Amp meter

[Turbobus]

In the original Dodge service manual, top of page 8-135 instrument panel wiring coronet, charger (rally cluster), on the amp meter there are arrows pointing to the two wires a1-12r and r6a-12bk stating “not used on 60-65 or 100 amp alternators”
Anyone know why? Too many amps for the gauge maybe? Thanks

 

[Nacho-RT74]

Is related to the wiring bypassing the bulkhead and going through the firewall with a grommet and more resistant terminals attached to the wiring than the Packard 56/58 terminals the bulkhead got, not the gauge itself

12 gauge wire os the regular size used with standard alts going through the bulkhead.

heavy duty alts used 10 gauge going through the firewall. Diagrams shows those too on discontinued line through the diagram.

there are several ways to make the same job though. This has been discussed several times lately. Sometimes being hardcore discussions.

 

[Turbobus]

Is related to the wiring bypassing the bulkhead and going through the firewall with a grommet and more resistant terminals attached to the wiring than the Packard 56/58 terminals the bulkhead got, not the gauge itself

12 gauge wire os the regular size used with standard alts going through the bulkhead.

heavy duty alts used 10 gauge going through the firewall. Diagrams shows those too on discontinued line through the diagram.

there are several ways to make the same job though. This has been discussed several times lately. Sometimes being hardcore discussions.

When it comes to electricity, I make a darn good plumber! Thank you very much!

 

[kiwigtx]

When it comes to electricity, I make a darn good plumber! Thank you very much!

 

[72RoadrunnerGTX]

As mentioned, it refers the factory bulkhead by-pass, commonly referred to as the factory “Fleet” by-pass as it is mostly found in fleet production (Police/Taxi) with a high output factory alternator. The matching engine compartment diagram is on page 8-128 in the ’73 Dodge manual. The original dash harness ammeter leads were to be cut and taped off with the factory by-pass. By the mid to late seventies the factory was quite aware of the weakness in the charging system design at the bulkhead connector. Especially on C-bodies (there were bulkhead by-pass recalls) and other high optioned cars running more electrical loads.

Agreed, plenty of discussions about the ammeter/charging systems here, do a search.

 

[Nacho-RT74]

yeap, but is interesting how 71 and 73 diagrams shows somehow diff ways to make it.

73 with the splice into the R6A line to still going throught the bulkhead ( with a fulse link too ) to feed the main splice ( edited diagram to show that ), while 71 diagram is more "simple" and a bit of lack of info on diagram

 

[66Satellite47]

It seems Mopar and electrons have long been at odds.

 

[Sixpactogo]

The statement "not used on 60-65" more than likely pertains to those cars having idiot lights instead of gauges.

 

[72RoadrunnerGTX]

The statement "not used on 60-65" more than likely pertains to those cars having idiot lights instead of gauges.

“Not used with 60-65 or 100 amp alternators” refers to not using the dash harness ammeter leads ("cut & tape" on the engine compartment diagram), using only larger wires to by-pass the bulkhead connections for vehicles having a 60,65, or 100 amp alternator from the factory. The fleet by-pass would still use an ammeter as indicated in the diagrams but an internally shunted ammeter scaled/ranged to +/- 80 amps. No charging system idiot lights on Chrysler products from this time period.

 

[Nacho-RT74]

There is no idiot light substitute for the ammeter of voltimeter. When idiot light was used to know the charging status was just to know the alt was working or not, but was way later on Mopars.

 

[RJRENTON]

“Not used with 60-65 or 100 amp alternators” refers to not using the dash harness ammeter leads (cut & tape on the engine compartment diagram), using only larger wires to by-pass the bulkhead connections for vehicles having a 60,65, or 100 amp alternator from the factory. The fleet by-pass would still use an ammeter as indicated in the diagrams but an internally shunted ammeter scaled/ranged to +/- 80 amps. No charging system idiot lights on Chrysler products from this time period.
View attachment 1355132
View attachment 1355133View attachment 1355134

Excellent presentation and illustrations especially the ammeter shunt.
BOB RENTON

 

[Sixpactogo]

Here is proof idiot lights were used in 1960.
My 1960 Dart Phoenix with a generator. No amp gauge or volt meter. Idiot lights for both Oil and Amps.

 

[Nacho-RT74]

oh! Cool! Interesting.

however how true is that it read amps and is not just a pilot light to confirm just if the generator/alternator is in working order?

 

[Sixpactogo]

I'm sure that is all it does is verify the generator is doing it's job of putting out amps unless the light is on. Same with the oil light. It won't come on until the oil pressure goes below 3 psi. Neither one are ideal IMO. I was only pointing out the fact that they existed back then.

 

[RJRENTON]

I'm sure that is all it does is verify the generator is doing it's job of putting out amps unless the light is on. Same with the oil light. It won't come on until the oil pressure goes below 3 psi. Neither one are ideal IMO. I was only point out the fact that they existed back then.

On a generator system, the voltage regulator has 3 relays: voltage regulator thst controls field excitation voltage; current regulator that controls maximum generator output; and the cut out relay which disconnects the generator from the battery upon engine shut down. The idiot light provides the initial current to the generator so it can begin charging and is extinguished when the cut out relay closes connecting the generator to the battery. Just talking out loud......
BOB RENTON

 

[72RoadrunnerGTX]

Here is proof idiot lights were used in 1960.
My 1960 Dart Phoenix with a generator. No amp gauge or volt meter. Idiot lights for both Oil and Amps.

Nobody indicated idiot lights never existed with older Chrysler generator-based charging systems from a previous “time period” than what is being discussed here. Chrysler alternator-based charging systems used ammeters, no idiot lights, again, from this time period. Some brand “X” alternator charging systems that had idiot lights around this same time period. Cool dash BTW

 

[Sixpactogo]

Nobody indicated idiot lights never existed with older Chrysler generator-based charging systems from a previous “time period” than what is being discussed here. Chrysler alternator-based charging systems used ammeters, no idiot lights, again, from this time period. Some brand “X” alternator charging systems had idiot lights. Cool dash BTW

Sorry..........My response was directed at post #10. I was just explaining my red X

 

[Nacho-RT74]

So it actually is kinda (kinda of, not exactly thought) the typical idiot lights on later alternator systems, where the light is grounded when alt is not working making it light on ( what doesn’t mean is charging the batt still being off)

I don’t get why call AMP to the light then, when it should be called simply ALT being a warning call about its working order. Is like the ammeter, when began to be called ALTERNATOR when if not called simply AMMETER should be actually called BATTERY, since the ammeter by its location on network actually reads the batt status ( aside an alternator never gets ”discharge” being is not an accumulator LOL).

just thinking out loud. Nothing really important to the thread.

 

[RJRENTON]

Nobody indicated idiot lights never existed with older Chrysler generator-based charging systems from a previous “time period” than what is being discussed here. Chrysler alternator-based charging systems used ammeters, no idiot lights, again, from this time period. Some brand “X” alternator charging systems had idiot lights. Cool dash BTW

EARLY GM alternators, circa 1963, used a mechanical voltage regulator and a field relay, in one package for initial rotor voltage supply circuit that used the GEN idiot light to supply the rotor power and GEN light, that when the field relay closed, turned off the GEN lamp and supplied power to the rotor. Later this was replaced by the diode trio and internal regulator.
BOB RENTON

 

[Turbobus]

Is related to the wiring bypassing the bulkhead and going through the firewall with a grommet and more resistant terminals attached to the wiring than the Packard 56/58 terminals the bulkhead got, not the gauge itself

12 gauge wire os the regular size used with standard alts going through the bulkhead.

heavy duty alts used 10 gauge going through the firewall. Diagrams shows those too on discontinued line through the diagram.

there are several ways to make the same job though. This has been discussed several times lately. Sometimes being hardcore discussions.

Thanks!