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Trying to get better braking out of my 67 GTX 11” drums

AR67GTX

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This is becoming a long and expensive saga. Started out with noticing stopping power had gotten really sluggish in the car that had 100% of the brake system replaced 20 years ago. Just about the only used item was a booster I picked up. I installed brakes from the Praise Dyno Brake outfit back then which may or may not have become Muscle Car Brakes.

From a vacuum test, that I now suspect of being a bogus test method, I thought the booster had gone bad. I had the booster rebuilt by Harmon and reinstalled and no improvement.

Finally looked in brake master and the rear bowl was clear but the back bowl was brown, rusty mud. Tried to clean it out and the ports had been blocked to the front so no front brakes at all. Bought a new casting, correct style master and installed it after bench bleeding. Flushed the lines, got good clean fluid at all wheel cylinders and no leaks and firm pedal. Adjusted all wheels. Better breaking but still feels weak, especially compared to my 66 Satellite with the same 11” brakes, but no PB, and it stops very, very well. But I have no idea what brake shoes the PO put on it.

All lines are new, hoses were replaced, wheel cylinders were replaced. The Praise Dyno linings got roasted back 20 years ago due to not enough return of the Master Cylinder push rod. After figuring that out and adjusting I found some of the shoes were cracked. Praise Dyno said it wouldn’t hurt anything but now I’m not so sure.

So my next step would seem to be to try some new 11” shoes, but what type and brand? This is a cruiser and doesn’t get any severe use. I want a good shoe that works well cold and warm and I’m not sure if that should be organic or ceramics at this point.

Any suggestions?
 
Start with the shoes. Cracked shoes mean they were overheated. Once severely overheated they become to hard and brittle. At that point their effectiveness is lessened. As far as shoes discuss that with the brake vendor that posts here.
 
This all is the reason that I switched to silicone brake fluid. Regular DOT 4 absorbs water/moisture and then leaking and destroying paint. But, it's your car.
 
This is becoming a long and expensive saga. Started out with noticing stopping power had gotten really sluggish in the car that had 100% of the brake system replaced 20 years ago. Just about the only used item was a booster I picked up. I installed brakes from the Praise Dyno Brake outfit back then which may or may not have become Muscle Car Brakes.

From a vacuum test, that I now suspect of being a bogus test method, I thought the booster had gone bad. I had the booster rebuilt by Harmon and reinstalled and no improvement.

Finally looked in brake master and the rear bowl was clear but the back bowl was brown, rusty mud. Tried to clean it out and the ports had been blocked to the front so no front brakes at all. Bought a new casting, correct style master and installed it after bench bleeding. Flushed the lines, got good clean fluid at all wheel cylinders and no leaks and firm pedal. Adjusted all wheels. Better breaking but still feels weak, especially compared to my 66 Satellite with the same 11” brakes, but no PB, and it stops very, very well. But I have no idea what brake shoes the PO put on it.

All lines are new, hoses were replaced, wheel cylinders were replaced. The Praise Dyno linings got roasted back 20 years ago due to not enough return of the Master Cylinder push rod. After figuring that out and adjusting I found some of the shoes were cracked. Praise Dyno said it wouldn’t hurt anything but now I’m not so sure.

So my next step would seem to be to try some new 11” shoes, but what type and brand? This is a cruiser and doesn’t get any severe use. I want a good shoe that works well cold and warm and I’m not sure if that should be organic or ceramics at this point.

Any suggestions?
One other item often overlooked is drum diameter. Through the years I have found that the closer to the stock uncut diameter they are the better the brakes work. The old style way we used to do a brake job was to arc grind the shoes to fit the drums. A practice that was pretty much stopped due to health concerns.
 
Start with the shoes. Cracked shoes mean they were overheated. Once severely overheated they become to hard and brittle. At that point their effectiveness is lessened. As far as shoes discuss that with the brake vendor that posts here.

Yeah, that’s what I’ve been wondering for some time. The linings just don’t seem to have any bite.

One other item often overlooked is drum diameter. Through the years I have found that the closer to the stock uncut diameter they are the better the brakes work. The old style way we used to do a brake job was to arc grind the shoes to fit the drums. A practice that was pretty much stopped due to health concerns.

That is one other thing that was not all new in the brakes. I believe I had them all turned and I want to say they were all in spec, but I got another set of front drums with the used brake booster and I must have found them a little less used as I put them on the front. 20 years ago is quite awhile. But the car probably doesn’t have but another 3 or 4,000 miles on it. Still have the other set up in the attic. But, that’s another thing I need to check again when I find some new shoes.

I drove both the non-PB 11” brake Satellite and the PB 11” brake GTX back to back this morning and the difference in braking between the two is night and day. I don’t think the GTX could lock up a tire with both feet on the pedal. So something is wrong somewhere.

Thanks.
 
I remember some discussion when @moparedtn did his brakes. I think he located all original parts.
If you can get them, no substitute for original parts. When I bought Baby Blue the second time in 2013, I had a leaky master cylinder I replaced with a good reproduction of the original Bendix unit. Car still had the original drums, and asbestos brake linings my friend Bob had installed at 80,000 miles before he sold me the car in 1983. The guys at the shop who did my Pennsylvania state inspection were awestruck seeing the real deal linings, and told me to never change them if possible, they were amazed at the performance when they test drove my "antique."
 
I’ll do some looking around and see if I can find any. I don’t think I want to try any more of the expensive, miracle brakes like the old Praise Dyno brakes in a box were supposed to be.
 
I remember some discussion when @moparedtn did his brakes. I think he located all original parts.
The shoes were actually the toughest part - the only source for any new asbestos ones is the guy/vendor who pops in threads
here sometimes and has some apparently, but he doesn't do CC or PayPal, so we didn't do business.
I've got some Porterfield "racing" shoes on Fred right now that were made to order by them- I wish I could
have come up with asbestos ones, though.
 
Yeah, that guy. Be prepared to pay cash.
I paid him by check & he sent me parts promptly, I understand wanting to use a credit card to protect yourself but I also understand a guy who dabbles in vintage parts not wanting to deal with credit cards... Not so much money I wasn't willing to trust a man with a good reputation...
 
Based on the years here, what Craig has been through the past year or so and ZERO bad posts about him... I'd send him Cash in an envelope....
 
I don’t mind sending a check. Did business that way for many years. Worse think about doing it now are the thieves in USPS.
 
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