bb 400

[rsd859]

Really, I had no idea that the stock intakes were any good. Thats some priceless info right there!!!

Rusty, Ive been searching for headers that will fit my 73 but cant find any that will fit with pwr steering. What would you suggest?

 

[66fury]

Rusty, i just picked up a weiand 8008 dual plane, will this be ok. ordered the above listed parts today, i went with the proper springs for the cam. what and where do i find the springs for dist? what weight would you try first?

 

[RustyRatRod]

That's a great intake, but the mods to the heads will net you more power. Are you going to do that as well? You might could end up with a nice power maker if you do. And don't forget a nice set of headers too. I'm not sure anyone makes advance weights anymore. I think all you can get is the spring kit. You might could find a deal on a whole performance distributor. Prices on them are coming down. I would watch which one I got though. I prefer the Mopar Performance unit. They are around 200 or so.

 

[66fury]

I called a place today and they referred me to a guy that does it. i didnt get a chance to talk to him yet. I looked into dist but cant spring for one yet. I picked up the intake for 30.00

 

[racedodge]

I would run the 516's. You are not going to be making so much horsepower on a 8.2 to 1 engine with the 906's.. the 516's will get you closer to 9 to 1, dependent on the head gasket size you use. if you are using a stock 400, you need the compression to overcome the obstacles you are facing. the smaller exhaust valve will not make that big of difference (1.6 on the 516 compared to the 1.74 on the 906).

seriously speaking though, you will be lucky to get 275 hp with an 8.2 to 1 slug with a cam change, bowls ported a new intake and a larger carb. A stock 400, 2bbl was rated at 175hp.

Get a performer RPM dual plane, a 750 holley, K54 engle, 516 heads, long tube headers and 2 1/2" exhaust... a double roller timing chain can be found cheap on summit. There are many ways to skin a cat in this, but no matter what you do, you will not get the same amount of power from the 906's as you will the 516's IMO. Again, others will disagree or agree... just speaking to you from experience of working with smogger 400's.

good luck.

go here: http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=48814.0

 

[RustyRatRod]

I disagree. I think with the bowls cleaned up that he could see 350 with the better flowing 906s. It's all about getting it in and out. Compression is part of it, but not the biggest part. It's all in the heads. JMHO.

 

[66fury]

rusty, are the 452 any good being they have harden axaust seat, same valve size as the 906?

 

[RustyRatRod]

Yes and they are very comparable port wise too. Would have a similar effect on power with the same mods.

 

[moparmarks]

452 also have larger coolent ports than the 906 heads. A bit more derable.

 

[Funship32]

Well you asked so here is my 2 cents: I assume what you are looking for is that off the line "POW". However you have a big car. No, not huge but a big car and you'll need torque to get that puppy going and going quickly. However the main problem you are going to have is the low C/R of the 400. Until you get over that hurdle I think you are gonna be limited with what you can do.

I understand the tight budget so here is what you can do in the meantime: Get yourself a newer dual plane mainfold. There are newer designs that typically will help with low to mid-range torque and lighter than the heavy OEM stuff. Secondly, get yourself a good exhaust system! Duals with headers would be ideal. If you can, get a crossover tube between your exhaust after the header collectors as that too will help your low end torque which you'll need. Lastly, get yourself a better cam. Talk to the cam guys, tell them what you want and what you have. They will steer you in the right direction. Personally I'd stay away from the heads until you are ready for a complete rebuild. Again, that is my opinion but if you are going to do heads and cams you might as well climb in and do bearings and if you are going that far, you might as well save up your sheckles and buy the right slugs to make it worth the time. However if you do what I recommend, I think you'd do okay in the bang per buck dept. If you want an interesting read up on it check out what the guys over at Mopar Muscle are doing with their '69 newport: http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/...p_1303_c_body_383_bolt_on_and_go/viewall.html

Add on: And a carb spacer, if you can fit it underhood will help too!

 

[racedodge]

350hp with 8.2 to 1 compression? You are expecting a 175hp jump with a cam (that will be ideal with that C/R), intake, and carb change + bowl work? Welp, good luck with that. Maybe you can get that number with some forced induction. It is a low compression motor after all.

 

[RustyRatRod]

Well.......we're talking two different kinda of measurements here. I am referring to gross HP. That 400 was originally measured in net HP, so yes, IMHO 350 gross HP is certainly not out of the question with properly prepared heads and good parts choices. But HP shouldn't be his main goal here. He's looking for torque. Low compression engines still deliver torque. With 400 kyoobs, he'll be a happy camper. There've been plenty of people who built low compression engines and made power with them. Won races with them. You have to extract power in different ways since the compression is not there. It is more of a challenge, but not impossible at all.

 

[racedodge]

Whatever floats your boat, but I have ran smogger 400s with open and closed chambered heads, different cams, etc. and there is a noticeable difference between a CC head and an OC head in regards to power. If he just wants torque, leave it alone and put some 4.10's in there, but the cost of bowl porting and doing what you are asking for would be the same if he just freshened some 516's and slapped those on there. He will get more bang for his buck with the 516s then doing all this head work. Now if he could do the bowl/port work on his own.. then awesome.. sounds like a great plan, but I do not see this as the case.

We can argue semantics all day long, but in this situation, I believe you are sending him the wrong direction, just my 2 cents. The guy can make up his own mind as it should be, but I think he should hear other opinions and talk to some machine shops before he gets a finalized opinion from a forum (mine, yours, or anyone else's).

Good luck with your build 66fury, whatever you chose.

 

[747mopar]

Looks like these guys got you covered but I thought I'd at least suggest getting a valley pan with the exhaust transfers blocked off, yeah it might not help allot but a cooler fuel charger makes more power and it never hurts to keep the intake as cool as possible (vapor lock). The bowl work Rusty is referring to can easily be done with a simply rotary file, die grinder and a port polishing kit from Summit. I know allot of guys will say leave the port work to the pro's but some of us poe folk have to do it ourselves, I have the flow numbers to prove it can be done. I used the 452 heads because they have hardened seats and are said to be more friendly for novice port work. Do yourself a favor and buy the High Performance BB Mopar book from summit, lots of good info. Good luck

 

[RustyRatRod]

My only reason for nixing the 516s is because he's gonna have to spend to get the larger exhaust valves in. With the 452s he mentioned, he can have basically the same head as the 906 but with the larger exhaust valves and hardened seats. Unless you go from say 8.1 to 9.5:1 the compression really ain't gonna pay off.......and the 516s will not get him to 9.5, especially since the actual compression on that 400 is likely 7.8 or 7.9. He's on a budget and cannot afford pistons, so his other alternative to me is blending the bowls and fixing the 452s up. He's just gonna have to make his own mind up.

 

[747mopar]

I agree with the 452's because no matter what at some point in time if your serious about making some power you'll want to step up the compression. At that point it wouldn't cost to much for pistons and you already would have some good flowing heads and some real potential. I guess if I was in that situation I would build it with the intentions of bumping up the compression when finances allowed.

 

[racedodge]

he doesnt need to get bigger exh. valves with a low compression motor, the difference between the 1.6 and 1.74 valve is minuscule. He is not building a drag car, just something with more power. the basic 516's would be able to fit his needs without having to pay the machine costs and the purchase of new valves. it is a common misnomer that you "have" to put in larger exhaust valves in the 516's, but you do not "have" to at all. In an ideal world, 66fury would just rebuild everything, but since we are not dealing with this situation, I believe you run what you got, and this will be the cheapest way for him to make more compression and HP.

as far as 747mopar's input, if that is the case and he plans on upgrading in the future, he will upgrade the heads at the same time, so why spend all the money on just a minor port/bowl work job when he can save that money and apply it to a cam today? or an intake? or a carb? When, and if, this guy is wanting to spend the major money down the road, I can guarantee you he will not go with a 452 head because it would be more cost effective and create a helluvalot more HP if he just bought aluminum heads.

So again, do what you want 66fury, but remember.. you are NOT looking for an ideal situation, you are looking for what will get you the best HP per $, and I disagree with the other guys in regards to headwork that will not, IMO, do anything with your low compression motor except frustrate you for lack of power and efficiency.

 

[66fury]

well i took on the job to port/bowl work myself(452), i worked on one head all day yesterday, takes forever... looking real good, i will post some pics when im done. Thanks for the replys, i love to here different opinions, i figured doing the work on the heads will put me that much closer.

 

[Garys1969RR]

Hey 66, if you go to Mopar Muscle magazine, and search head porting, they have some great articles there will help you port the heads properly. I did some 915 s and they work great!

 

[66fury]

garys, i was there, and several other places(web is full of info, video's too). I have one done and the other 3/4. time consuming.