BluePrint Engines 392 Hemi Interest? Thoughts? Comments?

[70chall440]

The lack of overall knowledge and understanding is what is frustrating on top of which are a lot of options which serves to confuse the situation even more. Sure can and do muddle their way through the swaps but I suspect most have left over parts that they bought and found out would not work. If you want to put a SB or BB into any of these cars, it is pretty straightforward and there is a ton of information out there already, so getting it right the first time isn't all that hard, this isn't the same for the G3 swap. Part of the issue lies with the engine variations (car, truck, different years, different sizes, etc).

This is one of the reasons why I started the G3 Hemi Swap Data thread, hoping that people would fill it out and provide some insight as to what works, problems they encountered, etc. but only 2 guys took the time to fill it out.

https://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/threads/new-hemi-swap-data.198946/

 

[33 IMP]

It wasn't so long ago, I saw a swap article in either hot rod or car craft, that laid out the costs for just the electronics for a gen three swap. Not the costs for motor, trans, related swap stuff, that is a given. When I saw what just the electronics cost, I immediately ruled out any chance of a gen three swap.
Has that changed?

 

[70chall440]

I might have saw that but I don't remember. The cost of a controller and harness run about $1500-$1800 depending on whose it is and where you get it. There are just so many factors involved when swapping or rebuilding that it is rarely an "apples to apples" comparison. Those that prefer the old iron will normally cite how expensive it is to swap, but those wanting to swap say its a wash because you can make the numbers saw whatever you want. What I mean is that if you start with a used 5.7 for say $2000 and then add another $2000 in electronics, oil pan, etc. some would say that you could not rebuild an old engine for the same money and get the same power.

 

[Cojohnso1]

I'm not convinced on the gen III options? An A-body yes. But B-E? It defeats the purpose of the wide engine bay design? They just look small. B and E bodies deserve big blocks.

JMO of course.

 

[5.7 hemi]

You must’ve not seen some Gen3 Hemi’s in a B/E body.

 

[Cojohnso1]

You must’ve not seen some Gen3 Hemi’s in a B/E body.

They are all over the place. Not a new thought. I went opposite for my E-body build. 904 ci DOHC. 5" wider than a street hemi. And yes. It fit inside the E-body engine well.

 

[5.7 hemi]

My first intake set up. Then I went to a 6.1 intake.

 

[Cojohnso1]

View attachment 1002009

My first intake set up. Then I went to a 6.1 intake.

What transmission? That is my sticking point. This monster is 1200 HP on pump 91 at a low 5200 rpms. So I have some unique challenges.

 

[Cojohnso1]

Liberty, G-force or Passon don't want to even make a recommendation. I have an ultra bell glide that can easily handle the power. But its a full race power glide. That will heat up fast for any limited street duties. So yes. Once again I bit before I figured out how to chew!

P.S. On trans? This motor is so big its drilled for either Chevy or Mopar hemi bellowing.

 

[Cojohnso1]

Not the best pic. But stock 440 in my '69 GTX just looks right. Yes, I wish it had more power. (Or better gears than 3.54:1 with the A833 4 speed would help.) But its hard to pull a very good running 400 HP 440 just to add ponies?

 

[5.7 hemi]

I used a 545rfe, don’t think anyone can make it hold 1000hp.

 

[Cojohnso1]

I used a 545rfe, don’t think anyone can make it hold 1000hp.

Yeah. Im seeing that. But with HP now more easily obtained? One would think the trans manufacturers would step up and make a street/strip hybrid? Maybe someday.

 

[33 IMP]

Liberty, G-force or Passon don't want to even make a recommendation. I have an ultra bell glide that can easily handle the power. But its a full race power glide. That will heat up fast for any limited street duties. So yes. Once again I bit before I figured out how to chew!

P.S. On trans? This motor is so big its drilled for either Chevy or Mopar hemi bellowing.

Uh, Lenco?

Seriously, with that kind of power, and a block drilled for chevy pattern? Turbo 400, or 4L80 for a street driver with overdrive . Built right, either will handle 2000hp.

 

[Cojohnso1]

Lenco is possibly the only semi manual option. I have a dummy power glide bolted up now. But high end automatics are not for any street use. Even with high end trans coolers.

This motor acts alot like a diesel. With crazy low-end torque. The car is a manual transmission car. But that may not be an option. Even my Cummins truck 6 speed G56 is not strong enough.

 

[Cojohnso1]

Some have tried the Pro Stock style clutchless trans. With frustrating results. One REALLY needs to know how to drive for any street use. There is a transmission hole. Even tne manufacturers admit. Including Jamie Passon. Libery is at least thinking about it. G-force just says "Nope"

 

[Cojohnso1]

Sorry. I didn't mean to drown subject with my transmission whining. But some of these Gen III setups with aftermarket superchargers? Could also be having transmission concerns?

 

[furious70]

Gen III is wider than bb, does not look small.

The 2000+hp street cars are all using rossler th400, no?

 

[Johnny Mac]

Can't say i'm not trying. Photo from R&D

 

[chargerrt340]

There seems to be a larger market for replacement GenIII in the newer cars and trucks, than the older car swap / conversions.
The conversion market seems pretty small, but part of that is there is not much support for it either.
Really need to get more info out about the swap. Need to look at those owners with small blocks who usually swap to big blocks for more power (they will be spending the same money or more to swap to a 600 hp big block.)
If I recall the GenIII bolts to the small block bellhousing? Has the serpentine belt drive with high output alternator, new style A/C compressor and power steering pump, Port EFI, and individual coil pack ignition.
I think the DBW makes the swap more difficult because of the electronic pedal. A cable operated throttle body (or stock one converted to cable) could make the swap easier.

I got tired of looking around and trying to piece stuff together with no final idea of what I will be spending. I talked to Chris at Performance Injection Enhancement and can almost buy two complete 408’s for my charger and cuda, and still be less than the gen3 swap. I would have my 318’s rebuilt but that is a lost art. And my 408’s with fuel injection will be 500ish BHP with about 540ish btq. Comparing that with the Gen3, and the extra money I will have for both cars with kick *** engines, I’m cool with the 408.

 

[Cojohnso1]

Im hardly the one to be arguing the case for old school builds. I had a chance for a 392 hemi (rated at about 525 HP) for a possible retro to the GTX. I thought about it for 5 min. So I have to rewire, modify or replace K-frame, Replace or modify bellhousing and clutch, new exhaust system, redo fuel lines and tank to EFI delivery, (And that was just off the top of my head.) But more importantly? Pull a very good running 440 all to get 90 or so more HP? That sounds like ALOT of work. And alot of $$.