The Elephant In The Room: unloading the load from a B-body.

[fullmetaljacket]

Here’s a deep dive into a true street differential which has its limits compared to a race unit. It was the best that could be done while keeping a STOCK look.
Working closely with Dr. Diff on this one, he found that the S60 housing was lighter than the Spicer/Dana housing by a full 2 lbs. It’s not sure if this is because of lighter gauge axle tubes or the potato head itself, but it didn’t take an ounce of pushback to persuade which housing got the nod.
More on this later when pictures are found.

 

[gooser]

lee for being marooned in the good old days you do damm good. when i got my dana in 78 the guy that did it mike dawson cut the tubes off put light weight tubes on i drillrd the webbing then put the alum cover on with alum bolts i think the differance was 4 pounds all togather

 

[fullmetaljacket]

lee for being marooned in the good old days you do damm good. when i got my dana in 78 the guy that did it mike dawson cut the tubes off put light weight tubes on i drillrd the webbing then put the alum cover on with alum bolts i think the differance was 4 pounds all togather

Gooser, yes, yes. I went with the lighter S60 and got a hold of the now hard to find Moroso anodized aluminum rear covers like the one attached. The filler plug is also aluminum. The whole thing weighs close to nothing. Painted black, no-one would know the difference from a stock steel cover.
The aluminum bolts are T-2024. All 10 stock bolts weighed 4.65 ounces. Basically a little over a 1/4 of a pound.
The aluminum jammies weighed just under 2 ounces at 1.95. Saved 2.70 ounces.

 

[fullmetaljacket]

As we all know, there's nothing light about a heavy duty dana, but at least you can sleep at night or even at the tree and not worry.
Dr. Diff in getting a whiff of this project some how worked and massaged the ring gear and the axles to come in a little lighter. To that extent, nothing else was done to the rear.
The wheels and lug nuts are a whole other story.

 

[fullmetaljacket]

Here's the Barnum and Bailey swinging trapeze shackles and hardware. They mimic the Dr. Diff's original offset shackles but in T-6AL4V titanium.

Dr. Diff's beefy steel offset shackles with bolts and nuts were 2-1/2 Lbs without the bushings.
Surprisingly the factory stock straight shackles with the studs and nuts were a tad heavier at 2-3/4 Lbs without the bushings.
The titanium offset shackles with titanium bolts and nuts were 1 Lb total without the bushings. Saved 2-1/2 Lbs.

 

[Cranky]

The factory original ones I took off my Duster were bent to **** and they were steel.

Do you know what bent them? Only time when I seen a bent one it was from some moron putting a floor jack under it and to jack up the wheel.

How's these for measure? Shock/spring plates.

Titanium is extremely hard to drill through and cut and never mind trying to bend any of it, for it will bend your brain and your patience for sure.

My welder guy who is well into his late 60's is a certified military and space industry welder. He welds components that are classified in a designated area of his shop and he doesn't allow me to see any of it for obvious reasons.

He loves working on this earthling thing not only because I bring him the craziest ideas, but I bring him even crazier homemade jigs that hold what ever it is together while he runs the beads. It brings a smile and a laugh to both of us when he just shakes his head and is impressed. LOL.
What's crazy is that pretty much all of the jigs that have held things true or in place have been with stuff found on the street. The secret is meticulous measuring.

Anyway, the Stockers were 6 Lbs.
Titanium units were 5 Lbs. 1 lb saved.

View attachment 1565500

I've machined a little bit of Ti and yeah, tough but don't think it's any worse than trying to machine through the crust on 11-13 chrome!

 

[fullmetaljacket]

Do you know what bent them? Only time when I seen a bent one it was from some moron putting a floor jack under it and to jack up the wheel.

I've machined a little bit of Ti and yeah, tough but don't think it's any worse than trying to machine through the crust on 11-13 chrome!

Probably the most beautiful metal on the planet. I love the sheen and color of Ti.

 

[dvw]

I've welded up the bolt together drive shaft loops for awhile. You can tilt the loop vs the floor brackets and tuck everything up tight. We cut the two pieces at te 90 degree corner. The short cut off pieces have 4 3/8" bolts welded thru the holes. These two pieces are placed on top of the floor under the carpet. Keeps anything from pulling thru the floor. A friend had a lightweight loop under his 65 Coronet. It broke a Yoke in 3rd gear. Ripped that loop off and tore a good size hole in the floor tunnel.
Doug

 

[rmchrgr]

Do you know what bent them? Only time when I seen a bent one it was from some moron putting a floor jack under it and to jack up the wheel.

No idea. I was surprised. They weren't pretzled but there was a distinct arc.

 

[rmchrgr]

I've welded up the bolt together drive shaft loops for awhile. You can tilt the loop vs the floor brackets and tuck everything up tight. We cut the two pieces at te 90 degree corner. The short cut off pieces have 4 3/8" bolts welded thru the holes. These two pieces are placed on top of the floor under the carpet. Keeps anything from pulling thru the floor. A friend had a lightweight loop under his 65 Coronet. It broke a Yoke in 3rd gear. Ripped that loop off and tore a good size hole in the floor tunnel.
Doug

The extra plates or at least some heavy duty washers on top are a good idea, thanks.

 

[fullmetaljacket]

The extra plates or at least some heavy duty washers on top are a good idea, thanks.

I look at drive shaft loops the same way as blow proof bell housings from back in the day. I used to run a Lakewood two piece steel bell housing in my stick car and I must admit that the ability to easily service the clutch and flywheel was a nice convenience, but at what price now knowing what could happen? I also used to run a two piece drive shaft loop in that same combo.
Bell housings are now required to be a one piece instead of the old two piece since I guess they figured out that in the case of a flywheel buzz saw runaway or clutch explosion, all those grade 8 bolts (14 or more of them)were not strong enough, so it was mandated to be a one piece. With that being said, I'm surprised that shaft loops are still two piece bolted units that somehow can keep a giant drill bit from boring a hole into the car.
In respect to Rmchrgr's point, eight grade #8 bolts should be strong enough (shear wise) for the job, but why not also go one step further and weld the pieces together anyway.

In going with the subject, why not have Titanium drive shaft loops mandated like they do now for bell housings. Hard leaving STICK or AUTOMATIC cars should have space age harnessing pieces underneath. If I were rowing a three pedal car in competition, I would invest my dollars in an Apollo Trick Titanium bell housing which would keep the weight down and protect priceless limbs.

I like DVW's eight bolt sandwich plate for the floor. I think any fasteners going through the floor (seat bolts included) should be plated or at least sandwiched with over sized washers to spread the load and up tick the strength. My seat bolts have oversized washers for that very same reason. As far as the driveshaft loop, it is welded to both the floor board and at each ends to the frame connectors. I'm thinking of adding a plan B loop somewhere down there.

With all of this said, I guess the benefits of a carbon fiber shaft aside from its weightlessness is its ability to supposedly self shred into straw during a failure. Only Murphy knows.

 

[fullmetaljacket]

DVW. What do you mean by your friends lightweight loop?
What material was it made out of?

I remember a friend of mine who had an 11 second street driven Road Runner had an aluminum loop that somewhat bolted to the transmission crossmember. I highly suggested against it and that he get rid of it. I don't know if he ever took the advise.

In theory as far as pissing contests in metal comparisons, I guess an aluminum shaft has no chance up against a steel or chrome-moly steel loop system. Now a chrome-moly steel or mild steel shaft is a whole other thing.

 

[dvw]

DVW. What do you mean by your friends lightweight loop?
What material was it made out of?

I remember a friend of mine who had an 11 second street driven Road Runner had an aluminum loop that somewhat bolted to the transmission crossmember. I highly suggested against it and that he get rid of it. I don't know if he ever took the advise.

In theory as far as pissing contests in metal comparisons, I guess an aluminum shaft has no chance up against a steel or chrome-moly steel loop system. Now a chrome-moly steel or mild steel shaft is a whole other thing.

It was steel. But pretty thin,1/8"-3/16". Only 2 bolts as well. It was pretty violent. It bent the output shaft of the 727 about 20 degrees.
Doug

 

[fullmetaljacket]

It was steel. But pretty thin,1/8"-3/16". Only 2 bolts as well. It was pretty violent. It bent the output shaft of the 727 about 20 degrees.
Doug

Talk about Jack The Ripper. Safety first.

 

[fullmetaljacket]

Can it be believed that this project is still ongoing after so long?

Every now and then a moment presents itself within a busy life to add or subtract something of significance. Today was that moment.
Hovering at the highest point above region #3 is the rear window and on sedans such as this, they can weigh a nice amount. Earlier today at my friends shop, this came out in one piece in exchange for a new incoming Corning tempered lightweight piece. Kramer Automotive industries has a few of these lightweight panes in his stash and supplied one along with a new gasket.

Though weight should not be tampered with in this area with the exception that if it's done right, that weight can be distributed to where it does most best. I guess if the factory FX cars could do it, why not.

Breaking News: Without giving away the beginning nor the end, I'm excited that a very early B-body is going to be joining the F.A.S.T gang ranks sometime soon. There's already a very quick '63 Plymouth shaking things up, but I'm sure this next one will be interesting, especially that it will be having three pedals.

 

[Cranky]

Can it be believed that this project is still ongoing after so long?

Every now and then a moment presents itself within a busy life to add or subtract something of significance. Today was that moment.
Hovering at the highest point above region #3 is the rear window and on sedans such as this, they can weigh a nice amount. Earlier today it came out in one piece in exchange for a new Corning tempered lightweight piece in its place. Kramer Automotive industries has a few of these in his stash.

Though weight should not be tampered with in this area with the exception that if it's done right, that weight can be distributed to where it does most best.

Breaking News: Without giving away the beginning nor the end, I'm excited that a very early B-body is going to be joining the F.A.S.T rank gang sometime soon. There's already a very quick '63 Plymouth shaking things up, but I'm sure this next one will be interesting, especially that it will be having three pedals.

View attachment 1567892

How much does 8-10 coats of paint weigh? Yup, that's what mine had on it when it came to me. It's all gone now and will probably stay off And was wondering why your trim was missing....thought maybe it was for more weight removal

 

[fullmetaljacket]

How much does 8-10 coats of paint weigh? Yup, that's what mine had on it when it came to me. It's all gone now and will probably stay off And was wondering why your trim was missing....thought maybe it was for more weight removal

LOL. Trim was missing because this was in the midst of doing the job. What is seen here is the factory glass still in place getting ready to be removed.
The trim and gasket Channel are in perfect condition.

 

[fullmetaljacket]

Glass came out without much resistance. Actual gasket was in very good condition. Reusable if needed, but I'm going to use the new one.

 

[fullmetaljacket]

Original sedan glass piece (including the decal LOL) weighed 22-1/8 lbs. I suspect a hardtop glass piece which makes up a good portion of the C-pillar, weighs much more.

 

[fullmetaljacket]

The new Corning tempered glass piece weighs 11-3/4 lbs. A clear 10-1/4 lbs savings and an opportunity for repositioning that same weight in its entirety or less lower and more rearward in the car.