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Flat tappet vs roller....opinions?

moparmarks said:
Why have the car companies gone to the extra exspense to install roller lifters in their motors?
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Most modern day cars (since the 90's) have switched to roller cams due to reliability and ease of use. Roller cams require roller lifters.
 
What I like about the OEM roller lifters is they last virtually forever. Unless they get starved for oil or somethin stupid. Plus, they can be used on pretty much the most aggressive of hydraulic roller grinds with no trouble. Even so, there are still much more accurate lifters out there in terms of oil metering and plunger action. But the stock ones will work.
 
arsinist01 said:
Most modern day cars (since the 90's) have switched to roller cams due to reliability and ease of use. Roller cams require roller lifters.
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Ya , I was kinda being sarcastic, lol. Ford started using rollers in their 300 straight 6 around 1990. I've used rollers in the last couple motors and am real happy. The last was a SB Chevy 427 stroker with a Howard roller. Around 560" lift. Is a real nice drivable street motor. Real nice idle.
 
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I just need to make sure I can find a set that are oil-through lifters otherwise there is no point lol.
 
Can't really get a hydraulic roller to sound like a flat tappet camshaft, I had a .550 lift camshaft in my SBF that was pretty radical and it barely had a lope to it... Hard to get aggressive ramp rates with hydraulics, they just fall off on the big end. I also like a rough idle. I don't drive a 'muscle car' to listen to the radio.. Rollers make more power, bar none; just not my style unless it was OEM roller from the factory. Just replaced the roller lifters in our 454 chevy after two went south and wiped out the camshaft.
 
I did email howards cams about the lifters I would be needing. If anyone else ever needs to know the part # is 91764
 
Hmmm... I've been thinking about this lately too. Its tempting to go all out performance (rollers) but that not really the aim of my build. I want it fast but not a 9sec warrior. I'd like a good rough lope. I was thinking of rollers to avoid the run in, but if the rollers don't sound as good then I might have to go flat tappets.

Probably a stupid question, Flat tappets with roller rockers? Any point?

Sorry I'm new to old school, I can talk DOHC, but push rods are another thing!
 
You can get a roller to sound as good as a flat tappet, BUT you have to go way bigger than the flat tappet with the roller to get there. And Like Sweet5ltr and I agree, I don't think the roller would ever sound as nasty as an aggressive flat tappet solid. You get up over 260* @ .050 with a flat tappet solid and that sound is tough to duplicate. Specially with an LSA as tight or tighter than a 108.
 
Malicious said:
Hmmm... I've been thinking about this lately too. Its tempting to go all out performance (rollers) but that not really the aim of my build. I want it fast but not a 9sec warrior. I'd like a good rough lope. I was thinking of rollers to avoid the run in, but if the rollers don't sound as good then I might have to go flat tappets.

Probably a stupid question, Flat tappets with roller rockers? Any point?

Sorry I'm new to old school, I can talk DOHC, but push rods are another thing!
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From the research I have done (who knows it could be wrong) you can't use roller lifters with a flat tappet cam. But you should be able to use roller rockers with any type of cam if I am not mistaken.
 
arsinist01 said:
From the research I have done (who knows it could be wrong) you can't use roller lifters with a flat tappet cam. But you should be able to use roller rockers with any type of cam if I am not mistaken.
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This is accurate.......

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Have any of you heard a Pro-Stock idle? They have a WICKED sound!!! Very rough,,,, sounds like a hammer in a 55 gal drum!!!
They have Solid roller lifters / Camshafts........
I say use roller if you have the Xtra cash lying around, and take advantage of the faster ramp speeds and higher lifts at a lower duration!
I personally could NOT afford the whole package when I assembled my engine, so I went with a solid flat tappet with 1.6:1 ratio roller rockers, netting .630" lift.....
 
Well sure.....at .800 plus lift with over 300* duration @ .050. Of course they sound wicked. But compare a solid roller and solid flat tappet of the same specs. The flat tappet will be much nastier. The roller will win out in power nearly everytime though.
 
Sorry guys,,,I don't buy it..... The sound of the engine isn't derived from the type of material the camshaft is made from "rollers are billet", or the lifter makeup "roller or non-roller". It is the (PROFILE) of the camshaft that controls the engines characteristics "regarding camshafts", and the sound generated. The design of a roller camshaft allows manufactures to design much more aggressive profiles without bouncing the lifter off the tip of the cam lobe.... or wiping out the lobe due to the needed high spring pressures on big lift profiles.
Not trying to cause an argument,,,,,,,, Just my 2 cents.
 
That's exactly right. I assumed that's what we were discussing. Profiles. Originally, the comment was about solid flat tappets sounding more nasty than hydraulic rollers. In general that's true.....but we kinda drifted.
 
67 B-body said:
Sorry guys,,,I don't buy it..... The sound of the engine isn't derived from the type of material the camshaft is made from "rollers are billet", or the lifter makeup "roller or non-roller". It is the (PROFILE) of the camshaft that controls the engines characteristics "regarding camshafts", and the sound generated. The design of a roller camshaft allows manufactures to design much more aggressive profiles without bouncing the lifter off the tip of the cam lobe.... or wiping out the lobe due to the needed high spring pressures on big lift profiles.
Not trying to cause an argument,,,,,,,, Just my 2 cents.
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profile is the heart of the sound for sure.anyone ever looked at a modern fuel camshaft?lobe looks almost like a hook with the closing side almost a vertical cliff!slap that profile in a 6 banger and it would sound amazing as well.
 
Retro fit Hydraulic Rollers are generally fairly tall, some need block grinding for clearance. Crane still makes a really good oil thru push rod solid roller that has the oil hole low enough so you do not need to bush your lifter bores. A free benefit is oiling thru the push rod makes a big difference on wear and tear. If you decide to go with a flat tappet which is fine for basic engines make sure you don't run without Zinc, Molybdenum and Phosphate. These ingredients are required all the time for flat tappet cams. Newer engines still need these additives to protect cylinder walls , just less of it.

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arsinist01 said:
Most modern day cars (since the 90's) have switched to roller cams due to reliability and ease of use. Roller cams require roller lifters.
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Roller cam engines fail less.
 
Not disagreeing with the above, but my common sense has to wonder what 'streetable' roller camshaft are you running that has 310-320* duration or 106 LSA...? I spent $200 on my camshaft and lifters from Mopar Performance, $80 on push rods, and $175 on crane ductile iron adjustable rockers that were NOS. You cannot duplicate similar performance for that price with ANY roller camshaft. Most 'off the shelf' roller cams are not very aggressive in profile. Spring tensions would be through the roof running a similar grounded' cam as the .590 solid from Mopar. I ran the .590 because it does not require 'sky high' valve spring pressures like modern camshafts. Flat out, nothing can beat the sound of a solid lifter camshaft... If you say a roller cam, then you have never had a solid lifter camshaft worth mentioning.. Just listen to this!

[video=youtube;4Ts6-qOglPg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ts6-qOglPg[/video]
 
Sweet5ltr said:
Not disagreeing with the above, but my common sense has to wonder what 'streetable' roller camshaft are you running that has 310-320* duration or 106 LSA...? I spent $200 on my camshaft and lifters from Mopar Performance, $80 on push rods, and $175 on crane ductile iron adjustable rockers that were NOS. You cannot duplicate similar performance for that price with ANY roller camshaft. Most 'off the shelf' roller cams are not very aggressive in profile. Spring tensions would be through the roof running a similar grounded' cam as the .590 solid from Mopar. I ran the .590 because it does not require 'sky high' valve spring pressures like modern camshafts. Flat out, nothing can beat the sound of a solid lifter camshaft... If you say a roller cam, then you have never had a solid lifter camshaft worth mentioning.. Just listen to this!

[video=youtube;4Ts6-qOglPg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ts6-qOglPg[/video]
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Very nice
 
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