Header clearance question!!!!!!

[KAPSBIRD]

Going Crazy... 440, 11inch lakewood blow proof bell housing, denso mini starter edelbrock heads . My headers are hitting he starter, there Headmans. What headers will clear will no issues?
Thx in advance

 

[sleepar]

None... some may clear the starter but hit somewhere else... I would suggest trying to bend the headders and I drove wooden wedges in places to help tweak them beyond where they go I have a scissor Jack putting pressure in one direction and a floor Jack in another I have them where I want them... and there been like it for a month because I'm on vacation from home.... but when I get back into it I will run the motor till the headders get hot and with some heat shield heat the pipes till they loose there springy ness and hope they stay put after they cool and repeat a few times... headders are always a pain.... you can send them back and get a better set or worse set than you have luck of the draw.... everyone goes through it just try an figure out the puzzle with prybars and be carefully to not slip and get hurt or damage anything... it's something I have done and have expected so I went on vacation to cool off if that helps.....

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None... some may clear the starter but hit somewhere else... I would suggest trying to bend the headders and I drove wooden wedges in places to help tweak them beyond where they go I have a scissor Jack putting pressure in one direction and a floor Jack in another I have them where I want them... and there been like it for a month because I'm on vacation from home.... but when I get back into it I will run the motor till the headders get hot and with some heat shield heat the pipes till they loose there springy ness and hope they stay put after they cool and repeat a few times... headders are always a pain.... you can send them back and get a better set or worse set than you have luck of the draw.... everyone goes through it just try an figure out the puzzle with prybars and be carefully to not slip and get hurt or damage anything... it's something I have done and have expected so I went on vacation to cool off if that helps.....

318 edbrock heads 67 b body auto.... and after that stage I have a shift linkage to fab up... hooker headders with out the courtesy of a reach around for my money spent....

 

[HawkRod]

TTI headers fit better than anything, from my own personal experience plus it seems that of many others.

...but, TTI headers are big bucks...

 

[hunt2elk]

TTi.

 

[sleepar]

What sucks about big block headers is that the factory manifolds flow 99% as well as the headers if t was me I would get a manifold back dual kit and not go through the trouble of headders..... because they only look cool...

 

[coloradodave]

What sucks about big block headers is that the factory manifolds flow 99% as well as the headers if t was me I would get a manifold back dual kit and not go through the trouble of headders..... because they only look cool...

Not that I don't believe you but where did that percentage figure come from?

 

[hunt2elk]

Not that I don't believe you but where did that percentage figure come from?

Wondering the same thing. Every test I have seen shows a significant hp and torque increase with headers.

 

[bbcharger71]

I have a 400 with Edelbrock heads and Heddman Headers. I used a Denso starter from a mid 90's Ram, and had to do some "persuading" to get clearance...... Wonder if it is the angle of the Edelbrock heads causing the issue? The Denso starter is HALF the size of the factory style.

 

[coloradodave]

Wondering the same thing. Every test I have seen shows a significant hp and torque increase with headers.

Actually, I was trying to be nice. Sleepar's statement doesn't make any sense. When was the last time you saw ANY car trying to make a lot of horsepower without using headers? Sometimes I wonder why I continue to read his replies, especially when he makes these off-the-wall statements. Ask ANY engine builder, dyno operator, engine tuner, race crew chief, etc. Even the factory race cars used them. Good grief...

 

[super-bee_ski]

TTI with a hemi
Great fit!

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I know of only 1 Car Company that made a stock manifold flow great.
Pontiac.

On the 63 Super Duty Catalinas...they made a couple of Aluminum "factory" exhaust manifolds...

You talk about RARE!
PS: You cant buy them...too rare...

NOTE: Pic 3 is equally rare...
Another type from 1963 on the Super Duty

 

[Propwash]

Doug's 452 2" headers will also fit (without rubbing anywhere). Got them on my '69 Roadrunner with a RB Block, eddy heads.

 

[Funship32]

For what it is worth- I just dealt with the same problems. 383, Lakewood B/H (11 inch clutch), hedman headers and the #1 tube is in the way of the mini starter...which I thought I would upgrade to in order to NOT have to deal with a captured OE starter!!! OMG! No joy on the mini-starter- period! I'd have to just about crush the tube to get it to clear the mini.

So I ended up putting the OE unit back in until that time when I have to switch out the starter and at that point I figured I'd upgrade to TTI which say on their site that they units will clear mini-starter.

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What sucks about big block headers is that the factory manifolds flow 99% as well as the headers if t was me I would get a manifold back dual kit and not go through the trouble of headders..... because they only look cool...

Actually it has been shown that headers short and long tube flow better than the OE cast iron...

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/mopp_0106_manifolds_vs_headers/

 

[sleepar]

What sucks about big block headers is that the factory manifolds flow 99% as well as the headers if t was me I would get a manifold back dual kit and not go through the trouble of headders..... because they only look cool...

Sorry about that I should have explained that you generously port and polish smooth the factory 440 logs and run a 3" collector necked down to the manifold run back to where the headders would normally go to 3" dyno max headders muflers then dumping out in front of the rear wheels AAR style to 500hp... the factory ones left alone are only good to around 400hp on 2 1/2 exhaust with no a measurable gain at that level with headders... above that headders will out flow the logs... MO

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Sorry about that I should have explained that you generously port and polish smooth the factory 440 logs and run a 3" collector necked down to the manifold run back to where the headders would normally go to 3" dyno max headders muflers then dumping out in front of the rear wheels AAR style to 500Up hand the factory ones left alone are only good to around 400hp on 2 1/2 exhaust with no a measurable gain at that level with headders... above that headders will out flow the logs... MO

Cheaper headders you will fight more to fit right than the expensive ones but your still going to have some issue.... it would be rare even with TTI not to have a clearance issue like in the idelr arm...

 

[coloradodave]

Sorry about that I should have explained that you generously port and polish smooth the factory 440 logs and run a 3" collector necked down to the manifold run back to where the headders would normally go to 3" dyno max headders muflers then dumping out in front of the rear wheels AAR style to 500hp... the factory ones left alone are only good to around 400hp on 2 1/2 exhaust with no a measurable gain at that level with headders... above that headders will out flow the logs... MO



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Cheaper headders you will fight more to fit right than the expensive ones but your still going to have some issue.... it would be rare even with TTI not to have a clearance issue like in the idelr arm...

Again, what reputable source did this info come from? Guessing and personal opinions don't count...If you're going to print stuff like this you need to show some kind of proof or it's just blah, blah, blah....And for what you're saying, there is no proof. There are a lot of young, impressionable people on this forum that will be telling their friends that headers don't make a difference and THAT IS NOT TRUE!

 

[sleepar]

Again, what reputable source did this info come from? Guessing and personal opinions don't count...If you're going to print stuff like this you need to show some kind of proof or it's just blah, blah, blah....And for what you're saying, there is no proof. There are a lot of young, impressionable people on this forum that will be telling their friends that headers don't make a difference and THAT IS NOT TRUE!

Personal experience.... I can't be the only one to have ported out and polished a set of cast iron manifolds.... and for the rare stuff you can't buy any more you can recast a set in sand.... anything can be done... I have seen some nickel plated manifolds and dream a little... on a stock motor only a 10% gain is achieved with ordinary headders over the 440 manifolds.... obviously custom 2" headders will flow more... but on a stock motor you may loose power from loss of back pressure....
Again my opinion and experience.... just because it was or wasn't published in a magazine shouldn't mean anything... I would take it for what it is worth but I'm not selling subscriptions or getting a commission on parts... just a gearhead sharing his experience and people can take it or leave it.... on another note how do you know it isn't TRUE ? Everything is subjective and not everyone will get the same results...

Try what I mentioned with the port and polish... when you neck down the tubeing neck it down do it with 3steps with 2 1/4 - 2 1/2 (14ga)up to 3" or you will split the pipe .... if it won't flow I will eat crow and retract the statement...

 

[sleepar]

Almost every time I post something on the edge or controversial someone will dispute it say it is untrue with out disproving it.... then either goes quiet or someone else who knows will confirm it once the come across the thread.... LOL I wouldn't waste my time to post BS on here or any other time ever... I have been wrong and will admit it or have not explained the whole story well for everyone to understand... and almost always there is more than one way to get the same results and some who experience a different results with beer exactly set up... that's all part of the game...

 

[HawkRod]

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/engine/mopp_0209_upgrading_the_383_magnum_avs_carb/

The link above covers a stock 383 that goes from 338 horsepower to 358 horsepower with a switch from stock hi-po manifolds to headers. There have been other magazine articles that showed the same thing. The more modified and powerful your engine, the more the manifolds create loss. An engine built for more power gained about 40 HP based on the switch to headers.

Sorry, but I find it hard to believe the "porting" of manifolds helps. Unless you extrude hone them (very expensive), you gain very little as you cannot increase the flow deep inside.

I really WANTED to believe stock manifolds could flow similar numbers, but extensive research proved to me that headers cannot be beat - they provide a significant gain over manifolds.

Now having said that, that does not mean that people should not run manifolds. Pick your preference for pros and cons of each and install what you like. Just don't go believing your manifolds will do similar numbers to headers...

My $0.02

 

[KAPSBIRD]

What sucks about big block headers is that the factory manifolds flow 99% as well as the headers if t was me I would get a manifold back dual kit and not go through the trouble of headders..... because they only look cool...

Thx Sleeper..I'm not trying to look cool, I'm trying to drive my Roadrunner. It was a very simple question that you complicated with your inaccurate statement about stock manifolds. I don't care about stock manifolds. I asked what Headers would clear my bellhousing/starter. thx.
Everyone else thx you for your input.