440 rebuild advise

[Aussieguysyd]

GDay guys there is great information on the site for our Beasts and great members . Just a quick message and advise relating to my 1970 RT/SE Charger 4 speed rebuild . I'm currently in a long restoration and wanting advise on what quality parts have been used on a full engine rebuild . I have the original block and 906 heads only for my rebuild. I'm wanting to have the engine last for many many years as it will be handed down to my children at some stage . I have been reading about top end components and the one brand that comes up a lot is Trick Flow , and I'm aware the hardware is expensive but in the long run I think it would be a better option to spend a bit more . I'm not interested in Chinese crap and will always purchase American made being an Aussie. I have looked at bottom end assemblies and Callies comes up as well ,so just wondering if I'm on the right track to build a reliable beast. Would much appreciate any input from you guys .

 

[myk r sanchez]

What are your specific goals for the engine and the car? When you say "beast" are you looking for a 10 second quarter mile car? What's the budget? The budget alone will tell you what you'll actually be able to do with the engine...

 

[Challenger340]

What I got was this....
Long term longevity, in fact "years and years" with generational transfer to kids ?
American not chinese parts
Reliable beast

If the above is correct.... and many many miles driving are contemplated along the way ?
then it's extremely hard to beat the original 440 Magnum or similar type configuration, from internal geometry/angularity to power curves, a solid 440 build is easily capable of 500+ Ft/Lbs Torque and 450-500 hp on 91 Octane with no issues.

And while many here will immediately point to "strokers" as the answer ?
as an Engine Builder who Machines/Assembles and Dyno's everything we do before they leave, all I can say is show me the 60,000 mile stroker still running quiet with no piston slap or issues ?
and,
I will show you more than a few of these 440's still running strong with no issues !
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,106687.0.html

 

[F4R/T]

Sounds interesting, we need your game plan goals, pure stock class, stroker, trans and final drive ratio the you would like... it all must work together... And most of all thank you for buying American made ! It helps all of us! I met an Aussie in Hawaii, he wrote for some car mags there, you car guys are lot like us! He did say Mopar R series race engines are quiet popular in Corvettes that they race .. I about fell over when he said that.

 

[440Coronet500]

Last year I built a 440 to the 440 HP specifications. I used the stock forged crankshaft and rods with SpeedPro forged pistons. I also used a set of ported 906 heads with larger valves. These combinations have plenty longevity to them and run very well with an electronic ignition system. 440'

 

[justcruisin]

A HP or ET goal will help, but for a good street 440 that has a good compromise on power and reliability is a stock stroke zero deck short block, H beams and 4032 pistons, 240ish @ 50 solid FT cam with a set of worked over edelbrock rpm's/sidewinders or similar, RPM intake 750-850 tunable carb and a set of 1 7/8 TTi's. That will see you at around 10.2:1 and will run fine on pump gas. If your looking for more power you could opt for the TF240 heads but they will put you up around 10.75:1 on a zero deck short block with flat tops and a 0.040" gasket.

 

[Challenger340]

It doesn't get any simpler.... 546 HP and 564 Ft/Lbs Torque
440 .030" over
XE284H
stock Block, Crank & Rods
Forged Pistons
Ported STEALTH Heads
Performer RPM Intake

Like I said earlier, you can read up on the build here
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,106687.0.html

XE274H yields about 486 HP and 550 Ft/Lbs Torque, albeit STEALTH Heads with just a cleanup/V-Grind, but better Vacuum for power brakes
XE268H on same build using cleaned up E-Streets goes 470 HP and 525 Ft/Lbs but using Holley 300-14 Intake for Fuel Injection.

 

[Aussieguysyd]

Thankyou guys for your advice , my budget will be around 8K USD for the parts alone just quality parts , not wanting to drag the car being a 10 second car just a cruiser and if needed extra power when required . Thankyou challenger340 for the pics maybe I should get you to build me an engine and shelf mine .

 

[Challenger340]

Last year I built a 440 to the 440 HP specifications. I used the stock forged crankshaft and rods with SpeedPro forged pistons. I also used a set of ported 906 heads with larger valves. These combinations have plenty longevity to them and run very well with an electronic ignition system. 440'

Which Speed Pro Forged Pistons ? The L2266 ? L2355 ? L2295 ?

 

[440Coronet500]

Pistons were L2355. 440'

 

[tmaleck]

Stay focused, or you'll end up with this:

 

[Challenger340]

Thankyou guys for your advice , my budget will be around 8K USD for the parts alone just quality parts , not wanting to drag the car being a 10 second car just a cruiser and if needed extra power when required . Thankyou challenger340 for the pics maybe I should get you to build me an engine and shelf mine .

$8K USD even today, still pretty much builds any of the 440's I linked to... done, dyno'd and crated, which may be a little off topic here ?
but IMO,
don't buy anything unless it's Dyno'd and proven to your satisfaction even if it means watching the 8 hr Dyno session on a video link.

I see you are in Australia ?
so I don't believe the shipping would be cost effective for us to Machine/Build you a 440 here at our shop, we're just too far away here in Canada.
The purpose of the linked thread was merely to give "ideas" to prove, and show what "can or should be able to be done" in the way of budget 440 builds.... by any competent Shop still around closer to anyone's Geographical location ?
I mean those 440's were not "rocket science".... just solid fundamentals and properly Machined/Built/Dyno'd, albeit they are NOT "money makers" obviously for any Shop.

Good Luck with your Build !

 

[68 HEMI GTS]

10 sec 1/4 miles and something that’ll run for years and years on end are 2 very different goals. Anything that makes that kind of power will require maintenance. At a minimum rings, bearings, valve train parts, etc every so often. If you want something that’s you never touch, I agree with using a 440 with good parts and heads. Just keep in mind even a 440 that makes big power will still need bearing maint if you pound it hard. A 440 with a decent cam and trickflow heads will run in the 11’s if the rest of the combo is right. If you build it like challenger340 is recommending you will have years and years of service life. That’s more of a 12 sec type combo and would be your best bet for longevity.

 

[Fran Blacker]

@Tex013 maybe be able to hook you with an engine builder? His info says Sidney Au. Just remember your goals.

 

[Curiousyellow71]

Nothing wrong with a stock stroke 440... it really depends on how much of the original components that you would like to use. A 440 with its 10.725 deck height has lots of room for a stroker crank and can last like your wanting.. Piston slap is more typical when building a b stroker 400 or 383 or any build with a very short pistons. 440 strokers often run long rods with pistons that have fairly tall compression heights. If your stock parts are in poor shape its often not much money to upgrade and get a complete rotating assembly. As far as a build with stock components a nice upgrade for a 440 is aftermarket rods and lighter pistons. If you go with a stroker crank the pistons and rods are virtually the same money, main difference being added cost of a crankshaft and any machining to make it fit. My thought for Cylinder heads edelbrock would be a good choice for the street. Trick flow 240s are awesome heads and should make more power. My thought for a combo that lasts... the extra power trick flows make certainly puts the engine more at risk. They are more typical for someone wanting a 10 second ride. Edelbrocks are a big step over stock, but comparable to a heavily ported 906, all depends on what you want.

 

[mopar 3 B]

Nothing wrong with stock for longevity.
Why put heavy H beams into a street cruiser?

 

[Curiousyellow71]

Nowadays...good h beams do not weigh more then ly rods, simply stronger. Lots of grams can be lost when going with the lighter pistons and pins and then it needs to be rebalanced anyway so that is time to upgrade the rod's and go free floating pins.. By the time you resize stock rods your typically half a nice set of connecting rods. Lighter rotating assembly's are typically easier on parts and better for longevity.

Nothing wrong with running Ly's until you bolt a high flowing set of heads on and wind it up... and a rod pulls in two. Been there unfortunately.... but I was running a 440 in the 10s. Most bb's running iron heads ly rods are fine, a lot of aluminum heads with hydraulic cams Lys are fine to. Now days Imo building 500-550hp+ upgrade the rods, no reason not 2.

 

[mopar 3 B]

Nowadays...good h beams do not weigh more then ly rods, simply stronger. Lots of grams can be lost when going with the lighter pistons and pins and then it needs to be rebalanced anyway so that is time to upgrade the rod's and go free floating pins.. By the time you resize stock rods your typically half a nice set of connecting rods. Lighter rotating assembly's are typically easier on parts and better for longevity.

Nothing wrong with running Ly's until you bolt a high flowing set of heads on and wind it up... and a rod pulls in two. Been there unfortunately.... but I was running a 440 in the 10s. Most bb's running iron heads ly rods are fine, a lot of aluminum heads with hydraulic cams Lys are fine to. Now days Imo building 500-550hp+ upgrade the rods, no reason not 2.

Will consider that with the next BB build. Not sure I want to use the old ones again after the 500,000 mile mark. Only thing that engine doesn't have original would be laughable to some of you on here. Even still has its stock bore but that may have to be changed next time.

 

[Curiousyellow71]

Will consider that with the next BB build. Not sure I want to use the old ones again after the 500,000 mile mark. Only thing that engine doesn't have original would be laughable to some of you on here. Even still has its stock bore but that may have to be changed next time.

500,000 miles.? Thats awesome.

 

[Aussieguysyd]

A lot to think about thank you guys again