Career Advice: Salary Negotiation

[Banzaiii67]

Background: 7 years of experience in document imaging and e-discovery specifically tailored for the Legal/Corporate industry.

The company I have been employed by to gain my experience has cut back on our line of sales. Closing 40% of our locations and terminating tenured sales and operation staff. At this point I felt dissolution with my employer, and coupled the threat of losing my job, the branch closing or moving to other side of town, which would result in addition 30-45 min commute

With that being said, our Sales Manager here was one of the terminated (He was widely respected across the company), thus our most tenured salesmen left to join a competitor after finding out he would be on his 4th Sales Manager in 5 years. He left about 4 months ago. One month later (April), with his encouragement I reached out the competitor to start a dialog.

I visited their operations, met with the entire Sales staff and Sales Manager multiple times over the course of 3 months. From my understanding the job that I would be offered would be a new role created by the employer and took some time to iron out all the wrinkles with pay, training and other variables. I waited patiently, and on July 2nd I received an offer letter and benefit information. After reviewing the offer and benefits, I asked for a bump in base salary about $1500 per year to make up the difference in Health Care cost (their health insurance is terribly expensive and not very good), losing a 3% company match on 401k and losing the equivalent of 2 week of vacation and 160 hours of sick time.

Now, the Sales Manager of the competitor I have been meeting with says there might not be enough room for negotiation, he has to speak with his District VP of Sales and will get back to me.

The growth and earning potential of the competitor far supersede my current employer. However, accepting the first offer, I would be making slightly less money than I am currently. $1500 isn't even a raise really, the position is a lateral move for me. Although, over time with a favorable commission rate I would be making more just not right away.

Have you ever negotiated salary? Did I do something wrong or is this just normal "corporate" BS

 

[dieseldazzle]

Negotiate, negotiate. In corporate world where you hire in that's what you hover at for the first 5 years.

 

[Richard Cranium]

Have you ever negotiated salary?

I'm a boss, so my employees come to me. Personally, this is how I like to see them ask for more salary....

 

[Roger63]

A lateral move maybe the obvious thing that you see, but the real question is who is more stable is your current employer cutting back for financial reasons or is he planning on growing in another direction. Just from you have stated that would be my first thought. So a lateral move may be the very thing that gives you opportunity to advance

 

[GetX'd]

I spent 35 years in large corporations and switched jobs a number of times and therefore had to negotiate salary. I would say you're well within your boundaries asking for the additional income to come aboard. They never give you there top number right off the bat. You don't say what additional % that 1500 represents. Given all the other deficiencies in their package it seems like a small concession to bump you up to come aboard. I was a hiring manager for many years so I know the drill. Another thing is you need to get your $$ coming in because it usually comes slowly once you're there. I would say stick to your guns and if they come back with a compromise you need to decide how much you want to get out of your current company and how comfortable you feel with the new company.

Corporations do play games and do have a lot of red tape. It looks like the hiring manager doesn't have the authority to increase your salary. You're in the sales division - they should expect and respect you're negotiating. Relax and stay confident. I got what I wanted 80% of the time.

 

[747mopar]

I look at it like this, if you've been with your current employer for a while but can still make a lateral move starting out then there's more room for the future. Happiness is everything, are you happy?

 

[CoronetDarter]

Doesn't matter if it's a multi-billion $$ organization or a 20 employee shop with one owner, the hiring manager/owner wants to minimize labor costs and naturally employees want to earn more. Typically seasoned salespeople have more negotiating levers to pull than a hourly staff employee, so you did nothing "wrong", however every organization has it's pain threshold. An alternative to a higher base is to ask for a guaranteed draw for 6 -12 months while you build your book; as you mentioned you're confident of higher commissions in the future.

You're astute in reviewing the company's benefits plan because a lot of new hires base their decision solely on hourly comp. Now if you're losing vacation and sick time because of a tenured vesting schedule, most employers are not going to compensate for that; it's a downfall of leaving a company and becoming low man on the tenured totem pole. If there is a tenured PTO schedule you can ask to be brought in at the higher accrual rate.

One eyebrow raiser: you mentioned the new company has a skinnier benefits plan and no 401k match. it could mean the company is more of a start up and hasn't matured financially yet to invest in a more robust bene plan. it could also mean the company is not doing well financially and is cutting back, or that top management doesn't respect or appreciate it's employees and prefers to prop up profits and distributions for themselves. A lot of variables, either way good luck with your job search.

 

[Banzaiii67]

One eyebrow raiser: you mentioned the new company has a skinnier benefits plan and no 401k match. it could mean the company is more of a start up and hasn't matured financially yet to invest in a more robust bene plan. it could also mean the company is not doing well financially and is cutting back, or that top management doesn't respect or appreciate it's employees and prefers to prop up profits and distributions for themselves. A lot of variables, either way good luck with your job search.

The Competitor is smaller than the company I currently work for in terms of GP. They are focused on strictly the Legal vertical, the company I work for is a Major Copier Company that is multi faceted, Copier Sales and Service, Managed Services (Rent-A-Hires), and Technical Services. Within each is 5 different verticals, Health Care, Schools and Universities, Government, Corporate, and Legal.

From what I already know, The competitor locally is much stronger than the company I currently work for. However, outside the area they aren't quite the Juggernaut yet.

 

[snakeoil24]

Sorry to say unless your in sales and bringing business to the table, all employers want to save money in the process. Office positions and managers today are a dime a dozen jobs. what can you do better? Unless you can work twice as hard then your in a tuff spot. Since this is a new position what can you hope to bargin for?? What makes you better then thousands of others doing Photo copy jockey job? Not trying to hurt feelings but this is what the employer is thinking! what are your bargining chips???

 

[69Coronetrt]

"From my understanding the job that I would be offered would be a new role created by the employer and took some time to iron out all the wrinkles with pay, training and other variables. I waited patiently, and on July 2nd I received an offer letter and benefit information. After reviewing the offer and benefits, I asked for a bump in base salary about $1500 per year to make up the difference in Health Care cost (their health insurance is terribly expensive and not very good), losing a 3% company match on 401k and losing the equivalent of 2 week of vacation and 160 hours of sick time."

If I would have been the one to take the time to develop the position, salary, benefits, et al and was insulted by the first person I offered it to by asking to negotiate, in essence you are telling me I wasted my time. I would not hire them.

Easy question: do you want to try and look for another job in six months (the handwriting is on the wall) or take one that has been offered and continue to eat? $1,500 is a pretty small amount to be haggling over (frankly, that amount is a waste of time for the other party to negotiate) compared to job security.

 

[GetX'd]

It's all relative. We don't know how much he makes or what his financial condition is. Most people don't take a new job for a cut in pay and less in benefits unless they're desperate.

 

[satman72]

Or, unless they see better oportunities for advancement.

 

[kellycom]

negotiate, the worst thing they can say is No.

 

[Banzaiii67]

I heard back from the competitor or now future employer. It's the original offer or more base salary and less commission. I've accepted the original offer. The opportunity to make more now and in the future outshines the terrible benefits which are said to improve, as they have recently reached 4000 employees. Thanks for comments and advice.

 

[GetX'd]

Good luck on your new job my friend. Knock em out with your commission earning skills and double your income!

 

[Budnicks]

Good luck,
hopefully it all works out well :headbang:

I know it's a little late now, BUT here's some thoughts from the peanut gallery,
as a multiple time business owner, service industry, construction & retail sales etc....

What is the National Industry Std. for pay/salary scale or std. % commission
for your position ?
IMO as long as it's, in-line with that in your region/area,
I'd say use that as a negotiation tool...

IMO if everyone is bailing/leaving or being fired/laid-off/position eliminated
at your old company, the new company can pick & choose whom they hire &
what they pay...
IMO they "Pretty much have a upper-hand",
not to be a downer or naysayer, I wish you all the best...
If it's a sales position, then;
IMO Unless somebody is an industry sales leader or brings a bunch of contacts &
leads, then it's just another employee/expense...

As a business owner view/side of things & Not to sound too crass, BUT
Employers want good employees at the best price point,
they are in business to make profit...
Or the business won't be around long, if they give away the farm...
{not that that's what your doing, not meant to be offensive,
please don't take my comments that way}
Some employees & especially hourly labor or even contract labor,
some even on salary/commission, forget that simple fact sometimes...

It costs more money, far more than what the employee makes in pay/salary
just to employ them, sometime double or more what the salary or
hourly pay scale demands, with all thing accounted for...
The business's welfare is 1st & foremost, the stability & making profit for growth,
then the investors returns, then probably the company reputation, maybe
then the employees pay structure/benefits... Not payroll or employee's 1st...

A lateral move with a Company that's growing, doesn't sound like such a bad thing,
from my interpretation {assuming} of what's happening, I don't know your industry,
but know business...
IMO it's far better than unemployment or having to move to find work,
in your field of expertise...

I wish you all the best, at the new company/job...