1970 Plymouth dash dead/looking for modern replacement gauges

[johneich]

Really nice work. I know how much work it is removing the old pan. Did you fab the subframe or buy the parts?

Bought all the parts, another funny story, kind of, because of the crazy metal shortages/supply chain issues during 2021/2022 one rail is an AMD the other is a Sherman (Suprisingly both appeard to be of equal quality). The right trunk pan is a long one that was cut down as the length was not needed the left is a short one, see pics. It was tough to keep this moving forward, waiting months at times for parts to come in. (Thought to self, if there was such a metal shortage, why did scrap metal prices stay so low?)

 

[moparedtn]

I searched this forum and have my factory manuals, I have not found an answer to my question(s). My dash is dead and dash pad is bad, So i will have to pull the whole thing.

My question, what is a good/great aftermarket gauge package? I know the original gauges can/are really out of wack and a lot of work to get right. I am not looking for factory nut and bolt correct, but I want it kind of close. It really must have space for a Tick Tock Tach also, so a different dash? (I do not currently have a Tick Tock dash). I assume a real dash with a Tick Tock is near unavailable/super expensive. Is there a mod. to get a Tick Tock in a non Tick Tock dash?

Just out of paint, the whole interior is stripped so now/soon is my decision frame.

I should say I am retired and on a little bit of a budget, but not stupid cheap.

The picture is dark and looks worse than it is, it looks rusty but it is not but it shows the bad dash pad and my gauge cluster.

It runs and drives with a flip switch and a momentary button, key only takes it out of park and to drive/reverse.

Most everything under the hood is new. The A/C was removed long before I had this car, (A/C parts still under dash and presumed to be of no value, I would like to add aftermarket A/C in the future) heater core has been bypassed. Car has sat since 1981.

Been a 2 year project so far. Been home for 2 days now, some of the happiest 2 days in this 53 year old dream!

This is the Way! May the Force be with you!

John

View attachment 1434534

You've got the same instrument panel pretty much as I do in my '68 GTX.
It's not that difficult to remove the cluster (plenty of threads to help with this on here).
I took mine out, set it up on the work bench and used the car battery to power up a
pair of test leads to go through all the circuits in the cluster, one by one.

In short order, I had most everything working again and was able to SEE it all work
before I put it back in the car.
Once you've got it out on the bench, it's really simple to see how it all works.

One recommendation I do have is to fetch the electronic instrument regulator available
out there and get rid of the old "points style" one on there currently.
Cheap insurance, really.

 

[vance.dykes]

intellatronx build your own dash

 

[johneich]

You need to do what works for you! You are the one working on it so make it so you can enjoy it without pulling your hair out in the process. I was under the impression that the Dakota unit was around double the price @ $1800. A plus is the sending units and the the color you want the gauges to be. Best of luck on your project.

FYI, Dakota has them at $1,100.00 for the one in the link above and others at $1,800.00 for B-Bodies, just spent time looking at all of them.

 

[Photon440]

Bought all the parts, another funny story, kind of, because of the crazy metal shortages/supply chain issues during 2021/2022 one rail is an AMD the other is a Sherman (Suprisingly both appeard to be of equal quality). The right trunk pan is a long one that was cut down as the length was not needed the left is a short one, see pics. It was tough to keep this moving forward, waiting months at times for parts to come in. (Thought to self, if there was such a metal shortage, why did scrap metal prices stay so low?)

The reason scrap metal prices stayed low is the same reason there was a metal shortage; mills were shut down. It wasn't a raw material problem.

 

[fj5gtx]

If you really want a tictoc, find a complete rallye dash (not just cluster) with a blank or a clock, and buy a repro tach to replace the blank or clock. Or send your cluster out to be tested and repaired, and add a aftermarket tach to the steering column. If yours is an AT car, don't really need a tach though.

If it were me, I'd just repair what I have.

 

[johneich]

Really nice work. I know how much work it is removing the old pan. Did you fab the subframe or buy the parts?

I had a shop do all the work so far, bought almost all parts from Summit or Jegs. I found their prices to usually be a bit less than elsewhere plus buy $100 or $200 and get free shipping. I like the Summit search feature much better than Jegs for my specific car, so Summit was alway my go to place. I remember Josh's, Detroit Muscle and another place in the south east, probably a few more I used. Beware if an item is shown as backordered for a month or two, often that deadline comes and goes only to be much extended.

 

[pnora]

I had a shop do all the work so far, bought almost all parts from Summit or Jegs. I found their prices to usually be a bit less than elsewhere plus buy $100 or $200 and get free shipping. I like the Summit search feature much better than Jegs for my specific car, so Summit was alway my go to place. I remember Josh's, Detroit Muscle and another place in the south east, probably a few more I used. Beware if an item is shown as backordered for a month or two, often that deadline comes and goes only to be much extended.

I found Jamie at Mega Parts to be reliable and decent on prices. Bought a lot from them.

 

[Ghostrider]

The only downside to the Dakota Dash option currently is the 24-28 week wait time on orders! I've been looking at the RTX or HDX 68 for my 70 Super Bee but can't find anyone with one actually in stock.

 

[pnora]

The only downside to the Dakota Dash option currently is the 24-28 week wait time on orders! I've been looking at the RTX or HDX 68 for my 70 Super Bee but can't find anyone with one actually in stock.

The one the Poster here needs Summit had 2 in stock.

 

[biomedtechguy]

Dakota Digital all the way.
Three or more options for you.
The least costly option of 3 choices of complete systems is the direct replacement unit already linked.
Part # VHX68DSTDK(B/W/R)
 Note: the (B/W/R) is the needle pointer colors, like Blue/White, Red/White, etc. That color changes with the lights on or off, and also pay attention to the backlight color when you turn the headlights on. The colors you choose with that model are all you have, they are NOT changeable or programmable!
I chose the RED backlight, because red light has NO diminishing effect on night vision.
Some of the next models are programmable. Having said that, when I got the VHX Rallye Guage unit, that I was ready to install BUT DD came out with a brand new game changing option, the RTX series, and once I studied the details of the RTX I knew I absolutely HAD to have that one.
DD guage systems means ALL NEW sensors, senders, wiring, made to fit as direct replacement for the factory sensors/senders.
ONE data cable (RJ-45) like a computer modem "phone like" connection to the one piece gauge cluster.
The "main module" that the one data cable runs from is what you run all of the sensor/sender wires to, and positioning of that module is flexible, just make sure the data cable will reach the gauge cluster. This makes all of the wires you have to run to it easier, since you can put it in so many different places.
The next option is to either switch over from the "rectangle" to what I think is the much better looking Rallye style gauges, if that is possible for you to do.
The VHX68DCHGK(B/W/R) is the same option as the first, but Rallye style.
I don't know much about the HDX model, because I climbed straight to the TOP and sold my BNIB VHX gauge system and got the amazing RTX setup. They do make a RTX rectangular gauge system that would give you all of its myriad of programmable options and the capabilities of having so much data displayed in the LED display integrated into the cluster, but it may not justify another $700 above the VHX model.
Here's a link to a Summit page just so you can see all of your options. You will need the factory bezel frame for all of them.
1970 PLYMOUTH ROAD RUNNER Gauge Kits and Instrument Clusters Parts & Accessories | Summit Racing

 

[johneich]

Dakota Digital all the way.
Three or more options for you.
The least costly option of 3 choices of complete systems is the direct replacement unit already linked.
Part # VHX68DSTDK(B/W/R)
 

Thank you very much for the wealth of information, I have decided on a Dakota or a whole drop in dash as my dash pad is cracked. If I just do a Dakota do I still have to pull the windshield?

 

[pnora]

Thank you very much for the wealth of information, I have decided on a Dakota or a whole drop in dash as my dash pad is cracked. If I just do a Dakota do I still have to pull the windshield?

No. Dash frame can stay on place. If you need to pull the complete dash frame out the windshield needs to be removed.

 

[johneich]

I would like to get back to my dead dash. (I have no electricity anywhere in the car, I do have a flip switch to the hot side of the coil and a push button starter so it runs) On page 8-133 of the Plymouth shop manual I see a wire from the battery labeled A1A10R going to a 4 wire block which I think is the starter relay. I think I found this block in the center of the drivers side of the firewall. A wire off the "G" tang goes through a grommet to instrument panel, but i can not find this wire under the dash. (Another wire off of "G" goes to the windshield wiper motor, I am not worried about this one right now) There is a wire off of an unlabeled "tang" going to a block labeled VXUXTYSZ and two wires coming off the "B" tang to 2 fusible links.

On Fig. 29 on page 8-147 I see Battery at the bottom near middle-left and on Fig. 30 page8-148, near the top left I see a wire going through a grommet to engine compartment.

I am not good at electronics and may be in over my head but I would like to figure this out, I think I am on the right track? But what is/are my next step(s)?

It would be real nice if I could only get oil pressure, temp. turn and brake lights for right now. I have an after market gauge that reads full right on power up and zero with engine running. The sender tests zero ohms top tang to ground even to battery negative but I get the same zero ohm result on another car with a known good working gauge, so I am lost here too. I mover the new oil gauge to the known good car and it acts the same way. I have an aftermarket temp. gauge I am going to tackle after oil gauge.

I suppose checking the fusible links for continuity would be a good place to start? I had to give up for today, 38F degrees here in the midwest-midsouth. I just buttoned Her up for the night, easy way to ID the fusible links, pic?

John

 

[johneich]

No. Dash frame can stay on place. If you need to pull the complete dash frame out the windshield needs to be removed.

Now I am almost fully titled towards the Dakota, are you saying the light colors have to be pick out at purchase? I am not expecting much help from the Summit phone people on that. (I am not picking on them, they are nice and mostly helpful)

 

[pnora]

Now I am almost fully titled towards the Dakota, are you saying the light colors have to be pick out at purchase? I am not expecting much help from the Summit phone people on that. (I am not picking on them, they are nice and mostly helpful)

That I am not sure of.

 

[pnora]

The more I read and what I see you should call Dakota and verify. The more expensive RTX allows changes in color as well as using a phone App. The base does not come with the phone App option. It also looks like the lighting is white. However they show red and blue but I believe you have to order it that way or it is factory programmed that way. It all comes down to the Benjamin's.

 

[biomedtechguy]

the light colors have to be pick out at purchase?

On the VHX model, YES, the needle and backlight colors must be selected at purchase.
I had a VHX Rallye guage unit for my 70 Roadrunner that I had bought from a dealer for around $930 brand new. He cut me a GREAT deal, and while it was going to be several years at that time before I'd be ready to install it, there was NO QUESTION about what I was going to have installed...
So the BIG MOMENT finally arrived, my Roadrunner was going in the shop for a few months and a MAJOR systems upgrade (like 2/3rds of what is in my signature) and I even brought the VHX setup to the shop along with the PILES of other gear I was getting installed...
BUT
I see an article on the
"JUST RELEASED! Dakota Digital announces the Brand New RTX System with features and capabilities like NEVER before" and I dig in, reading up on all the amazing capabilities it has, and trying to see what, if anything, would really actually matter in my application. There are a few things that really stood out for my use:
The "remote dashboard" feature that allows different selectable readings to show on a smartphone or tablet. In my case, I bought 2 of the add on modules that transmit AIR/FUEL RATIO for my dual wideband O2 sensor system, and that allows me to see the A/F R for the left or right bank of my engine while I'm under the hood tweaking the 6bbl!
The electronic sweep of the Tic Tok Tach is pretty darn awesome, and when you look at just the painted gauges, they look almost 100% like the factory gauges!! Electronic warning sounds for parameters you set, like over/under oil pressure, low fuel, high temperature, low voltage...
It's freaking AWESOME!
I don't want you to miss the importance of how I had bought the VHX setup a few years before I'd need it. It means that if not for the extreme upgrade of real, usable features of the RTX setup, I was absolutely thrilled with the VHX unit, and I believe most people are, and you will be too.
I highly recommend the RED lighting, because as I stated, it does not diminish your night vision!