Can't win a round to save my life!

[Frustration]

Good luck. Most successful sportsman racers race by looking at the bottom bulb only. That's why they call it "bottom bulb racing". One thing you may want to try to eliminate going red...Add a taller front tire, or add more air to the current tires. That will increase your roll-out. The other item is stage as shallow as possible. Hopefully you're doing that already. If not, try it. It's the only way I know of to be sure how far from the starting line you are while staged. If you still go red, try to take a bit of RPM out of the launch RPM! Let us know how it goes.

 

[66Satellite47]

Good advice, I try to shallow stage, but I'M counting the bulbs. Tire size does make a difference.

 

[LemonWedge]

I've played with front air pressures. They may have some effect with bias ply skinnies, but with street radial tires the effect is minimal since they tend to widen width wise, not flatten length wise. BTW Frustration, I believe you are opposite.... less air increases your rollout, not more. Less air pressure makes for a longer contact patch which increases the rollout.
I bump in as softly and shallowly as possible, I'm confident I'm in the same place each time. A tell-tale indicator of how consistently your staged position in the beams is is your 60ft times.
I am waiting until I see the last amber, but as I've made the car quicker, I am now having to split that bulb. When I say I anticipate, I mean I'm still waiting to see it, but since I know it's coming I'm much quicker and probably less consistent with it than I would be (in theory) if I never saw the first two come down. I hope that makes sense??? My groupings are decent, they're just two quick. We'll see this weekend how the blind works out for me.

 

[Frustration]

I've played with front air pressures. They may have some effect with bias ply skinnies, but with street radial tires the effect is minimal since they tend to widen width wise, not flatten length wise. BTW Frustration, I believe you are opposite.... less air increases your rollout, not more. Less air pressure makes for a longer contact patch which increases the rollout.
I bump in as softly and shallowly as possible, I'm confident I'm in the same place each time. A tell-tale indicator of how consistently your staged position in the beams is is your 60ft times.
I am waiting until I see the last amber, but as I've made the car quicker, I am now having to split that bulb. When I say I anticipate, I mean I'm still waiting to see it, but since I know it's coming I'm much quicker and probably less consistent with it than I would be (in theory) if I never saw the first two come down. I hope that makes sense??? My groupings are decent, they're just two quick. We'll see this weekend how the blind works out for me.

Hmmm...you may be correct on the air pressure. I have two sets of wheels and tires. One is 27" tall, the other is 29" tall. I usually run the 29" on .500 full tree. When we race with 422 All Stars, I run the shorter tires. I'll also bring up the launch rpm a bit. They use a .400 full tree. It's a bit odd to say the least. If you leave on that tree like you do a .500, you'll be way late! I always ran bias plys. I have no experience with radials on a race car. I'm only 49, but I love the vintage racing, and think it should appear that way=no radials. I know everyone has an opinion. That's just mine. I certainly don't care what others do, buy my cars all run bias ply. Thanks to Coker for bringing lots of them back. If someone comes out with a sticky pie crust drag tire...I'll be first in line. Best advice I can give is to get a practice tree. You'll get more out of that one investment than any other if you're going to be a regular bracket racer. It sounds like you have a good understanding of what's going on...you may just need a bit more practice.

 

[dvw]

No way to count or a curtly "split" the bulb. Bottom or nothin. Get a practice tree. Use the same rollout with full and pro.When you can get the R/T's to match within .005-.010 you'll be on your way. Then adjust the car, not yourself to leave on time. Right now I'm getting close. Car leaves -.010-.+.020 off the foot brake.
Doug

 

[Cranky]

Does anyone tune their car to run the number no matter what the weather is? Short of being cold as hell to hot as hell, imo, tuning for being the fastest you can go is not the key to being consistent. The least bit of weather change usually makes the car change. Seems like everyone I know tunes for the 'present' situation and is always tinkering with the tuneup on race day....and for bracket racing, that's not the way to go....imo.

 

[dvw]

I

Does anyone tune their car to run the number no matter what the weather is? Short of being cold as hell to hot as hell, imo, tuning for being the fastest you can go is not the key to being consistent. The least bit of weather change usually makes the car change. Seems like everyone I know tunes for the 'present' situation and is always tinkering with the tuneup on race day....and for bracket racing, that's not the way to go....imo.

I do. Running N/SS I run 9.25 index. No throttle stops, electronics, air shifters or starting line RPM limiters. Not to mention track temp changes running on 10.5 tires. You're at the same index all weekend.

 

[oldbee]

I've never tried all the electronic/air stuff; I got out just before all that started coming in. I'm just envious of Doug and the rest that do it all "manual", IMO that's the way it oughta be.

 

[LemonWedge]

I

I do. Running N/SS I run 9.25 index. No throttle stops, electronics, air shifters or starting line RPM limiters. Not to mention track temp changes running on 10.5 tires. You're at the same index all weekend.

You guys are to be commended, Doug. In this age of "just pull a few out of the box", or "just back off the throttle stop"; running an index with no "devices" allowed but a screwdriver certainly separates the men from the boys!

 

[Frustration]

N/SS is a great class. In my opinion, the best groups run it like originally set up...on an index. I think when N/SS first started with the NMCA (??), they had one second index separation. You had to dial 10.0, 11.0, or 12.0. etc... Groups like 422 run on one tenth indexes. You can dial a 10.60, but you have to run it all day long. When running an index, I would run the next class slower than the car was running that day. To slow it down, I used spare tires to add weight. If the weight wasn't enough, I would short shift. I never needed to go slower than those changes would make the car. I think a lot of guys would change the timing to pick up or slow down. Index racing is bracket racing...with a twist! We're heading to Atco for a N/SS race this Sunday. The crew at Atco run it like a bracket race and allow you to dial by round. I'm using it as a test n tune. Stay safe. Love this thread.

 

[GrabberOrange69]

next year im coming out swinging and will be playing hard ball,this almost 60 year old isnt giving up

My dad won an NHRA trophy at 70. You got a decade of great racing ahead of you!

 

[66Satellite47]

Does anyone tune their car to run the number no matter what the weather is? Short of being cold as hell to hot as hell, imo, tuning for being the fastest you can go is not the key to being consistent. The least bit of weather change usually makes the car change. Seems like everyone I know tunes for the 'present' situation and is always tinkering with the tuneup on race day....and for bracket racing, that's not the way to go....imo.

In my later bracket racing days, I didn't change anything to get "optimum" performance. I had the car tuned for best "average conditions". Extreme hot or cold, jet change, otherwise run what it runs. In my earlier years I did change stuff between rounds, would drive one of my buddies nuts! Leave it alone and find the light. I should emphasize, work really hard at all the little things to make the car consistent.

 

[gtxracer]

I couldn't agree more with all of your postings, if I wanted too. I have been doing this since the early 70's and the win lose streaks will be there. I was a pro bowler for a time and at times it seemed I couldn't buy a strike. If you stick too what you know it comes back, even in bowling. Pay attention too the basics, make sure your car and equipment is ready and run your own race. Race the track and the tree. If you don't red light once in awhile, you aren't trying hard enough. Just my thoughts.

 

[dvw]

This year I've won 4 times, just won my 3rd race in a row. Last year? One final, no wins. Then went 6 races in a row, -.006,-.012,-.002,-.026,-.012,-.001 Never give up.
Doug

 

[66Satellite47]

Drag racing is a tough game. But the more you do it and pay attention to the folks that win, the more you will win.

 

[malex]

Drag racing is a tough game. But the more you do it and pay attention to the folks that win, the more you will win.

My first year racing. Pro class. Lots of bugs to work out of the car but went 4 rounds twice and catching onto the tricks of the trade. The season is over now and already getting busy making upgrades for next year.

All cleaned up - ready for next year.

Love the rush!

 

[66Satellite47]

Well keep at it. Took me a couple years before I learned how to win. Then I had 10 + years when I did fairly well. Didn't have guys lining up against me. Had one of the best bracket racers in the country angry with me because I pulled up along side him by mistake. Lucked out & got a single. Didn't meet the guy till the semi finals. Dropped the nose & took the win by about 2 feet. Won the final and paid for the trip.

 

[Cranky]

I

I do. Running N/SS I run 9.25 index. No throttle stops, electronics, air shifters or starting line RPM limiters. Not to mention track temp changes running on 10.5 tires. You're at the same index all weekend.

So why did you disagree with my post?

 

[dvw]

QUOTE="Cranky, post: 910769619, member: 2509"]So why did you disagree with my post?[/QUOTE]
I'm assuming you mean my comment about not paying attention to the other car? Ran a finals this weekend.
Sundays final was a perfect example. My car spun the tires hard. I stay in it but figure it's fruitless and I've lost. The guy at the ticket shack hands me my slip with a smile on his face. Why was he smiling at me?
R/T .046 dial 9.25 ET 9.439 .235 pkg Win
R/T .030 dial 11.0 ET 10.994 .024 pkg -.006 break out
That's a stripe margin of .211 or roughly 38 feet.
Not wanting to break out in Saturday nights final my finish line stripe was .004 or roughly 15"
Doug

 

[bobtile]

Does anyone tune their car to run the number no matter what the weather is? Short of being cold as hell to hot as hell, imo, tuning for being the fastest you can go is not the key to being consistent. The least bit of weather change usually makes the car change. Seems like everyone I know tunes for the 'present' situation and is always tinkering with the tuneup on race day....and for bracket racing, that's not the way to go....imo.

Index racing you need to tune for changing atmospheric and track conditions. Bracket racing you just need to run your number.
Two different animals.