B body rear end/third member question ?

[pearljam724]

If you have to have the pedal to the floor to go faster than 60 mph, you either have some very steep gears or some really short rear tires. I'm ok cruising down the highway at 3K in my non overdrive cars.

I live at the bottom of a mountain range. I have a lot of gradual, steep inclines on a lot of these interstate stretches. This is where, I have to hold the pedal to the floor to reach and hope to maintain 70. During these times, every modern car around me is practically cruising at 70. In this instance, it would have to be pedal to the floor to keep from getting run over. My area is very mountainous, but can be relatively flat depending where I am. A lot of steep, gradual inclines that take a lot of pedal to maintain that kind of speed. But, with modern cars. It’s a walk in the park. Cars have changed dramatically in reference to this topic.

 

[oldbee]

I live at the bottom of a mountain range. I have a lot of gradual, steep inclines on a lot of these interstate stretches. This is where, I have to hold the pedal to the floor to reach and hope to maintain 70. During these times, every modern car around me is practically cruising at 70. In this instance, it would have to be pedal to the floor to keep from getting run over. My area is very mountainous, but can be relatively flat depending where I am. A lot of steep, gradual inclines that take a lot of pedal to maintain that kind of speed. But, with modern cars. It’s a walk in the park. Cars have changed dramatically in reference to this topic.

Ur correct, but I’ll also bet you go a lot further up the hill in high gear! These mini motors are probably downshifting at least twice.

 

[pearljam724]

Ur correct, but I’ll also bet you go a lot further up the hill in high gear! These mini motors are probably downshifting at least twice.

B bodies are extremely quick downhill. This is when, I blow their doors off, ha ha !

 

[pearljam724]

I crawled under the car tonight, I have a 2.94 I wonder if there’s a big difference between it and a 2.76 ? I wouldn’t think so ?

 

[Fran Blacker]

It will make your hill climbing worse. What's your obsession with 2. what ever gears it may drop your 60mph rpm's 100 or so. Remove your oil leaky intake number one.

 

[pearljam724]

I know it’s going to be worst hill climbing. I’m considering the highest gear ratio for fuel mileage and comfort. Several reasons. You can always drop a gear when driving up hill by down shifting. You can’t shift any higher when there’s no other higher gears to be had. I don’t live in Kansas or Florida. I have every driving condition imaginable. So with that in mind. I prefer the highest gearing possible for flat ground.
I know, it’s not typical because most people want lower gearing for burnouts, torque, etc. That’s not me.

 

[Fran Blacker]

I know it’s going to be worst hill clumping. I’m considering the highest gear ratio for fuel mileage and comfort. Several reasons. You can always drop a gear when driving up hill by down shifting. You can’t shift any higher when there’s no other higher gears to be had. I don’t live in Kansas or Florida. I have every driving condition imaginable. So with that in mind. I prefer the highest gearing possible for flat ground.
I know, it’s not typical because most people want lower gearing for burnouts, torque, etc. That’s not me.

There is a point of diminishing returns.

 

[PurpleBeeper]

I live at the bottom of a mountain range. I have a lot of gradual, steep inclines on a lot of these interstate stretches. This is where, I have to hold the pedal to the floor to reach and hope to maintain 70. During these times, every modern car around me is practically cruising at 70. In this instance, it would have to be pedal to the floor to keep from getting run over. My area is very mountainous, but can be relatively flat depending where I am. A lot of steep, gradual inclines that take a lot of pedal to maintain that kind of speed. But, with modern cars. It’s a walk in the park. Cars have changed dramatically in reference to this topic.

Well Pearljam, being a "flat lander" I COMPLETELY misunderstood your issue.....you're right...you need a higher number gear ratio for sure, no transmission problem, just gear. 3.91/4.10 the engine will zip up a hill, but be screaming up or down hill at 70mph. I think 2.76/2.94 and you're peddling up hill on your 10-speed staring in 10th gear...no Bueno. That leaves you with 3.23/3.55 (for stock ratios anyway) and either of those should be just fine.

Have you ever thought about pulling that automatic down in to 2nd gear up those hills? Seriously....with your gear you won't over-rev the engine

 

[pearljam724]

Well Pearljam, being a "flat lander" I COMPLETELY misunderstood your issue.....you're right...you need a higher number gear ratio for sure, no transmission problem, just gear. 3.91/4.10 the engine will zip up a hill, but be screaming up or down hill at 70mph. I think 2.76/2.94 and you're peddling up hill on your 10-speed staring in 10th gear...no Bueno. That leaves you with 3.23/3.55 (for stock ratios anyway) and either of those should be just fine.

Have you ever thought about pulling that automatic down in to 2nd gear up those hills? Seriously....with your gear you won't over-rev the engine

Thank you. It’s easy to misunderstand depending on road speeds and inclines. 60-70mph isn’t possible in 2nd gear. It would drop me down to about 45-50 mph. I wouldn’t care, if it wasn’t on a 3 lane interstate with heavy traffic.
I have the 3rd member off as we speak to replace U-Joints and a tiny leak at 3rd member. Now is a great time to ask questions. Perhaps I can get a hold of a 2.76 or 3.23 at a reasonable price.
I understand and I’m not completely concerned with rpms. I’m pretty sure, a problem I have is the tranny doesn’t kick down. This seriously affects trying to maintain 60-70 once I hit a incline. I tried everything. I know for a fact the kick down is adjusted properly. I fined tuned it a dozen times and it still doesn’t kick down. Adjusted pump inside the tranny, still no kick down. Properly adjusted both bands, still no kick down.
Tranny will automatically shift gears while in 2nd on occasions. But, it never shifts gears automatically while in drive. So, with that being said. It may not be automatically shifting in Drive to a higher gear, like Overdrive when I need it on flat ground. I’m not sure if these older Torqueflites are supposed to automatically shift while in Drive like modern transmissions do ? That might be part of the problem. Perhaps my governor isn’t working properly and if that’s the case, I don’t know how to fix that. Maybe that’s why it’s not kicking down too ?
I can hold pedal to floor at 60 mph for 6 or 7 seconds and it still doesn’t kick down. So, in this instance. I just maintain 60 uphill until I hit flat ground. Adjustment is definitely not the issue. I’ve learned a lot about kick down adjustment, band adjustment, etc. But, I don’t know how to test or fix a governor. Or how to diagnose a governor. All of this comes into play, needing all of these factors when you live somewhere with many drastic driving condition changes as I do. If I stay around home, it’s mostly flat. I often travel the mountains, it’s a lot of steep and long inclines with flats in between. I want the highest gearing for the flats. If my kickdown would work. It would be a perfect world, lol !

 

[PurpleBeeper]

Thank you. It’s easy to misunderstand depending on road speeds and inclines. 60-70mph isn’t possible in 2nd gear. It would drop me down to about 45-50 mph. I wouldn’t care, if it wasn’t on a 3 lane interstate with heavy traffic.
I have the 3rd member off as we speak to replace U-Joints and a tiny leak at 3rd member. Now is a great time to ask questions. Perhaps I can get a hold of a 2.76 or 3.23 at a reasonable price.
I understand and I’m not completely concerned with rpms. I’m pretty sure, a problem I have is the tranny doesn’t kick down. This seriously affects trying to maintain 60-70 once I hit a incline. I tried everything. I know for a fact the kick down is adjusted properly. I fined tuned it a dozen times and it still doesn’t kick down. Adjusted pump inside the tranny, still no kick down. Properly adjusted both bands, still no kick down.
Tranny will automatically shift gears while in 2nd on occasions. But, it never shifts gears automatically while in drive. So, with that being said. It may not be automatically shifting in Drive to a higher gear, like Overdrive when I need it on flat ground. I’m not sure if these older Torqueflites are supposed to automatically shift while in Drive like modern transmissions do ? That might be part of the problem. Perhaps my governor isn’t working properly and if that’s the case, I don’t know how to fix that. Maybe that’s why it’s not kicking down too ?
I can hold pedal to floor at 60 mph for 6 or 7 seconds and it still doesn’t kick down. So, in this instance. I just maintain 60 uphill until I hit flat ground. Adjustment is definitely not the issue. I’ve learned a lot about kick down adjustment, band adjustment, etc. But, I don’t know how to test or fix a governor. Or how to diagnose a governor. All of this comes into play, needing all of these factors when you live somewhere with many drastic driving condition changes as I do. If I stay around home, it’s mostly flat. I often travel the mountains, it’s a lot of steep and long inclines with flats in between. I want the highest gearing for the flats. If my kickdown would work. It would be a perfect world, lol !

OK, I'm a little confused, so sorry if I start of with some stuff you probably already know. The torqueflites have no overdrive at all and have 3 gears. Your transmission isn't downshifting still (for some reason) down into 2nd gear, from Drive/3rd gear and it should do that going up a super steep hill like you describe. If you already have 2.94 gears, don't put in 2.76's (would make it worse). You can MANUALLY shift the car down into second, and with 2.94 gears, I'm pretty sure you could run at 70mph (maybe about 3000 rpm, but no problem at all)

 

[Jerry Hall]

My experience with 727's and the kick down is running them with no kick down is that drive is the first gear to go. Then second and after that low and reverse go at the same time. I have had several friends that told me, I don't need a kick down, I can shift it manually. If you don't have the correct pressure on the governor, you're going to lose your transmission. This thread that started out like a gearing problem is starting to sound like a transmission problem. In fact if you have no kick down there is a problem. Some of your statements that it will not run over 60 flat on the floor just doesn't sound right, even for a slant 6. You need to make sure you have 3 forward gears. I may be not understanding correctly, but this has gotten to confusing.

 

[pearljam724]

No need to apologize. I appreciate your input. Regardless of what I know or not. I have a auto 904. It shifts gears manually from drive-2-1-R with no issues. It will not shift while it’s in Drive going down the road automatically. I know modern cars you can feel the transmission shift in drive while accelerating to higher speeds and you can feel a modern car down shift automatically once it begins to slow down. If the transmission is not supposed to shift around on its own while in drive, then I’m ok. That’s what I’m not sure of. And I know the kick down is definitely not working. I’ve tried everything to get it to work. To no avail

 

[Jerry Hall]

No need to apologize. I appreciate your input. Regardless of what I know or not. I have a auto 904. It shifts gears manually from drive-2-1-R with no issues. It will not shift while it’s in Drive going down the road automatically. I know modern cars you can feel the transmission shift in drive while accelerating to higher speeds and you can feel a modern car down shift automatically once it begins to slow down. If the transmission is not supposed to shift around on its own while in drive, then I’m ok. That’s what I’m not sure of. And I know the kick down is definitely not working. I’ve tried everything to get it to work. To no avail

Great, I'm glad you still have 3 forward gears, but please look into the kick down problem before you don't. On the gears I think the 3:23 ratio is the best all around choice. Sure with a 3:23 gear and stock height tires you are going to be turning 2800 to 3000 rpm at 70. We are driving old cars they turned more rpms in the day and nothing has changed. The engine can take it, just make sure the rest of the drivetrain is working correctly.

 

[pearljam724]

Great, I'm glad you still have 3 forward gears, but please look into the kick down problem before you don't. On the gears I think the 3:23 ratio is the best all around choice. Sure with a 3:23 gear and stock height tires you are going to be turning 2800 to 3000 rpm at 70. We are driving old cars they turned more rpms in the day and nothing has changed. The engine can take it, just make sure the rest of the drivetrain is working correctly.

Much appreciated Jerry. I might take your advice and hunt down a 3.23 I understand the importance of the kickdown working. That’s why I’ve tried addressing it in every possible way I know how. I’ve readjusted the pump lever a dozen times and still nothing. I’m not a tranny expert, but I have nothing left to believe that it’s the pump or governor. The tranny itself is quite as can be and shifts manually like it should. I have a transmission expert that lives down the road that has been working on these torqueflites since their early existence. I’m going to talk to him sometime in the next week.

 

[threewood]

Are you looking to get a complete third member or just replacing the gears? What are the last three numbers of the casting on the third member? 741, 742 or 489? I have a 2.76 gear set for a 741 housing you can have for shipping cost.

 

[pearljam724]

Are you looking to get a complete third member or just replacing the gears? What are the last three numbers of the casting on the third member? 741, 742 or 489? I have a 2.76 gear set for a 741 housing you can have for shipping cost.

View attachment 826590

I have a 741 case. I’m looking for a complete third member. I don’t know anything about installing a ring and pinion separately. I have the third member removed now for a leak fix. I’m hoping to find something in the next few days to give a try. Before I decide to put the one I took out, back in.

 

[PurpleBeeper]

No need to apologize. I appreciate your input. Regardless of what I know or not. I have a auto 904. It shifts gears manually from drive-2-1-R with no issues. It will not shift while it’s in Drive going down the road automatically. I know modern cars you can feel the transmission shift in drive while accelerating to higher speeds and you can feel a modern car down shift automatically once it begins to slow down. If the transmission is not supposed to shift around on its own while in drive, then I’m ok. That’s what I’m not sure of. And I know the kick down is definitely not working. I’ve tried everything to get it to work. To no avail

Hold on there a minute......like Jerry said, you have a TRANSMISSION problem, not a rear end gear problem. The transmission SHOULD shift on it's own up/down when in "drive", not just stay in drive/3rd gear. That is your only problem. The transmission kick-down linkage is what makes the transmission shift on it's own.....and even though you've worked on it, it's still not working.

 

[pearljam724]

Hold on there a minute......like Jerry said, you have a TRANSMISSION problem, not a rear end gear problem. The transmission SHOULD shift on it's own up/down when in "drive", not just stay in drive/3rd gear. That is your only problem. The transmission kick-down linkage is what makes the transmission shift on it's own.....and even though you've worked on it, it's still not working.

Thanks guys. If the kickdown not working affects the tranny shifting in drive that explains everything. That’s exactly the problem. It never shifts on its own in drive. I found a rebuilt 904 today for a very reasonable price. I might look into it. Is this 3rd member a sure grip ? I’m thinking it is, I think the mechanism in the middle I’m pointing at makes it one. If not, how do you distinguish between sure grip, single traction, etc ?

 

[PurpleBeeper]

Thanks guys. If the kickdown not working affects the tranny shifting in drive that explains everything. That’s exactly the problem. It never shifts on its own in drive. I found a rebuilt 904 today for a very reasonable price. I might look into it. Is this 3rd member a sure grip ? I’m thinking it is, I think the mechanism in the middle I’m pointing at makes it one. If not, how do you distinguish between sure grip, single traction, etc ?

View attachment 826804

Yes, it's a sure grip. Take another look at your kickdown linkage first.