Does it really matter if its a clone?

[moparnation74]

Funny thread....I see the OP's opinion and many other opinions....

Even more comical in this thread is about "clones" and a number of posts that crack on purists...Why? What do the purists do to hold up your build? Sad some in this hobby have developed this piss poor attitude towards people that want to restore their cars a certain way!

As long as the car is NOT misrepresented when sold.....I do not care what the OP does to HIS car....

How many guys back in the day REMOVED badging to create a "sleeper" look....then dusted a few chevies and fords......Kinda the reverse, right?

 

[Hemirunner]

As long as the car is NOT misrepresented when sold.....I do not care what the OP does to HIS car....

This statement sums it up for me...

 

[PeteBell68]

That's what my post meant exactly ,who ever owns it can do what they want with their own car and money .
I personally wouldn't buy a clone but that's me my own opinion but I wouldn't be rude or offensive to someone who owns or makes one as long as it's not represented as a real car when selling it .
Reading the VIN will and hopefully should tell you what you have or are getting everyone knows anyways .

 

[Sixpactogo]

Opinions and ******** are pretty common. Everyone has one. I have built a half dozen cars over the years and none of them were original when I got them. I built them the way I wanted with no concern for the purists or the whiners. Take for example, my 68 Charger. I bought it as a rust bucket with most of the original equipment long gone. It was not a highly desired R/T nor a Hemi like it is badged now. I wanted a powerful car that can get down the road with high fuel mileage so built it with a Gen 3 6.1 and 5 speed auto. I call it a restomod. You can call it a clone, wanna be, fake, piece of **** or whatever trips your trigger. The ones that want complain about it won't have to go far to find a SS badged camaro that they have no clue as to whether it is original, cloned or fake just like my car. I get lots of complements and even a few boos from spectators at the shows I go to. My point is, I built it for me and my passion. If you don't like it, Keep on moving.

 

[Dibbons]

If you look at Petty's NASCAR '71 "Road Runner" you will notice it has a "Satellite" hood.

 

[HT413]

I see a GTX convertable in the future

Restored by his heirs.

 

[PeteBell68]

Opinions and ******** are pretty common. Everyone has one. I have built a half dozen cars over the years and none of them were original when I got them. I built them the way I wanted with no concern for the purists or the whiners. Take for example, my 68 Charger. I bought it as a rust bucket with most of the original equipment long gone. It was not a highly desired R/T nor a Hemi like it is badged now. I wanted a powerful car that can get down the road with high fuel mileage so built it with a Gen 3 6.1 and 5 speed auto. I call it a restomod. You can call it a clone, wanna be, fake, piece of **** or whatever trips your trigger. The ones that want complain about it won't have to go far to find a SS badged camaro that they have no clue as to whether it is original, cloned or fake just like my car. I get lots of complements and even a few boos from spectators at the shows I go to. My point is, I built it for me and my passion. If you don't like it, Keep on moving.

Making a car what you want is totally your opinion on what is yours . I bet your car looks awesome drives awesome etc . I have seen quite a few cars that are exceptionally nice wether badged a high end model of not .
Like I said its yours enjoy the hell out of it .

 

[threewood]

Do you think the people with "clones" would like to have a real car? Yes. Do you think they can afford them now? I doubt it, which is why they build them to look like what they would rather have. I understand, many have been priced out of the hobby. At this point it is take what you can afford and make it what you want. That's very differentthan someone swapping data plates and vins to sucker someone.

 

[Sahara]

Also, most posts here are concerned about selling, misrepresenting, and money. One of the most annoying comments in this "hobby" is that "you'll never get your MONEY back out of it".
This is supposed to be an old car HOBBY, not a business. When I bought my Jeep new in '07 I paid $31K for it. It's worth perhaps $5K now and it doesn't bother anyone that I'll never get my money back out of it. When my '70 Bee copy is done I'll have around $50K into it, and it'll be worth around $35K. I'm happy with that because I'm not in the business of building cars. I have a job so that I can afford my hobby. When did we lose sight of the fact that it's neat to own these as automotive art, not as a retirement plan?

 

[451Mopar]

The debate has been going on for a long time.
For me, as long as the seller does not try to pass the car off as something it is not, then I'm fine with it.
I can appreciate all the different ways cars are preserved, restored, modified, but mostly enjoyed by their owners.
To me a car is only original once. I think survivor cars are pretty neat. It is really hard to find an old muscle car that has not been modified or changed since original. I see the high end, properly restored, cars as preserving the history of the cars.
These cars above likely are not driven much if at all, but get alot of attention and coverage, and that might be why they fetch high dollars?
I started driving in the late 1970's, and these were inexpensive cool cars, but gas guzzlers. Performance wise, much better than most of the garbage econo boxes of the late 1970s, 1980's and 1990's.
My '71 Charger 500 in the photo was a $550 car needing quite a bit of work when I bought it in the late 1980's.
I think the Barret Jackson auction created additional interest and speculation in car prices that really drove the higher prices, but also helped get more restoration suppliers into the Mopar market. It is a double edged sword, the higher prices make getting a decent car expensive, but otherwise many more of the car may have met the crusher like all those forgettable 1980's cars (GM X-platform).

 

[Sixpactogo]

Making a car what you want is totally your opinion on what is yours . I bet your car looks awesome drives awesome etc . I have seen quite a few cars that are exceptionally nice wether badged a high end model of not .
Like I said its yours enjoy the hell out of it .

Here are a couple pics of my restomod. Yes, it gets down the road way better than it did when original. 1700 rpms at 75mph and knocks down 22-24 mpg with the A/C on. The original was probably half the mpg at twice the rpms back when gas was 34 cents per gallon. I bought a new Charger R/T in the spring of 68. That car was good for 10-12 mpg with the 440 4 speed and 3:55 gears. Do I wish I still had it? Yeah but not in the condition I last saw it. (totaled out from a couple end over end summer saults in Missouri) No, I wasn't driving it. I didn't have a drivers license at the time. This car could never pass as an original as there is really not much left on it that was original. Is it real? It is to me. Trouble is, Here in Wisconsin, Ma Nature won't let me enjoy it for more than a few months per year.

 

[mopar 3 B]

Do you think the people with "clones" would like to have a real car? Yes. Do you think they can afford them now? I doubt it, which is why they build them to look like what they would rather have. I understand, many have been priced out of the hobby. At this point it is take what you can afford and make it what you want. That's very differentthan someone swapping data plates and vins to sucker someone.

I have seen way to many suckered and lost big $$. Just because of someones arrogant attitude of I built it that way now it has to be what it looks like.
If there were not crooked people in the hobby this would not be a issue but there are and it is an issue.
You may sell your rebaged car with good intent but what about the next owner?
This has become an expensive hobby were differences in badging can equally 10's of thousands.
Its like buying a Rembrandt, paying the price of a original and getting screwed with a copy.

 

[threewood]

I have seen way to many suckered and lost big $$. Just because of someones arrogant attitude of I built it that way now it has to be what it looks like.
If there were not crooked people in the hobby this would not be a issue but there are and it is an issue.
You may sell your rebaged car with good intent but what about the next owner?
This has become an expensive hobby were differences in badging can equally 10's of thousands.
Its like buying a Rembrandt, paying the price of a original and getting screwed with a copy.

Right, but if you really like the work of Rembrandt and cannot afford one why not purchase a copy so you can at least enjoy the art.

 

[gdrill]

If you're buying a high dollar car, you better know what to look for. Starting with a VIN and body stampings. If you get screwed because somebody has gone to the trouble of changing or installing numbers that are false, that is far beyond building a clone.

 

[Ron H]

My opinion, having owned a '70 Cuda/383 and a '67 GTO drop tops (yeah wish I had 'em back) is having an original was preferred. The muscle car "badging" really took off with the '64 GTO off the Tempest platform. A bigger motor, some HD components and different trimming; same body. Could also say badging took off with the Sport Fury in what, '62? I have a 63 Fury, not Sport, that I have cloned a bit to SF mostly the upholstery and added buckets not badging/trim. But then, with the Plymouths back in this era, you didn't have to have a SF badge to have a wedge planted in it or a Fury. They came sometimes preferably in the stripped down models like the Savoy. In a 63 (unless it was the SF no 6 cyl available) wow you had the six, 318, 361, 383, or 426 motors! So the whole concept obviously was what the "factory" installed though some dealers would do modifications once they got the car as well before selling it. I think this is still acceptable to the purists. My point is thinking of the earlier B's any model could be a 318 or a 426. What's this say about the model or badging though OK this is earlier before the rage of Runners, GTX, 442's or Super Sports..

 

[Sahara]

But again, it's all because of people worrying about reselling for a profit. If you see a car you like, for example the copy I'm building, and pay $50K or more for it, you should be buying it because it's what you like and want. If you never plan on reselling it for a profit it doesn't matter what you pay for it.

 

[mopar 3 B]

Fraud: A person or thing intended to deceive others, typically by unjustifiably claiming or being credited with accomplishments or qualities.
We are walking a fine line here. Some day someone is going to complain about being screwed. This just gives the car haters more amo. Do what you want, but I don't seeing this ending well for any of us.
I know you want to justify your actions and its not about us with the real thing being arrogant asses wanting to keep you out of the hobby. Its about keeping the hobby legitimate.

 

[Richard Cranium]

This thread has become.....

 

[tak419]

Fraud: A person or thing intended to deceive others, typically by unjustifiably claiming or being credited with accomplishments or qualities.
We are walking a fine line here. Some day someone is going to complain about being screwed. This just gives the car haters more amo. Do what you want, but I don't seeing this ending well for any of us.
I know you want to justify your actions and its not about us with the real thing being arrogant asses wanting to keep you out of the hobby. Its about keeping the hobby legitimate.

Couldn't have been said any better !!!!!

 

[HT413]