Need Help- what's this 63 Dodge 440 worth ? ? My Uncle is interested - like feedback

[conv67bdere]

I really respect the expertise and knowledge that is contained in this group and I'd like to ask your honest opinions on the value of a car that my Uncle is looking at and is very interested in possibly purchasing.

The description o the vehicle is as follows:
1963 Dodge 440 Resto-Mod 2-Door Hard Top---Completely Restored. '91 Dodge Red, base coat, clear coat w/Red & Black Leather upholstery designed by Legendary Interiors. Original panels, sanded to bare metal. Chrome is in show condition; new stainless grille. Some pitting in places, but all bright work shows well. Glass is in good condition; original windshield. All unibody construction; frame is 100% intact. 3:91 rear end. Front disc brakes enhanced with power booster, drums on the rear. American Mag wheels. Street Strip tires in rear, conventional Goodrich in front. Modified 440 V8 bored 0.30 over w/727 Torque Flight transmission, Street Strip cam, 850 cfm Holley. Keith Black pistons. Electronic ignition box under dash, cast iron manifold. Double fan belt pulley runs water pump. Custom 4-core radiator with (2) electric fans. 3" tailpipes and exhaust. Under dash gauges, correct reproduction steering wheel. All lights and signals are operational and intact, original radio is mounted, but does not work. Bucket front seats, simulated buckets in rear. Carpet is in good condition --- no tears or rips, although some fading in rear, but shows well. Trunk has no corrosion, spare with mount. Completely restored.

Pictures:











I'm not stating the stating price as I really would like the groups honest opinion as to what they think the car would possibly be worth.

Thanks in advance for any and all your input and assistance FBBO ! ! !

 

[5.7 hemi]

Looks and sounds like a solid car. Based on what you posted and what I see in the pics......14-18k!

 

[conv67bdere]

Looks and sounds like a solid car. Based on what you posted and what I see in the pics......14-18k!

Thanks a bunch 5.7Hemi . . . that's exactly what I was looking for. Now let me add this information.

He claims that he entered the car in the World of Wheels "competition". Once again, he claims they only give out one prize, but the judging was so close ( and he did not win ) that they presented him with a plaque due to how close the judging resulted. So the next question - is the World of Wheels a respectable organization ?

Thanks for your input 5.7Hemi . . . your feedback is really going to help us out ! ! ! !

Now for the asking price - the gentleman is asking $28,000 . . . thought that was out of range . . .

 

[Sonny Black]

Pictures, not like "in person" live hands on check so I would say $18,000.-----$25,000.

IF it is all you say it is.:yes:

Also, I would want to see at least 10-15 recent "awards" from reputable shows.(best of class, peoples choice, Best of show)
not: "thanks for showing up award..."

 

[eric383]

The only way this guy is gonna get 28K is from someone with more money than common sense. I have seen similar cars go for under 20K at auction so just because you have more than 28K in the build doesn't mean you will get it. It is a nice looking 63 but too much$$$$.

 

[Bruzilla]

I agree with 5.7 Hemi. This car might have gone for the mid $20ks about ten years ago, but the collector car market is down and the Mopar market is way down. Plus this car is not totally restored. It may have been at one time, but if you've got wear and tear to the carpet, interior, etc., it's no longer considered restored. Also, since there were no 440s in these cars back then, there's no way the drivetrain is original.

This is basically an average clone of a Superstock 1963 Dodge 330. Had he put a 426 Max Wedge or 413 in there, it would be worth more. If he had an aluminum front end or acid-dipped doors it would be worth more. If it had the cop wheels and dog dish hubcaps it would be worth more. But instead it looks like he just prettied up a basic 1963 330, which makes it a nice car, but not a very special one in today's market. Also, since the market is down, people who are really into cars like these and who can afford to pay big bucks are buying original cars and high-end clones now that prices are down. Lastly, the market for these cars is very limited and always has been. Most folks want late 60s/early 70s cars, and early 60s body styles have great appeal to some people but not a big majority like the later cars.

I saw a very similar car that had a correct 426 in it on several sites about the time I bought my road runner in 2012, and the car was listed at $16,999 and was for sale for quite a while. I just checked again and some of the ads are still up but the pics are down, so I'm guessing it sold but not at $16,999, so I would say 5.7 Hemi was right on target with the $14k estimate. If it was in perfect shape, and had a 426, I would think $18k, but with an aging resto and 440, $14k is the most I would want to pay.

As for World of Wheels, anyone with $50 can get a car into one of the dozens of shows they do every year, and I doubt that car would come close to winning. The guys who put their cars in those shows are entering very highly-modified cars, not mildly-modified ones. They've got chrome everything, blowers, gazillion dollar paint jobs, etc., and while nice this car wouldn't come close to those guys.

 

[Sonny Black]

ok, many cars in my class a "world of wheels" I took best of class....IN THE WR0NG CLASS!they put me in restored class and my '63 is not restored...also in my trunk it Had "NOT A RESTORATION! "sign....& still won Best Of Class....not braggin' just sayin'...
people do not see 63's '64's '65's & 62's BUT when they do see one they just stare for awhile!!!
who knows what they are thinking? they just like 'em!

they just don't want to own 'em...chev's are E Z to work on , get parts,:yes: most of that type (of people) are followers....not leaders!

 

[Moparsmitty]

I'm with most of these guys in the 14 to 16K range max. Without seeing the car in person and driving it it's kind of hard to get excited about paying more than that. I've seen cars like this that look good just sitting, but when you get in and drive them you can tell that they need major work with the suspension, steering,engine, trans, etc. etc. It's easy to get overly excited about buying a car like this (I love 'em too) but go in with your eyes wide open and don't find out later that you paid way too much.

 

[super-bee_ski]

Isnt that car currently for sale on "Cars Online"?
NOPE, I'm wrong...sorry.

 

[glassman]

One 63 Dodge painted the same color and a postless sedan just sold last summer for $35,000. It had a 426 max wedge and a cross ram with correct carbs and the car had an aluminum front end, was race ready and was driven on the street also. Complete aluminum front ends in good shape go for 15-20 grand. How much money were they asking for the car in question? Do the math

 

[Bruzilla]

Yep, when it comes to that style/vintage those are the cars that are selling. No sense in spending $25k on a low-end clone when for $10k more you can get a high-end clone. This guy cleaned up the body, painted it, dropped in the wrong engine, and stuck on a hood... not quite $25k material these days.

 

[Budnicks]

as we've seen many time even here, basket cases even can bring what ever the market will bare, what ever someone is willing to pay, as Bruzilla always seems to say :icon_pray: , "there's no fair price, just the right price"... IMHFO I'd pay as high as $16k-$18k, it's a nice car, numbers car or not, not everyone wants a #'s car or accurate clones, it should bring decent above average $$$...

 

[conv67bdere]

Thanks EVERYONE that responded with information. The information that you provided will be a great help, and we're not "rushing" into it . . . but most importantly, I wanted exactly the information that this site has shown me it provides DAILY ! !

And you did not let me down - I think the seller is in or really big "rude" awakening and if we're in the right spot at the right time, my uncle might just end up with a deal on a car. If he holds his price at his current $28K price - he'll still be holding on to it when the dust settles.

Thanks everyone - your wealth of knowledge is incredible and we ( my uncle and myself ) thank you for all your assistance ! ! !

( SMILE )

 

[tallhair]

Glad you got your info. I agree with the assessments here but will also say it's a pretty cool looking cruiser. I love that front end and hood scoop ... minus the stripe on the hood scoop and the mirrors. The interior is well done too.

 

[Budnicks]

conv67bdere they are expensive to restore you couldn't buy one & restore it to that level, under something like $20k probably, that's if you do all the work yourself & can actually find all the parts... not many parts re-poped for those years... but cool cars

I tend to estimate on the low side usually too... good luck with your purchase what ever you decide

 

[conv67bdere]

conv67bdere they are expensive to restore you couldn't buy one & restore it to that level, under something like $20k probably, that's if you do all the work yourself & can actually find all the parts... not many parts re-poped for those years... but cool cars

Agreed Budnicks . . . Agreed ! ! ! My Uncle has done his share of car work ( raced NHRA for years - ALWAYS Hemis ! ! ) and an awesome 1939 Humback Dodge Sedan - which he sold. He does not want to restore the car, wants it done and ready to drive. He currently has a 1964 Dodge Dart that he's working on fixing up too. He's well aware that we could not build it for under $20K, and he's keeping that in mind while he thinking about his offer. Lack of parts for these cars is yet another reason to not pay too much for this one.

He's the one that got me interested in cars, and that's part of the reason I'm now rebuilding my 1967 Belvedere Convertible ! !

He's my FAVORITE Uncle, and I tell him that all the time ! ! ! ( now, the fact that he's my only uncle should not make a difference - right ! ! ) ( SMILE )

 

[tallhair]

Agreed Budnicks . . . Agreed ! ! ! My Uncle has done his share of car work ( raced NHRA for years - ALWAYS Hemis ! ! ) and an awesome 1939 Humback Dodge Sedan - which he sold. He does not want to restore the car, wants it done and ready to drive. He currently has a 1964 Dodge Dart that he's working on fixing up too. He's well aware that we could not build it for under $20K, and he's keeping that in mind while he thinking about his offer. Lack of parts for these cars is yet another reason to not pay too much for this one.

He's the one that got me interested in cars, and that's part of the reason I'm now rebuilding my 1967 Belvedere Convertible ! !

He's my FAVORITE Uncle, and I tell him that all the time ! ! ! ( now, the fact that he's my only uncle should not make a difference - right ! ! ) ( SMILE )

Cool story .. maybe he's got some pics he could share ?? I'd like to see the humpback hemi hauler

 

[Bruzilla]

And you did not let me down - I think the seller is in or really big "rude" awakening and if we're in the right spot at the right time, my uncle might just end up with a deal on a car. If he holds his price at his current $28K price - he'll still be holding on to it when the dust settles.

After buying and selling cars personally and professionally, I would just say that buying cars is every bit the same psychological endurance test that selling is. I've seen a lot of guys pricing their stuff way to high, and demanding their price be met, then one day POOF! The right buyer comes along, makes the right pitch, and the seller collapses on their demands like jello on a hot day. One day they won't take a nickel less and the next day they're taking 50% less.

I don't know if you or your uncle watch that show Pawn Stars on the history channel, but if you don't you should make some time to watch it. Watching Rick Harrison in action is a great education. He gets the price he wants by taking the time to clearly and unemotionally explain what his price is and never criticizes the seller's price, and that's important. He always agrees with the seller that it would be great to get the price they want, but then he explains the reasons why he's pricing their item the way he is (in your case I would go over the current market, 440 vice 426 issue, no aluminum, no acid-dipped doors, wrong wheels, aging resto, etc.) and explain that what you've been seeing for sale. If the closest car you've seen sell was a 426 model for $16,900, then you're going to be at about $14k for a 440 car. Just be like Rick, don't argue but just state your case, and that seems to work well. That's how I got my car for half what the seller was asking for it.

 

[Furyous]

As far as the WOW award.. Well let's just say the guy started with a lie by saying it was restored. It is a resto mod...Two very differnet things and two very different values and market. So I would be hesitant to believe anything else about the car. I have owned and sold well over 300 cars in the past 15 years and In my opinion I would say <15k for it.. But I would have to look it over in person before I would even make an offer..

And the Pawn Star mention above.. The reason Rick gets his price is that the people who come to him is trying to talk him into buying their stuff. If Rick knocked on doors and tried to talk someone into selling something then the shoe would be on the other foot. If you want something and I have it you will have to come my way in order to get it.

 

[Bruzilla]

And the Pawn Star mention above.. The reason Rick gets his price is that the people who come to him is trying to talk him into buying their stuff. If Rick knocked on doors and tried to talk someone into selling something then the shoe would be on the other foot. If you want something and I have it you will have to come my way in order to get it.

And what do you think the seller is doing? If he's got the car for sale, he wants someone to buy it.

As for the my way or highway approach to buying and selling, it doesn't work if your goal is to actually buy or sell something. I've known plenty of guys who have missed out on deals because they were sure the other guy was going to break before they did, and when they didn't they let things get personal. Always a mistake. I saw that a lot at Ford. Some dude would come in and sit with a salesman for an hour and no deal would be made. The guy would talk to a different salesman and they're writing up a contract in no time and for a higher price that the first guy was selling at! And the best salesmen at Ford do exactly what Harrison does... empathy, empathy, and more empathy.

You go in there and start calling him on restos vs restorizing, and building clones, and how he's off his rocker if he thinks he's gonna get $25k, you're not likely to get the deal you want and worse, you'll pay more for whatever deal you end up making. Always better to...

1. State how much you like the car, admire the work that's been done, etc.
2. State how you can see why he would want his asking price for it
3. Start hitting him with all the issues
4. End it by talking about comparative prices
5. Take your car home