10" Drum Vs. Disc Brakes

[Bladecutter]

No one as ever faded a disc setup? And the best no fade brakes in the world ain't going to stop you any faster if your tires ain't up to the task. One good example are bracket racers locking up the fronts trying not to break out. There's an S curve on a nice wide road just a few miles from me and seems like every weekend, there's straight line tire marks where someone went into curve too fast and jumped on the brakes. You can tell by the marks that they didn't spin out but went straight off the road when they locked them up. Another argument for ABS? I hate that mess! My last drag car had Wilwoods disc all around. It was 8 mph faster (134) than my previous car that had upgraded (better shoes) 11" drums and the drum car stopped better than the one with the Wilwoods. Does 8 mph make that much of a difference? The drum car was run on an old track with a short shutoff road yet it could still make the first turn off if needed. Had to lay on em to do it but I wanted to know it could if needed plus I just wanted to know how good it could stop. That old Houston International track where I raced was built in 57 only had two turnoffs. If you couldn't make the 2nd one, the only option was the weeds which already had a nice looking dirt road at the end lol and no sand trap. The disc brake car was ran at the new track in Baytown. Can't tell you the footage from the finish line to the first turnoff between the two tracks but I know for sure the distance to it at the new track was shorter but I'm pretty sure neither car could do it. Didn't even want to try it....

I was using the word fade in a figurative context....not literal....to mean that one can't knock having as good of brakes as possible.
Yeah, I don't like ABS either.

 

[Fran Blacker]

Rented a Lincoln Town car faded those brakes after going over Tioga Pass in Ca.. Trying to make Lake Tahoe before dark. After a couple of hard slow downs I thought I'd just take my time. Those 1000'+ drop off made me think what's the rush. Driving a non ABS car saved me. Some clown turn in front of me had about 4 car lengths to avoid him, no way to stop. At the last second I saw a picture in my head there wasn't anybody in his lane behind him. Everything was going in slow motion. So I cut the wheel and slid at a 45 degree angle just short of his door and was able to go around him or her in wrong lane. Wouldn't have been able do it
with ABS.

 

[dual fours]

Were not ABS designed for aircraft in the beginning?

 

[Ranger16]

Were not ABS designed for aircraft in the beginning?

Yes. Aircraft had them loooong before cars did. We called it "anti-skid".

I still have the manual OEM 11" drums on my '69 Road Runner. It too is a cruiser so no real need for discs. I can lock 'em up if needed and though it may take a bit more pedal pressure, you can't ask for much more than that.

 

[Cranky]

Bingo! The brakes are only as good as the contact patch.

Rented a Lincoln Town car faded those brakes after going over Tioga Pass in Ca.. Trying to make Lake Tahoe before dark. After a couple of hard slow downs I thought I'd just take my time. Those 1000'+ drop off made me think what's the rush. Driving a non ABS car saved me. Some clown turn in front of me had about 4 car lengths to avoid him, no way to stop. At the last second I saw a picture in my head there wasn't anybody in his lane behind him. Everything was going in slow motion. So I cut the wheel and slid at a 45 degree angle just short of his door and was able to go around him or her in wrong lane. Wouldn't have been able do it
with ABS.

I've been in a couple of situations like that. One of the times I was driving a 71 VW. That car taught me how much I hate rear engine cars especially on slick roads! Missed this guy in a pickup by what seemed like .001" and ended up sliding sideways on the shoulder with the tail looking at the ditch but managed to nail the throttle (for what that's worth) and got back on the road before hitting anything. He had stopped to make a left turn and was glad the guy in the other lane next to me saw what was going down and gave me room to do that evasive maneuver. Driving too fast for the conditions and not paying close enough attention made that my fault. Said thank you to the guy that gave me the room to move and sold that VW shortly after lol. There's just no traction on the front end on a wet road. Another time when going into a traffic circle in wet weather it didn't want to turn and I wasn't even going all that fast. No one else was close but I thought for a moment that it was going to put me over the curb and out in the middle of the grass and was just about to turn the wheel straight to make it go over the curb without tucking the wheel under.....and that's when it decided to gain traction and do the turn. Got off the gas for what seemed like minutes and it just going straight. Dang thing even had fairly new tires in it. That 71 SB was my one and only rear engine car.

 

[ws23jrt]

This talk about drums vs disc reminded me of my 69 superbee that I bought new. It had drums.
I was going stupid fast (140mph?)on a freeway one time in the left lane. A guy in the right lane changed to the left in front of me to pass 70mph traffic.
I hit the brakes hard and lost speed to about 110mph but after that with both feet hard on the brake pedal I was no longer slowing down.
Swerving to my left onto the gravel shoulder I passed this guy at a hundred mph essentially without brakes. I had steering only that got me past that stupid stunt.--A lesson learned about the stock drum brakes for me--
My thinking was --the brakes should work until one gets to zero speed.

 

[5.7 hemi]

Drums have more surface area and work really well. The problem is heat, and there is a company in LA that drills the drums to let that heat escape.
Someone posted about it a long time ago, but I can't find it.

 

[Cranky]

This talk about drums vs disc reminded me of my 69 superbee that I bought new. It had drums.
I was going stupid fast (140mph?)on a freeway one time in the left lane. A guy in the right lane changed to the left in front of me to pass 70mph traffic.
I hit the brakes hard and lost speed to about 110mph but after that with both feet hard on the brake pedal I was no longer slowing down.
Swerving to my left onto the gravel shoulder I passed this guy at a hundred mph essentially without brakes. I had steering only that got me past that stupid stunt.--A lesson learned about the stock drum brakes for me--
My thinking was --the brakes should work until one gets to zero speed.

I believe it was mentioned earlier in this thread that the factory brakes and shocks were nothing more than the cheapest stuff that could be bought. The shocks were literally 2 dollar shocks and the brake linings weren't much better.........and that crap would stop the car and control the suspension in 'normal' normal driving conditions. Monroe shocks and Raybestos brakes were the ones we usually changed to as soon as possible. Now a days the field is a lot bigger for good shocks and brakes drum included.

 

[ws23jrt]

Drums have more surface area and work really well. The problem is heat, and there is a company in LA that drills the drums to let that heat escape.
Someone posted about it a long time ago, but I can't find it.

I agree with the surface area as being a plus in how brakes work.
In fact it is the gasses that the heat makes that acts as a lube. Getting rid of that -gas layer- through holes is more accurate as to what is going on with drilling holes.
This is the first time I have heard about drilling drums to vent the gasses. I'd like to read more about that.

 

[5.7 hemi]

Let me see if I can dig it up.

 

[5.7 hemi]

chtopping.com

 

[GetX'd]

I went from stock drums to front wheel discs. Bought the Right Stuff package from Summit. There's a difference in stopping response. And I like it. Haven't tested at high speed stopping and don't really plan on it. Was just looking to upgrade during the restore. I actually bought the 4 wheel package but couldn't fit the back one on because of back spacing on the new wheels I bought. Sold the backs and just went with the front. My racing days are over. But I still like the feel and response.

 

[Fran Blacker]

This talk about drums vs disc reminded me of my 69 superbee that I bought new. It had drums.
I was going stupid fast (140mph?)on a freeway one time in the left lane. A guy in the right lane changed to the left in front of me to pass 70mph traffic.
I hit the brakes hard and lost speed to about 110mph but after that with both feet hard on the brake pedal I was no longer slowing down.
Swerving to my left onto the gravel shoulder I passed this guy at a hundred mph essentially without brakes. I had steering only that got me past that stupid stunt.--A lesson learned about the stock drum brakes for me--
My thinking was --the brakes should work until one gets to zero speed.

Oregon Got $117 speeding fine out of me. On board radar dam. Had to laugh at the amount speeding tickets in Ct start at $163 but just the beginning. If they hit you with endangering a vehicle's occupant $213 and there's what they call multipliers it can be as high as $413, ouch. It depend what did and how bad you did it.

 

[ws23jrt]

I believe it was mentioned earlier in this thread that the factory brakes and shocks were nothing more than the cheapest stuff that could be bought. The shocks were literally 2 dollar shocks and the brake linings weren't much better.........and that crap would stop the car and control the suspension in 'normal' normal driving conditions. Monroe shocks and Raybestos brakes were the ones we usually changed to as soon as possible. Now a days the field is a lot bigger for good shocks and brakes drum included.

Thanks --- I did not read the whole thread as it was sorta old.
It's a good reminder for those that want to make their old bbody like it was the day it was made to be aware of the limitations they had as built.
My hellcat for example will stop harder than it will accelerate over and over(cause it's not 4 wheel drive). Todays cars are more complete -performance/safety wise.

 

[ws23jrt]

Oregon Got $117 speeding fine out of me. On board radar dam. Had to laugh at the amount speeding tickets in Ct start at $163 but just the beginning. If they hit you with endangering a vehicle's occupant $213 and there's what they call multipliers it can be as high as $413, ouch. It depend what did and how bad you did it.

I know alot about oregon's traffic laws. (from years ago) I got over 85 traffic tickets in the sixties and seventies here. --- Was a hotrod dodge fan from the start.

 

[Ranger16]

I don't think anyone would argue the point that if you are going to drive in excess of 100 MPH, you should have disc brakes.

 

[Cranky]

I don't think anyone would argue the point that if you are going to drive in excess of 100 MPH, you should have disc brakes.

I think many of us did exactly that back in the day with drums lol. Nowadays, I have to be out in the middle of nowhere to go over 80. There's just too much traffic around here. Back in 71 when I-10 was new between Houston and San Antonio, I averaged 100 going from Lackland AFB (west side of SA) to Pasadena Tx (east of Houston). There's no way you could do that now even in the middle of the night. But even back then, my cars had good brakes on it. The factory junk was just that...junk.

 

[Bladecutter]

This talk about drums vs disc reminded me of my 69 superbee that I bought new. It had drums.
I was going stupid fast (140mph?)on a freeway one time in the left lane. A guy in the right lane changed to the left in front of me to pass 70mph traffic.
I hit the brakes hard and lost speed to about 110mph but after that with both feet hard on the brake pedal I was no longer slowing down.
Swerving to my left onto the gravel shoulder I passed this guy at a hundred mph essentially without brakes. I had steering only that got me past that stupid stunt.--A lesson learned about the stock drum brakes for me--
My thinking was --the brakes should work until one gets to zero speed.

I was in a similar scenario in left lane of freeway, driving my Friend's spank new Saab 900 turbo doing 120.....dweeb up ahead in next lane to right...had NO traffic in front of him just decides to change to fast lane in front of me...non ABS Saab....my heart sank, but I didn't just stab brake.....as soon as I got the pedal feel, i relaxed, baby just hauled down straight as an arrow w/o lock up. We made a point of haranguing the **** out of the two ******** in the muskrat ll. Drums may have more surface area, but they are **** in wet & even with dissapation holes, they still can't shed heat as efficiently as vented & drilled rotors imho. I'll always choose disc over drum.