Why no Plymouth version of the Charger?

[YY1]

It's easy to understand-

Model (and basic price class) hierarchy

Mopar-

Imperial (while it existed)
Chrysler
Dodge
Plymouth

ford-

lincoln
mercury
ford

gm-

cadilac
lasalle (while it existed)
buick
oldmobile
pontiac
chevrolet

 

[YY1]

Oops, should have added (while it existed) after Plymouth and mercury, too.

...and olds...and pontiac...

 

[chargervert]

In my opinion, it was Dodge that was always playing catch up in the muscle car wars. Sure, the Coronet was a good seller, but in the grocery getter ranks. That’s not to say that the satellite wasn’t doing just as good. But the GTX was top dog in 67, and the R/T was a pretty distant 2nd. Same with the Roadrunner in 68, Dodge hadn’t even finished the concept of the Superbee. 70/71 Cudas far outclassed the Challenger, Duster blew the Demon out of the water, but the Charger was a unique concept thst Plymouth simply couldn’t compete with, nor should they have. To me it would’ve been a copy of an original, and no copy could compare to this particular original. And this is coming from a person who doesn’t like Chargers, and never has. Sometimes, little brother needs attention too!

The Challenger was classier than the Cuda,and outsold Cuda 2 to 1 every year of production.

 

[YY1]

Yes, those comments are very subjective.

For the most part the rest of this thread has been pretty factual.

 

[cosgig]

The Challenger was classier than the Cuda,and outsold Cuda 2 to 1 every year of production.

I guess my opinion is a little slanted, if only because I judge the Challenger and Cuda based on their complete history. Meaning, while the Challenger made have sold better, it also lended itself to 2nd place overall because of it. It seems to me that now, the Cuda is more “popular” or sought after because of its 2nd place showing in the sales dept. Of course, the Charger did not experience this, because it not only sold well, it has maintained its status as the most desireable “mass produced” Chrysler muscle car product. And rightly so, it’s a great looking car, and was helped to stay in the spotlight through the generations in movies and TV with Bullit, Dirty Mary, and the Dukes. I don’t know of another Chrysler product that’s had that much exposure through the years, and to the level of The Dukes. If there’s another, show me the lunchbox and I’ll step down!

 

[68BabyBlue]

I guess my opinion is a little slanted, if only because I judge the Challenger and Cuda based on their complete history. Meaning, while the Challenger made have sold better, it also lended itself to 2nd place overall because of it. It seems to me that now, the Cuda is more “popular” or sought after because of its 2nd place showing in the sales dept. Of course, the Charger did not experience this, because it not only sold well, it has maintained its status as the most desireable “mass produced” Chrysler muscle car product. And rightly so, it’s a great looking car, and was helped to stay in the spotlight through the generations in movies and TV with Bullit, Dirty Mary, and the Dukes. I don’t know of another Chrysler product that’s had that much exposure through the years, and to the level of The Dukes. If there’s another, show me the lunchbox and I’ll step down!

Well spoken, and you and I are both Plymouth guys, for better or worse.

 

[Dave6T4]

The main thing is: we are all Mopar guys. Although I poked a little fun at the Plymouth guys, I do like and respect them and their choice of rides. I once missed out on a local one-owner 1967 GTX. It was a 440, 4-speed, Dana 60 hardtop in light blue metallic, with dark blue no console interior. This was about 45 years ago, and I still kick myself about it ocassionally. The wosrt part is that through successive owners over the years, it stayed local, and I had to watch it decline to being just a parts car. If I had bought it, I might have had a shop full of Plymouths instead of Dodges. At one time, I owned 4 '60's Dodges, plus 2 or 3 parts cars. I have whittled that down to a more manageable 2 now.

 

[eldubb440]

the fact that Plymouth no longer exists makes it even cooler

 

[Budnicks]

No real Plymouth B-body fastback
the Superbird got the areo window & wing & a nose
about as fastback as it got in B-body for Plymouth

Demon/Dart with perf. stuff

Duster 340, looks pretty fast-backy

another fast-backy A-body
my personal favorite a 68 Formula S 383 4bbl 4 speed

 

[Dave6T4]

Yes, Plymouth is an orphan, like so many other recent makes; Desoto, Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Mercury. Others are hanging in there, mere shadows of their former selves. I am thinking Buick, Lincoln, Chrysler, and even our beloved Dodge. With all the advances these once revered makes made to the American automotive scene, it is hard to accept that they are all dead or dying, and the lowly VW, Toyota, and Datsun (Nissan) have survived. We stood and watched as the British automotive industry withered and died on the vine, and now it has happened to us. Can anyone say, Exceptionally Bad Management"?

 

[440 4 speed]

From my experience (though limited to 1939-1942
Plymouth trucks), the fit and finish, along with styling
cues of Plymouth far outweighed those of the Dodge
brand. With Plymouth being more of a specialized
build. Though parts are interchangeable, the Plymouth
production parts just seem to be of higher quantity.

Generally speaking, our Fargo trucks were better finished, options etc than Dodge. This carried on until the end of Fargo in my opinion, I have seen two 426 wedge trucks, no Dodge, IIRC.

 

[cosgig]

Well spoken, and you and I are both Plymouth guys, for better or worse.

Well, great minds do think alike. And, birds of a feather flock together……..Ok, that’s basically all I got!

In all reality, my brother and I talk about this often. He’s always been all Dodge, I’ve always been all Plymouth. But it’s not planned that way, and we each just love old Mopars, all old Mopars.

 

[440 4 speed]

Yes, Plymouth is an orphan, like so many other recent makes; Desoto, Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Mercury. Others are hanging in there, mere shadows of their former selves. I am thinking Buick, Lincoln, Chrysler, and even our beloved Dodge. With all the advances these once revered makes made to the American automotive scene, it is hard to accept that they are all dead or dying, and the lowly VW, Toyota, and Datsun (Nissan) have survived. We stood and watched as the British automotive industry withered and died on the vine, and now it has happened to us. Can anyone say, Exceptionally Bad Management"?

What about Monarch, Meteor and Comet?

 

[440 PHIXX]

I like some Dodges and some Plymouths. It depends.

 

[440 PHIXX]

It's easy to understand-

Model (and basic price class) hierarchy

Mopar-

Imperial (while it existed)
Chrysler
Dodge
Plymouth

ford-

lincoln
mercury
ford

gm-

cadilac
lasalle (while it existed)
buick
oldmobile
pontiac
chevrolet

You forgot Edsel. It was between Ford and Mercury. ;^}

 

[Dave6T4]

What about Monarch, Meteor and Comet?

Only us few Canadians ever heard of them. ...and Frontenac, Acadian, Fargo

 

[Budnicks]

Can anyone say, Exceptionally Bad Management"?

& them striking a lot, UAW here...
will add something like another $5k USD to ever car off the lines price
$55+ befefits
their greed is one factor,
the people on top, get a lot for driving the co. into the ground

With all the advances these once revered makes made to the American automotive scene, it is hard to accept that they are all dead or dying, and the lowly VW, Toyota, and Datsun (Nissan) have survived.

In right-to-work states here, keep them (Toyota/Nissan) affordable
or a bit more, more profitable too, for the father co.s & the stock holders
everything sold here is built/produced here,
Every build gets approved by higher-ups/here & there
even if the most of the profits go back to Japan, 'father companies'
(or Mothership if you like)
& they market the **** out of them, they don't skimp...

Old business advert. adage was, spend advertising $$$,
every $1 spent you make $4-$5 or more back, that was 20 years
Now what I've seen, it's more like $1 spent $7-$8 or more back now
& they still have to market it more than ever...

You see a shitload of locals dealership commercials
not as many corporate Big 3 car builders adds

Toyota/Lexus & Nissan/Infinity they are More American made now
than most any of the big 3, Ford, Stelantis/Chrysler, GM
even if you include Canadian facilities
many are made in & assembled in Mexico,
cheap/er (far cheaper) labor so they can survive
our insurance & taxes here are brutal, taxes in Canada are even worse
It's hard to compete with their labor rates, when we spend 40%+ more
just to keep the doors open, in various insurances & taxes
Hell just workman's comp here is like $20/per hundred paid,
that's 20% right off the top of your bottom line
more if they have a bad record of injuries, even in a huge labor pool
even if they were to buy/average over 100,000 policies
& ours rates to keep a brick & motar business open
propery taxes
& still be competitive/profitable, especially with Govt. Mandates
or the strikes that killed their 4 th qtr profits for investors & the Mother ship
When electronics & chips from China/Taiwan-Chinese Tipai,
many foreign parts/suppliers, it's nothing like it once was
a few holdouts still in the American/Canadian mnfrs/suppliers...
Especially with 40% real inflation today...
not the BS #'s posted in the news, that doesn't include
gas, groceries, rent/mortgage or extortion rates for shipping costs now,
ups some 40%-70% depends on what & where, or with them coming down
on diesel rigs regs either...
Now you can use a coal-fired train to feed the electric generators
that move much of the stuff... & pay carbon penalties

It's a long list of regs & reasons...

American cars aren't really made in America much anymore

I did see the Ohio Jeep plant was going gangbusters again
supposedly they will build the new Ram-Dakota, there too

My $1.25

 

[440 4 speed]

& them striking a lot, UAW here...
will add something like another $5k USD to ever car off the lines price
$55+ befefits
their greed is one factor,
the people on top, get a lot for driving the co. into the ground


In right-to-work states here, keep them (Toyota/Nissan) affordable
or a bit more, more profitable too, for the father co.s & the stock holders
everything sold here is built/produced here,
Every build gets approved by higher-ups/here & there
even if the most of the profits go back to Japan, 'father companies'
(or Mothership if you like)
& they market the **** out of them, they don't skimp...

Old business advert. adage was, spend advertising $$$,
every $1 spent you make $4-$5 or more back, that was 20 years
Now what I've seen, it's more like $1 spent $7-$8 or more back now
& they still have to market it more than ever...

You see a shitload of locals dealership commercials
not as many corporate Big 3 car builders adds

Toyota/Lexus & Nissan/Infinity they are More American made now
than most any of the big 3, Ford, Stelantis/Chrysler, GM
even if you include Canadian facilities
many are made in & assembled in Mexico,
cheap/er (far cheaper) labor so they can survive
our insurance & taxes here are brutal, taxes in Canada are even worse
It's hard to compete with their labor rates, when we spend 40%+ more
just to keep the doors open, in various insurances & taxes
Hell just workman's comp here is like $20/per hundred paid,
that's 20% right off the top of your bottom line
more if they have a bad record of injuries, even in a huge labor pool
even if they were to buy/average over 100,000 policies
& ours rates to keep a brick & motar business open
propery taxes
& still be competitive/profitable, especially with Govt. Mandates
or the strikes that killed their 4 th qtr profits for investors & the Mother ship
When electronics & chips from China/Taiwan-Chinese Tipai,
many foreign parts/suppliers, it's nothing like it once was
a few holdouts still in the American/Canadian mnfrs/suppliers...
Especially with 40% real inflation today...
not the BS #'s posted in the news, that doesn't include
gas, groceries, rent/mortgage or extortion rates for shipping costs now,
ups some 40%-70% depends on what & where, or with them coming down
on diesel rigs regs either...
Now you can use a coal-fired train to feed the electric generators
that move much of the stuff... & pay carbon penalties

It's a long list of regs & reasons...

American cars aren't really made in America much anymore

I did see the Ohio Jeep plant was going gangbusters again
supposedly they will build the new Ram-Dakota, there too

My $1.25

Our 2006 4Runner was sold in the US but mfg in Japan.

 

[eldubb440]

if Plymouth is the bottom feeder......... why does my 68 GTX have a nice solid tail panel, and the 68 Coronet R/T have a shitty piece of tin?

not a fan of the woodgrain, but GTX got it in 68 along with the stainless trim on the door panels

 

[Larrry B.]

Out of what could be considered the most desirable years for a B-body, the only mopar that won car of the year was a road runner. You could get a 225 in a charger. Not in a road runner. I never thought Plymouth needed a version of a charger.