PRIMER QUESTION

[72satteldog]

Hey Moparguys, have a question....So I've got my panels and body sanded and sprayed in epoxy, proceeded to get my hammer and dolly and filler work done and re sanded and blocked the epoxy to the point where I'm satisfied and ready for my high build primers and more blocking before final coats of primer and sealer, I haven't 100% decided on a what paint yet but do i need these high build primers by the same company as the final paint? I'm leaning towards PPG for the paint and from what I'm reading you need to stay with the same manufacturer with the primers and paint but not sure if that means the build primers or just the finish primer and sealer? appreciate any feedback guys...thanks

 

[snakeoil24]

Lot of bs just don’t mix acid etch with epoxy

 

[Crowbar]

All manufacturers want you to use all of their products I try using all the same but really the final primer or sealer is all that needs to be compatible You can even use the epoxy primer as a sealer by adding reducer Just remember on epoxy a top coat needs to be applied within 7 days or you’ll need to sand or scuff it Before you think it’s ready for paint I always suggest taking Wax and Grease remover with a fine clean rag and wipe each panel with uniform and even strokes you need to keep it on there WET then get back and look at the panel moving your head up and down back and forth If there are any imperfections (slight dents or what I hate the most is WAVES) you will be able to see it Whatever you see with the wet wax and grease remover is what it will look like painted Better finding out before rather than after Randy

 

[727]

Don’t use excessive high build primer. If using it to thick it can shrink under the painting in a couple of years showing imperfections that should have had body filler

 

[Kern Dog]

I've had paint store guys react to questions like a Politician....ducking the answer, answering my question with another question, etc. Its as if they are trained to be shady and evasive.
Yes, the products they sell come with instructions from their suppliers to use ALL ABC products for guaranteed results.
Pffft!
I've tried to get them to admit that you can spray clear coat over a single stage paint and they won't come out and admit it.
Clear coat is essentially paint without any pigment. YES you can spray it over a single stage but they are certainly advised against admitting it because it isn't the specific way that it was designed to be done.

 

[zyzzyx]

Epoxy is fine overall to "Seal" the metal from corrosion and surface rust. Do your bodywork,
and dolly work, and then use three coats of Featherfill, G2, or Slick Sand to give yourself a
high build primer to block. Block it with a long board with sticky backed 120 paper until you
start going through in an "X" pattern. when you think you've got it, put one more coat on and
wet block it with a shorter block with 400. keep it wet and look at it in the light for waviness.

 

[eldubb440]

I use epoxy primer throughout the entire job...... opinions on this topic will vary; but just because someone goes about it differently, does not mean the end result suffers. there is more than one way to skin a cat.

I use epoxies that sand without destroying the paper, and there is plenty of "build" to fill what is needed

I get my bodywork as best I can and prime it, but not overly heavy........ then block/board it with 120/180, touch up minor issues in the body work and reprime it.... then I go 320/400...... I also "spot prime" and re-sand where needed.

slightly reduced epoxy as a sealer before base........ I also sand my base as needed

 

[Bighouse]

Ahhhh the red “X”

There’s a thousand ways to achieve a painted project. Out of that thousand, roughly a thousand will tell you the correct way to do it, and the best way!!

 

[zyzzyx]

Wow, That's brutal! Oh well, you can't please everyone!

 

[slimt]

Im staying out of this one.

 

[1967coronet]

I'm with him^^^^


What do you guys think of green bearings ?

 

[eldubb440]

I am open to, and respect anyone's opinions who are experienced in the field. I have learned and applied lessons gained from members on this site........ Anyone who thinks they know it all are kidding themselves

 

[@66CoronetWgn]

Hey Moparguys, have a question....So I've got my panels and body sanded and sprayed in epoxy, proceeded to get my hammer and dolly and filler work done and re sanded and blocked the epoxy to the point where I'm satisfied and ready for my high build primers and more blocking before final coats of primer and sealer, I haven't 100% decided on a what paint yet but do i need these high build primers by the same company as the final paint? I'm leaning towards PPG for the paint and from what I'm reading you need to stay with the same manufacturer with the primers and paint but not sure if that means the build primers or just the finish primer and sealer? appreciate any feedback guys...thanks

Any quality 2K high build primer should work over an epoxy and be suitable for PPG's DBC, or their Omni brand MBC base coats. Per your comment to use PPG topcoats, I'd suggest Omni SV MP282 primer. Reasonable price, and there's a version of MP282 that can be rolled if that's an advantage. The MP282 can be used as a high build primer or reduced - check the tech sheets. I usually shoot DBC base coats using Omni reducers (MR185/MR186) and use Omni 2K clear coats (MC161/MC277 w/appropriate catalysts) over the DBC - saves money. Never had any issues in 20+ years of mixing those systems (both by PPG). I rarely use the Omni MBC base coats because the solids (pigments) are lower and the coverage is less consistent. Unless its collision damage or something requiring a non-sanding sealer over existing paint, I spray the DBC over the MP282, or in the past, the Omni MP182 properly sanded for top coating. As someone said, there's a lot of ways to approach the primer system that will work. I've had great results with these products and their application is consistent. Tips from others on using too much, ways to find dents and waves, etc.,...on the money. Good luck.

 

[72satteldog]

Any quality 2K high build primer should work over an epoxy and be suitable for PPG's DBC, or their Omni brand MBC base coats. Per your comment to use PPG topcoats, I'd suggest Omni SV MP282 primer. Reasonable price, and there's a version of MP282 that can be rolled if that's an advantage. The MP282 can be used as a high build primer or reduced - check the tech sheets. I usually shoot DBC base coats using Omni reducers (MR185/MR186) and use Omni 2K clear coats (MC161/MC277 w/appropriate catalysts) over the DBC - saves money. Never had any issues in 20+ years of mixing those systems (both by PPG). I rarely use the Omni MBC base coats because the solids (pigments) are lower and the coverage is less consistent. Unless its collision damage or something requiring a non-sanding sealer over existing paint, I spray the DBC over the MP282, or in the past, the Omni MP182 properly sanded for top coating. As someone said, there's a lot of ways to approach the primer system that will work. I've had great results with these products and their application is consistent. Tips from others on using too much, ways to find dents and waves, etc.,...on the money. Good luck.

Appreciate the feedback 66cornetwgn...still in the research stages and trying to gather as many opinions as i can, the mechanical end of this build is more up my ally, still learning the paint and body end of it...thanks again

 

[72satteldog]

Lot of bs just don’t mix acid etch with epoxy

Yup, that much I've gotten from what I've been reading

 

[72satteldog]

All manufacturers want you to use all of their products I try using all the same but really the final primer or sealer is all that needs to be compatible You can even use the epoxy primer as a sealer by adding reducer Just remember on epoxy a top coat needs to be applied within 7 days or you’ll need to sand or scuff it Before you think it’s ready for paint I always suggest taking Wax and Grease remover with a fine clean rag and wipe each panel with uniform and even strokes you need to keep it on there WET then get back and look at the panel moving your head up and down back and forth If there are any imperfections (slight dents or what I hate the most is WAVES) you will be able to see it Whatever you see with the wet wax and grease remover is what it will look like painted Better finding out before rather than after Randy

Good advice, thanks

 

[72satteldog]

Ahhhh the red “X”

There’s a thousand ways to achieve a painted project. Out of that thousand, roughly a thousand will tell you the correct way to do it, and the best way!!

LOL, true...but not helpful

I am open to, and respect anyone's opinions who are experienced in the field. I have learned and applied lessons gained from members on this site........ Anyone who thinks they know it all are kidding themselves

Which was the whole point of me asking, It's the....never a dumb question just alot of dumb answers type analogy, there are obviously some real pros on this site and all i'm looking for is a little info, which i got, and typically when someone goes to the trouble to answer a post they're looking to help

 

[72satteldog]

I know that this paint and body is an art and like any art everyone has their own interpretations of how you do it, I'm not looking for a concourse type paint job, just one i can be proud to show off to my car buddies and say....I did that, so all and any info and advice will be well received and some utilized

 

[Rich H.]

do i need these high build primers by the same company as the final paint?

If you're doing high volume work in a collision shop, you provide customers with a warranty, and in turn-as a customer of the corps who sell you the supplies-you then expect the manufacturer of the products you're using to provide you with their warranty..........then YES the entire product line has to come from the same manufacturer, because this is how the companies who make all those products have structured what little warranty they offer (and not because products can't functionally be mixed). They also prefer you purchase large quantities of product for many years, are in regular contact with their sales rep, and so forth.

If you're a random guy just working on his own stuff, you buy products to do the work wherever you can, especially working in a home environment, then NO the entire product line does not have to come from the same manufacturer from a functional standpoint, nor will any product manufacturer be of much help from a warranty standpoint if there is a problem since all you bought is enough to do one vehicle and you don't have a rep to fight some of the battle for you, etc (I'm not saying I agree with this...I don't....but it's the way of the world).

For the most part, epoxy is epoxy, urethane is urethane. Follow TDS for your products and you won't go astray.