833 Rebuild Question/Problem

[Joel Talka]

Hi All;

I did get my 1966 833 rebuilt and all put back together, but I think I have a problem and am looking for some advice.

Actually shifting.. I installed the old shifter set up. The tranny will shift 3rd and 4th with no problem but shifting into 1st or into 2nd is really hard and takes a bit of coaxing..for some reason that 1-2 slider does not want to slide...

If I remove the cover, I can move the 3-4 slider easily by hand. The 1-2 slider will not move, I need to pry it while turning the input shaft to get it to engage either gear... not an easy process. This can't be normal..

I'm enclosing some pictures. When I did the overhaul, it was the two 307 bearings, new needle rollers, new synchros and seals and gaskets.. nothing else was changed. The cases were glass beaded and flushed with brake cleaner. I've oiled everything inside the case..

Any thoughts?

Joel

 

[steve340]

If it will not shift smoothly/easily with the side cover off it may be best to pull it apart again.

 

[AR67GTX]

I’m a little ignorant of 833s but have rebuilt a Muncie and a Toploader. But guess i would be a little suspicious of the install of the keys and retainer springs on the slider hub and go back and double check their orientation and positioning. Are the slider and hubs and keys for 1/2 and 3/4 the same or are they specific to position?

 

[fourgearsavoy]

The hubs and sliders are specific and you wouldn't be able to assemble it if they were in the wrong position. The strut keys and springs are universal. You do need to clock the springs properly or it will bind. If your hub and slider are worn out they will bind up as well. The later model syncro assemblies shift smoother than the early units if you need to replace your 1-2 unit.

Gus

 

[Outsider]

Agree with above. The sliders (clutch sleeves) for 1-2 and 3-4 should slide with the same effort. Pull apart and check the three keys (struts) and their springs. Other than that look for burs on the hub (clutch gear).

 

[Joel Talka]

Agree with above. The sliders (clutch sleeves) for 1-2 and 3-4 should slide with the same effort. Pull apart and check the three keys (struts) and their springs. Other than that look for burs on the hub (clutch gear).

Thanks for the reply... I did some more digging yesterday with the unit. You know, this is the first one of these I have ever worked on and probably should have taken pictures of the disassembly... Anyway, I reinstalled the old Hurst shifter and went from there. Finally figured out that I had the two slider forks reversed!! The odd shaped one sits on the 1-2 slider to give clearance to reverse.. (Duh!) There may have also been a burr in there but now 1-2 and 3-4 work equally well. I can run it through the gears just fine.. Remaining problem is I can't get it into reverse with the cover on......cover off, it slides right over. Cover on only part way.. I found some pictures of an assembled cover inside with the levers in place...maybe I screwed that up as well.. Anyway more digging today..getting closer.

 

[steve340]

The cover has aligning bolts in a couple of positions - you can see they are drilled so the longer shoulder on the bolt aligns the cover to the gearbox case. If the cover is not in the right position jams the lever as you go in to reverse.
If you haven't got the special bolts try holding the side cover UP as you tighten the fasteners.

 

[Joel Talka]

The cover has aligning bolts in a couple of positions - you can see they are drilled so the longer shoulder on the bolt aligns the cover to the gearbox case. If the cover is not in the right position jams the lever as you go in to reverse.
If you haven't got the special bolts try holding the side cover UP as you tighten the fasteners.

Ahh.. I see that there are "special" bolts with shoulders that fill the cover holes when tightened. All the shorter bolts have the shoulders. There are also two longer bolts as you mentioned unfortunately they do not have the shoulders...

I'll track that down today. I usually mount the cover with the tranny on its side but I will check this out..

Thanks!!

 

[fourgearsavoy]

Ahh.. I see that there are "special" bolts with shoulders that fill the cover holes when tightened. All the shorter bolts have the shoulders. There are also two longer bolts as you mentioned unfortunately they do not have the shoulders...

I'll track that down today. I usually mount the cover with the tranny on its side but I will check this out..

Thanks!!

Get all the bolts snug then tap the side cover upwards then torque them. If you have one with longer shoulder than the rest it goes on the rear row in the middle even with the BU light switch.

 

[Joel Talka]

I've got it!! That 833 is pretty amazing actually. After I got the slider forks where they are suppose to be, I did what you folks said regarding the cover. What I finally realized is that 1-2 cam inside the cover interacts with the reverse mechanism more or less to prevent 1st and reverse from engaging at the same time; 1-2 will get pushed to a neutral position when reverse is activated.. Anyway, I greased everything and put the cover back on and everything works... Now all I need is a motor and I can get this car back on the road.

Thank you all for great advice!!!
Joel