Starting Problem need help

[frank]

I have a problem that maybe someone can help me with.
The 69RR 4speed will not start unless I put the car in gear push it back and forth then it will start. Also if I try to start it in gear it will jolt forward then start. Someone said that maybe the starter and celinord teeth are sitting on top of each other and moving the car in gear resets them into place.

When I try to start it all it does is click then I have go through the process I just mentioned.

 

[WAYNES WORLD]

Sounds like the starter is sticking. Pull it and check the gears and also check the teeth on the flywheel. You may also try removing the starter and bench test to see what the bendix drive is doing when the starter cranks. It may not be returning back. This could be why you need to wiggle the car to free up the gear.
Wayne

 

[Pops1967GTX]

Bench testing a starter

[video]http://www.thefoat.com/APSRacingUSA/video/video_id-2491/How+to+bench+test+a+starter/[/video]

 

[frank]

Outstanding I'll follow your lead.

 

[frank]

Starting/Starter Problem
I’ve finely had a chance to replace the starter in my 69RR (4sp, 383). The original problem was, when I tried to start the car I would hear ticking or clicking, then I would rock the car in gear and it would turnover. I just changed out the starter (what a bitch doing it) and I have the same problem.
I’m open for suggestions and need to get the resolved.
Frank, From Delaware

 

[mopar12372]

check the starter relay on the fire wall make sure its getting full voltage in start position . if its no good make sure you buy a good part dont go cheap. did you buy a rebuilt starter ?( if so they are JUNK). INSTALL A MINI STARTER from a 97-99 v8 mopar truck . when the engine cranks over does it sound like its struggling /craking banging sound slow raugh raugh rough or a fast raugh raugh . checking the charging voltage of the alternater and battery reserve . check all conections any sign of green stuff cut up about a /12 to 1 inch . it grows and climbs up the cables ---> replace cables (dont clean waste of time). check for loose conections /starter too close to flywheel

 

[WP29440SE]

make sure the starter relay is GROUNDED to the fender apron , metal on metal

you should have this type of relay which is grounded through the case to the body

 

[miller]

When you replaced the starter, did you also change the starter solenoid, or use the old one?
It's been a long time, but I remember a large copper contact washer being in there, that after time would get burnt, and could even stick. After starting, that washer retracts (that contact is what kicks the starter gear to the flywheel), and if it stops on a burnt spot, you get the clicking sounds.
One fix we used to do is simply flip that copper washer over...and use the new surface.

 

[frank]

Miller

Is the starter solenoid connected to the starter, meaning do I need to pull the starter again?

 

[Pops1967GTX]

Frank need more information on problem.... Have you inspected flywheel teeth for damage or wear? Does the starter bendix engage into the flywheel?

Check stater for propper clearance, some times its too tight & needs shims to be added......

 

[miller]

Miller

Is the starter solenoid connected to the starter, meaning do I need to pull the starter again?

Again, Frank, been awhile. It might be tight to get to, the solenoid is mounted on the top of the starter, where your positive cable hooks up from the starter relay. Should be two hook-ups (wire) at the solenoid. Sometimes you can get to it, otherwise, yes, you'll have to pull the starter to get to it. Of course, unhook your positive cable from the bat first.
And, like Pops says, if you pull the starter, look your ring gear over good. Could be worn, or even missing teeth.

 

[WP29440SE]

When you replaced the starter, did you also change the starter solenoid, or use the old one?
It's been a long time, but I remember a large copper contact washer being in there, that after time would get burnt, and could even stick. After starting, that washer retracts (that contact is what kicks the starter gear to the flywheel), and if it stops on a burnt spot, you get the clicking sounds.
One fix we used to do is simply flip that copper washer over...and use the new surface.

the solenoid and starter are one unit, you don't get a "new starter" and old solenoid. a new starter includes a refurbished or new solenoid together.

sounds to me like a starter relay/ bad ground or connection issue, but what do I know

 

[A383Wing]

I have had this same issue years ago...was bad battery cable connection at battery

 

[miller]

What I'm talking about is in here-
http://www.allpar.com/history/mopar/electrical3-starters.html

Sure, could be a bad battery cable, relay, or wire. But, just because something is so-called rebuilt, doesn't mean it was done right. But, who knows, starter could be fine.

 

[mopar505]

try jumping it out at the relay, make sure its in neutral and see what happens ? the fact that you have to rock it back and fourth is odd, but may be engagement issues to the flywheel?

 

[dvw]

Frank need more information on problem.... Have you inspected flywheel teeth for damage or wear? Does the starter bendix engage into the flywheel?

Check stater for propper clearance, some times its too tight & needs shims to be added......

Shim a Mopar starter??????????? I don't think so

 

[miller]

That's one classy looking car, Frank!
Hopefully, maybe you've gotten some kind of clue what's going on.

Maybe some help...as already said by a few here, you having to rock the car back and forth is a sure sign of starter to ring gear. I'm not too familiar with standard trans, but if the starter is still bolted up, is there an access hole/cover on the bell housing you can open up? The flywheel that the starter engages with is just attached with welds (I think), and just look it over to be sure all is okay.
The (overhauled) starter...could be wiring, worn armature brushes, shorted armature, sticking solenoid...you get the picture. One other thing could be not getting enough juice to the starter. But, that doesn't answer the rocking bit.

Good luck with it.

 

[AMX364]

Of course you also checked the ground cable and block to frame grounds, right? A freshly painted block might not ground thru the paint very well.

 

[dvw]

Get a voltmeter and do a voltge drop test. Test the ground. one meter lead to the battery negative, the other to the starter case. Have someone hold the key in the crank posistion. The voltage reading registered on the meter is the amount of loss in the ground circuit. Anything over 1 volt, repair it. Now the positive side. positive battery to starter stud. Same scenario. Don't forget to test the solenoid feed wire from the posistive battery to the solenoid the same way. You'll know if you have a wiring issue.
Doug