Torsion bar adjustment and new ball joints

[Gldwing57]

(Long post) Recently replaced upper and lower ball joints on 68 Charger. Never fooled with adjustment on control arms. Car drove great before, the only thing, you could tell one of the tires was toed out some and there was a little slack in one of the ball joints, but decided to go ahead and replace all since I had it apart.
After replacing ball joints, let it back down and the wheels are toed out so far you can't really even drive it. I went back over everything, all seems tight and in place. I then called the guy that I bought it off of and asked him if he had any ideas. He told me that he had ajusted the torsion bars way down because the car had set for a while before he put the engine in it and i seemed way too high. I do know that he did a brake conversion to rotors on the front; but like I said, it drove fine before replacing the ball joints.
My question is, will bringing down or loosing the torsion bars a lot cause a big offset in the tires? All I have read says it will make some difference and to make sure you get it where you want it before you align it. The only thing that has really changed is that now it has 4 new ball joints in it.
This one has me scratching my head because I can't see what would have thrown the alignment out that much by just replacing the ball joints and everything else being the same.
Thanks for any input. I love this sight, you guys are a wealth of information and every comment is greatly appreciated. If I ever miss anyone on a reply, I did not do it intentionally.

 

[Cranky]

Were the bushings changed out too? If so, they should left a bit loose until the car is at or close to ride height. If the camber isn't real bad, just set the toe and take it to an alignment shop. Setting the toe isn't hard but need to pay attention to where your steering wheel is at while doing it. No big deal if it isn't perfect since you will be taking it to a shop? Anytime the car is raised or lowered, it's going to change your alignment some but usually not real drastically.

 

[khryslerkid]

When you let the car down off the Jack's did you roll it back to let the suspension settle. It will look goofy if you don't.

 

[super-bee_ski]

Hmm,
I have played with the Torsion Bar setup on my Bee a few times
One question first:
where did the Ball joints come from?
A certified supplier?
Guaranteed exact replacement?
I have difficulty understanding how much difference in a R&R (Remove and Replace)

 

[Gldwing57]

Were the bushings changed out too? If so, they should left a bit loose until the car is at or close to ride height. If the camber isn't real bad, just set the toe and take it to an alignment shop. Setting the toe isn't hard but need to pay attention to where your steering wheel is at while doing it. No big deal if it isn't perfect since you will be taking it to a shop? Anytime the car is raised or lowered, it's going to change your alignment some but usually not real drastically.

N nothing else change. I actually rode it about an 1/ mile and noticed how bad it was. Doesnt really look bad till you move it off jack/ stands

 

[Gldwing57]

When you let the car down off the Jack's did you roll it back to let the suspension settle. It will look goofy if you don't.

Didnt look real bad till I move it.. then both tires bowed out at bottom.

 

[Cranky]

Didnt look real bad till I move it.. then both tires bowed out at bottom.

That's not toe out....that's camber. Were the upper control arms loose? You set camber and caster with the upper control arms and then the toe is set with the tie rods.

 

[Gldwing57]

Hmm,
I have played with the Torsion Bar setup on my Bee a few times
One question first:
where did the Ball joints come from?
A certified supplier?
Guaranteed exact replacement?
I have difficulty understanding how much difference in a R&R (Remove and Replace)

I purchased from Rock Auto, the best ones they had.
since then talked to local aligment shop and a mechanic and both are telling me its not uncommon these days to have to have an alignment after R?R ball joints. That it can even thow it out to the extent Im talking.
Im going to try set things myself enough to get to local alignment shop. Its aboout 10 miles away and hopefully that will solve problem. People who understand this stuff its simple and I get the toe in peice but the camber/ castor throws me a loop on Mopar lol

 

[Gldwing57]

That's not toe out....that's camber. Were the upper control arms loose? You set camber and caster with the upper control arms and then the toe is set with the tie rods.

Yes you are correct...it is camber ..No upper control arms are ok.
I have been told by local alignment shop that its not uncommon to have this problem on R/R ball joints. Like I was saying it all sems tight now.
So Im going to try to set it myself enough to get to local alignment shop. I know the folks there and they are car people to and mess with this stuff. Hopefully alignment will do trick..
Thanks for reply

 

[PST]

What is the condition of your lower control arm bushings? These are the bushings that the pivot shafts are pressed into. 9 times of 10 these are the issue and are indicative of the symptoms that you are describing.

James From
PST

 

[WileE]

Doing things willy-nilly always causes problems. Did you follow the FSM procedures ? Did you check the LCA bushings ? Did you set ride-height ?

 

[dadsbee]

As James (PST) points out above, have a good look in there. I bet, like James, that your LCA pivot bushings are rotted and fawked...

 

[69_Coronet]

I would just want to add that changing the lower control arm bushings (which I have just finished) requires pulling a good bit of your front suspension apart. If you change some of the other parts, you may have to pull them apart again later to do the LCA bushings. I did mine separately after updating the rest of the front suspension previously and made a bunch of extra work for myself. Since the bushings are cheap and not that hard to change if you know the tricks, I would suggest changing them as part of an overall suspension servicing. Cheers!

 

[Gldwing57]

What is the condition of your lower control arm bushings? These are the bushings that the pivot shafts are pressed into. 9 times of 10 these are the issue and are indicative of the symptoms that you are describing.

James From
PST

Luckily a trip alignment shop took care of problem.
I have a little play in steering box but it aligned up good and drives great.

Thanks for reply

 

[Gldwing57]

As James (PST) points out above, have a good look in there. I bet, like James, that your LCA pivot bushings are rotted and fawked...
View attachment 1245061 View attachment 1245063 View attachment 1245064 View attachment 1245065

Thanks for photos but trip to alignment shop did the trick.

I appreciate your time.

Thanks Patrick