MY 440 SET UP...WHAT DO YOU THINK?

[HawkRod]

So I am not an engine building expert and will not profess to be.

From what I know, and considering cost and the fact that items are already purchased, it seems to me that the most viable thing to change out to improve power (if the OP wants to do that) is change the cam. It seems he has a very viable package overall, but that the cam is on the small side. Relatively speaking, cams are on the cheaper side and truly are the brains/heart of the engine. Considering its importance, wouldn't this be the main area to consider a change?

 

[jluisfelipe]

So I am not an engine building expert and will not profess to be.

From what I know, and considering cost and the fact that items are already purchased, it seems to me that the most viable thing to change out to improve power (if the OP wants to do that) is change the cam. It seems he has a very viable package overall, but that the cam is on the small side. Relatively speaking, cams are on the cheaper side and truly are the brains/heart of the engine. Considering its importance, wouldn't this be the main area to consider a change?

I agree with you. Cam choice was a mistake, so may be with something more agressive and some heads porting work, the set up would be really nice for what I am looking for. What cams could you recommend me?
My objective is a powerful car, but easy to mantain. We could define it as a mild restomod. It will have good comfort and performance upgrades like Wilwood brakes, full Hotchkis suspension kit, air conditioning...The idea is to use it ocasionally, just to enjoy, not a daily car. I will take it to the car meetings and it must attract everyone´s atention. I won´t do very long distance trips, most of the time it will be driven in the city. I also want to be able to take it to the track sometimes, but my primary goal is not a race car.

 

[HT413]

I agree with you. Cam choice was a mistake, so may be with something more agressive and some heads porting work, the set up would be really nice for what I am looking for. What cams could you recommend me?
My objective is a powerful car, but easy to mantain. We could define it as a mild restomod. It will have good comfort and performance upgrades like Wilwood brakes, full Hotchkis suspension kit, air conditioning...The idea is to use it ocasionally, just to enjoy, not a daily car. I will take it to the car meetings and it must attract everyone´s atention. I won´t do very long distance trips, most of the time it will be driven in the city. I also want to be able to take it to the track sometimes, but my primary goal is not a race car.

Just a thought, based on this description, that cam might be the right choice. Power brakes and a reasonable idle with livable gears... the car is gonna make power.

Don’t over cam it, 1-2 steps up maximum is what I’d say. Don’t build a race car if you want a street car.

 

[m79ded]

Honestly your going down a very expensive road. You normally build a combo around a specific goal. And chances are you will get several different opinions as we all have our own ideas on combinations. I can throw out parts all day long but bottom line you already spent good money to build what you have. Being a 3.54 gear b body I would be very hesitant to avoid over camming a 440. Granted your still a ways away from that.

Ultimately we need to know what you wanna do with the car. I think the current combo will drive around real nice.

In my opinion this is the best advise I totally agree with 68 Hemi GTS, it's what you want out of the car. All of us on this board are very knowledgeable and we put together decent combinations that worked well for their respective uses. If you are cruising around with 3.54 you want all your torque lower. Think of where you do most of your driving, you want the car very spirited at that rpm range. with 3.54 you will be around 2700 to 3200 cruising around that cam is decent, Voodoo cams are ground on Chrysler profiles and work well. I have 3.54 in my 79 Magnum (Heavy car) and had a 228 236 cam I had power brakes, car felt great, cast iron intake TQ and manifolds, on Radials at the track consistent 12.75 @ 109 with iron heads, completely stock appearing. So with your setup street driving will be fun with the setup. I,ve also seen the comp cam HL275 work very well also. We can chase Dyno #'s all day long but it comes down to what you are expecting. I wouldn't go changing all kinds of parts for no reason. Really the only thing I would suggest is get rid of those SLUG heavy pistons. Spend the money and get light pistons your crank and rods will thank you for it. Good luck and between all of us we will steer you right

 

[jluisfelipe]

Just a thought, based on this description, that cam might be the right choice. Power brakes and a reasonable idle with livable gears... the car is gonna make power.
Don’t over cam it, 1-2 steps up maximum is what I’d say. Don’t build a race car if you want a street car.

In that case, conserving the heads, what cam would you choose? I want something remarkable, but no so hard to make the engine stalls...You know what I mean?

 

[wyrmrider]

You did say motor has been to machine shop and is completely rebuilt
Do you mean assembled already or just machined?
Balanced already?
if so your past the time to think about a stroker for THIS Build
Remember the early post where the 241 cam only got 11 inches of vacuum and he swapped it for a 228.
I did tests for Direct Connection back in the day
354 gear auto with HP converter lost 60 foot times with one- two size larger than Magnum duration cam
(Magnum Cam is lazier than DC Cams and both are much slower than today's cams- we have better springs now able to give more area under the curve for a given duration with .904 lifter)
That's about where a 224-228 cam is

 

[Challenger340]

I don't see anything wrong with the original combination AND Camshaft ? It should provide excellent reliability and drive-ability with the nice Trq curve on the 3.54 cogs.

All I was trying to point out,
was a more realistic expectation of HP/Trq using the planned 440 combo OOTB components, versus the "stated" expectations, which I have NO idea why someone would be firm on wanting closer to the 600hp level with std inch "440" combo's on the street, versus the reduced Drive-ability etc., that invariably MUST occur with the larger Camshafts on a 440 to get there.

 

[wyrmrider]

Do let us know if you have balanced your motor
Let's double check
The 6 pack pistons and 75 cc heads gives you how much compression with .037 thick gaskets (how thick are the gaskets in your package?
You said you were machined already
how far down the hole are your pistons now
or what is your crank centerline to deck height and we can figure it out
I'm estimating 1.5:1
How are you going to fuel this thing?
What to do
you can send the pistons down to Texas and have a D-Dish machined about 25+ CC and get your compression to 9.5 (with 3:54 gears) lower gears you can go higher cuz less chance of lugging)
You want your top of piston to bottom of head to be in the .035 range or 0.0 deck with a composition gasket plus the dish
THEN PICK A CAM
I have built this combo many times with 915 heads, 9:1 (iron heads) .030 quench (auto trans app)( 6 pack pistons with .030+ D-Dish) and 256, 260, 268 cams (@.006)- your 271 cam should work OK (you already own it- right?) but you are at the max with what is essentially an updated stock build (and application)
The key thing is to have tight quench or it will ping or worse
The 268 cam was a 218 @.050 custom Crower
bigger than the 268 direct connection cam- lot's more lift- area under the curve- it went into a stick shift B Body (do not compare .006 with Mopar duration numbers- I used it for identification only)
The 440 magnum cam is around 214 @.050 so the Crower was about three notches bigger (as the Crower is one size plus two notches more aggressive
YOU DO LOOSE SOME OFF THE LINE with slicks
but street tires go up in smoke with either

 

[IQ52]

I don't see anything wrong with the original combination AND Camshaft ? It should provide excellent reliability and drive-ability with the nice Trq curve on the 3.54 cogs.

All I was trying to point out,
was a more realistic expectation of HP/Trq using the planned 440 combo OOTB components, versus the "stated" expectations, which I have NO idea why someone would be firm on wanting closer to the 600hp level with std inch "440" combo's on the street, versus the reduced Drive-ability etc., that invariably MUST occur with the larger Camshafts on a 440 to get there.

How many times can you hit the 'agree' button? It disappears after the first time and I'd like to hit it several more. There are very few people who can do what, in my opinion, is a street-able 600HP engine with 440ci.

 

[wyrmrider]

How many times can you hit the 'agree' button? It disappears after the first time and I'd like to hit it several more. There are very few people who can do what, in my opinion, is a street-able 600HP engine with 440ci.

What I see is too much compression for that short cam- Making a stock compression 6 pack run on the street is a challenge and he has the increase of the closed chamber heads.
retarding takes steps backwards
used to use the Carter Ping eliminator but they have been gone for years- what can you use now
but mileage and performance goes away...

 

[jluisfelipe]

Thanks again for your help, I am going in the good direction with your advices. I am going to wait for the dyno results to decide, but if I don´t get the right numbers, I will do this: port and polish my heads + new cams. Do you think this cam is a good option: https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/lun-10230704k/overview/ ?
By the way, could you recommend me an electric pump, please? I am a little bit lost in that matter...

 

[HT413]

Thanks again for your help, I am going in the good direction with your advices. I am going to wait for the dyno results to decide, but if I don´t get the right numbers, I will do this: port and polish my heads + new cams. Do you think this cam is a good option: https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/lun-10230704k/overview/ ?
By the way, could you recommend me an electric pump, please? I am a little bit lost in that matter...

That’s the cam I have in my 451. It’s a great cam, very similar to your current cam with a bit more exhaust duration. I’m not sure you’ll feel the difference between the two.

The electric pump I’m using is an in-tank kit from fitech. I prefer in-tank because they’re quiet and run much cooler
http://fitechefi.com/products/40019/

 

[wyrmrider]

So motor's already together and you are ready to dyno? Wy jerk our chains till you know which way to jump and how high?
I see cam creep here
The 276 Voodo wants 3.73 or deeper gears- 3:90 would be nice- do you really want to go there?
BTW heavy car look at your torque curve more than top end HP
post up your quench
if over .040 you essentially don't have any
which really hurts driveability on a non race only car
so first thing to fix
maybe some thin MLS gaskets and open up your combustion chambers around the valves to 80 cc
How does the motor like street gas is another thing to find out- under load at 2000-3000 rpm- street rpm when you step on the gas...
BTW the 218 @.050 Crower we used had .525 lift...with 1.5 rockers- The voodo line is leaving something on the table (IMHO) but I think the 271 would be more than max with your weight and gears and need for power breaks and a not hot rodding drivers