disc spline. My T-10 had fine spline input shaft. Case is mopar, at least the bell bolt pattern is mopar. Output housing looks to be GM. ??? With old car parts never say never. Could be some chebby guy was trying to build a tougher T-10 for his race car. In early 70's chevy guys were shredding those BW and muncie trans on a regular basis. Someone even made a bell that would bolt an 833 Mopar trans to BB chevys. Think about those Pont guys running an alum cased T-10 behind a 421 in a big Catalina. Those guys had to have had a truckload of spare trannies on hand.

 

[beermiester]

Added Pictures

I'm not sure what this is, I hope someone can identify it. Here some more pictures ans a little more info on the T-10's.

 

[KarNut46]

Trans inquiry got me curious. Went to an old Hot Rod article that I had stored years ago. Might provide some info that would help to ID your trans. Hot Rod Aug. 1980, Hot Rod's guide to 4 speeds. 1) Ford used early T10 from 60-65. 2) Merc started in 62. 3) All Fords had 28 spline output shafts, GM had 16. 4) 60-62 Ford used 23 spline input shaft. 63-65 had 10 spline input. 5) Ford used 2 different length input shafts; 427 was 8 15/16", others 8 1/2". 6) last 3 digits (above WG Div) indicate type of iron used to make case. 902 = cast iron, 904 = nodular iron. Nodular iron is stronger. 7) Mopar used T10 one year only, 1963. Ford T10 used iron case on all trans except those used in Shelby race cars. Google Transmission I.D. chart, Hurst shifters. That chart will ID the trans by the tail housing bolt pattern. Finally: Ford bell bolt pattern is similar to Mopar, not exact but similar. Do some measuring, count splines, and look at the chart and you should come close to an ID. I knew those old tech articles might come in handy some day. Good luck on your hunt.