Small block stroker or Big block swap???

[popinsmoke]

Hello,

First I would like to thank you for taking the time to read this. Second I would like to apologize if this question has been beat to death in the past.

My car is a 67 Coronet 440 with a 318 2bbl. I would like to ask opinions on the merits of a stroker small block such as the 318/390 or 360/408 versus the 440 swap that seems to be very popular for these cars.

I am looking for about 450rwhp so that the Coronet will as be at least as quick as my brand X daily driver.

Common sense tells me that the 440 will reach my goal much easier but will require engine swap and a transmission change.

I have built a brand x small block 346ci that puts down 443rwhp but the parts and proven combo are a dime a dozen.

What engine combo did you use "heads/cam/compression/induction" high rpm small block screamer or big block swap?

 

[67 B-body]

Well, I like the BIG Blocks myself..... I enjoy the Torque they deliver and that in itself is a huge benefit when building Higher horsepower, because you eventualy start struggling to keep torque at lower RPMs when getting those HP numbers. As you have apparently come to realize, Chevys are cheap and easy to build, and the fact is,,, Mopars are much more expensive overall! This is a struggle for most of us Mopar lovers that we just have to except. Google is my best freind when shopping for parts! I search a part number and let Google give me the results from low to high price! I built my engine for a 1/4 of what I would have paid just buying everything from Summit or Jegs! I also just found this week from Advance auto parts that they have 20% off on any online order! The Holley fuel pump "Black" was something like 60 bucks cheaper after sale and NO shipping!
Bottom line is, You can do it...... You just need to be a Savvy shopper

 

[69clone]

You can get a lot more out of a big block then a small block for the same money.

 

[DesertBilly]

Our coronet is a stroker small block and just decimates the big blocks....it also a good hundred or more pounds of the nose of the car. Yeah they cost more to build but it fun to tell everyone its just a 318 with aluminum heads and then go click off a 11.90 1/4 mile in street trim with a 3.55 gear on pump gas through the mufflers!!!!!

 

[shag766]

there is no replacement for dispalcement and it takes torque to get a bigger car rolling:headbang:

 

[99ss]

cubic inches are cubic inches no matter how you get them.. bigger engines make more power quicker

 

[magnumminded]

As far as big blocks are concerned for a cheaper street a 440 would be good. If money dictates a 400 stroker is good too. As far as small blocks go I would go with a 5.9 Magnum out of late model. They put out as much power and torque as 383 big block but, weigh a lot less. How does around 300 horsepower and 424 torque sound? Plus it already has a roller cam and lighter rotating assembly.

 

[Cranky]

Hello,

First I would like to thank you for taking the time to read this. Second I would like to apologize if this question has been beat to death in the past.

My car is a 67 Coronet 440 with a 318 2bbl. I would like to ask opinions on the merits of a stroker small block such as the 318/390 or 360/408 versus the 440 swap that seems to be very popular for these cars.

I am looking for about 450rwhp so that the Coronet will as be at least as quick as my brand X daily driver.

Common sense tells me that the 440 will reach my goal much easier but will require engine swap and a transmission change.

I have built a brand x small block 346ci that puts down 443rwhp but the parts and proven combo are a dime a dozen.

What engine combo did you use "heads/cam/compression/induction" high rpm small block screamer or big block swap?

What is the main intent for the car and do you already have a 440? Short stroke big blocks like the 383 and the 400 can scream too with the right parts.

You can get a lot more out of a big block then a small block for the same money.

That depends on what you start with and what you do to it.....for example, 340's start out with a high premium just for a block. Machining prices usually run the same on both but some parts for a small block can run higher....

Our coronet is a stroker small block and just decimates the big blocks....it also a good hundred or more pounds of the nose of the car. Yeah they cost more to build but it fun to tell everyone its just a 318 with aluminum heads and then go click off a 11.90 1/4 mile in street trim with a 3.55 gear on pump gas through the mufflers!!!!!

Anyone that has a big block with alloy heads that are not running 11.90's but wants to doesn't have their chit together very well.

there is no replacement for dispalcement and it takes torque to get a bigger car rolling:headbang:

You can get a big car rolling with higher launch rpm's....but that usually adds to the cost of the build.

cubic inches are cubic inches no matter how you get them.. bigger engines make more power quicker

That's not completely true. Smaller light weight components usually will spin up faster than engines with heavier cranks, rods and pistons. The combination of the total build is important in the planning for what engine should be used but there are ways to work around obstacles like having a heavy car and a smaller engine. All you have to do is look at the Competition Eliminator classes or even the slower (11's) Super Stock classes and you will see many heavy cars running fast with small engines. For an example, a buddy has a 56 Chevy shoe box that was running low 11's in SS/O with a 265 cu in engine. Yeah, he has a lot of money in it...especially in the valve train since he wings it 9500 rpm. It all boils down to what the car will be used for....mainly street or mainly drag racing?

 

[popinsmoke]

Thanks for the replies so far keep them coming.

Either way I will be starting with a junkyard engine as I wish to keep the original engine stock and bagged in storage.

I am looking for a hot street car that will see some strip use but mostly a weekend toy for shows and cruise ins at the strip I would like at least 11.90 on pump gas.

I have built several brand x small blocks and know what combination of OEM parts and aftermarket work together for the best bang for the buck within my chosen engine family the ls1.

I am clueless as to this information for mopar I am leaning towards a big block as it is something different then what I normally build.

Can someone point me to a reference guide that I could educate myself on big block mopar.

Things like good block castings to use, factory steel cranks, rod durability etc.

also any reference material to educate myself on the rest of the drive line such as tranny and rear end.

With brand x it has been proven time and time again that by the time you build a set of heads to flow what you need them to feed the amount of power you are looking to build it would have been cheaper to go aftermarket, Does this hold true with Mopar as well?

Again thank you for those of you that take the time to read this.

 

[Cranky]

Either way I will be starting with a junkyard engine as I wish to keep the original engine stock and bagged in storage.

Things like good block castings to use, factory steel cranks, rod durability etc.

also any reference material to educate myself on the rest of the drive line such as tranny and rear end.

With brand x it has been proven time and time again that by the time you build a set of heads to flow what you need them to feed the amount of power you are looking to build it would have been cheaper to go aftermarket, Does this hold true with Mopar as well?

As for the keeping the 318....if you have the room to do so and it's a good running engine but the value of keeping the original engine in order to maintain a numbers matching car, well, the teen powered cars usually bring more money with upgraded engines so it doesn't really matter. I would move it on because of the space I don't have.

As for a good block to use as a base? The 400 has the largest factory bore and usually have more meat around the main webs. A popular modification is to stick in a 440 crank to get 451 cubes. The shorter deck height means more stable cylinder walls too. I like short stroke engines myself and would keep it as a stock stroke motor but use a 383 steel crank. Later model big block engines came with cast cranks but even Mom's cast cranks are a pretty good piece and they are lighter. My next build is going to be a stock stroke 400 using 440 length rods and will use a forged crank since I'm heading for 7500+ shift points. Long rod short stroke motors work pretty good. Rear ends...the 8 3/4 is a very durable axle but it doesn't have the support market like the 9" does. Imo, a 9" isn't any better in stock form but it has all kinds of aftermarket support plus gear ratios out the wazoo. If you plan on hitting it with a ton of HP in a heavy car, there's always the Dana 60 which usually runs no more than 50 lbs heavier and yup, if you want a good set of heads for the money, go aftermarket. The Eddy RPM heads are more than adequate for a healthy street engine but there is a good selection of aftermarket heads out there nowadays.

 

[shag766]

the biggest bang for the buck in any brand motor is in the heads and cam. then its the money for the good componets in the bottom end to handle what you are capable of producing. there are some guys on here that know the trick stock MP parts that hold up.

 

[popinsmoke]

Agreed heads and cam make the engine, I just don't know the recipes for Mopars flow numbers for the induction side or durability of the bottom end.

And books you guys can steer me to that will explain the OEM gear?

 

[99ss]

heads and cam might make an engine but trying getting 540 ft pounds of tq at the rear tires with a 318 at 4400 rpms.... there is no substitution for displacement.. well maybe a blower or turbo...LOL
yes the power is made in the heads but the smaller the engine the more the rpm to make the power.. this means more money in the valvetrain and more wear and tear on the engine as a whole... bigger cubes makes power a lot quicker in the rpms ..... its better to have more power at lower rpms than more power at higher rpms.. simple as that

 

[duster731]

sb 360 stroker can easily do 11s with the right set up

 

[99ss]

LOL thats not the point........ less rpms are more reliable simple as that