Hot running 440 60" over

[Phoenix440]

Really appreciate all the responses on here guys.
Going to work through the suggestions and will post the results.

 

[Phoenix440]

Thanks for your response.
I'm happy to go with the theory of higher flow equals better cooling.
I was going on previous threads regarding hot running motors where there seemed to be some who believed water needs to move slow enough to remove the heat from the radiator.
I will be installing a koolmaster water pump after doing what I can to improve air flow ( relocate trans cooler away from the centre of radiator, seal radiator support panel to.hood and removing one thermo fan as runs cool enough idling in traffic so may get away with one fan).
As I read on other threads ac system.cars had the pump overdrive by around 30 percent( 6 blade pump also)
Would over driving a hi volume pump bring even more flow and better cooling or could cavitation become an issue. The car will not see revs above 6000 and these would be the exception .

Your initial statement:
"Just wondering what is the opinion on.hi flow water pumps? Searching the posts on here, seems there is some debate that hi flow doesn't always mean cooler temps?" Is totally incorrect.....on the subject of thermodynamics (heat transfer with regard to volume, velocity, specific heat characteristics of the heat transfer media, heat exchanger surface area and volume and temperatures) is an exacting science....your statement is based of what ??....actual system values, both temperatures, pressures and actual operating conditions on both the fluid side and air side are necessary to make the actual determination.......not hearsay or some magazine article or your buddies opinion, even though his intentions might be good.....
DO NOT BELIEVE that the coolant must move slowly thru the radiator and 160°F thermostats are best. Show me your calculations and I'll help you with the determination. PM me if you'd like to continue the discussion......BTW.....I use to design high temperature gas to gas heat exchangers.......gas to gas, gas to liquid and liquid to liquid heat exchangers......fyi.....
BOB R

 

[69_A12_6BBL]

Just wondering what is the opinion on.hi flow water pumps? Searching the posts on here, seems there is some debate that hi flow doesn't always mean cooler temps?
Looking at Koomaster, Milodon and Edelbrock Victor, all sound good on paper. Anyone had experience with these brands, particularly the Victor?
Car has standard cast pump and changing pump is my last attempt to try to cool the car( runs up to 220 at 3000rpm on highway after 15 minutes.Has 26" radiator, 2 x 14" fans, water wetter, 160 Mr Gasket thermostat. Thanks in advance.

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Take it, this is a 440 "Punched Out" to a 512?
Had a customer with this EXACT complaint. As we did the machine work & build, but, Customer didnt want advice on how to setup once he got it into his '68 Dodge. These comments look like what we'd advise. However, I've ran across 2 or 3 blocks that weren't "Hot Tanked' Thoroughly BEFORE boring & assembly. Even with 7 blade clutch fans & 180 thermostats, ONE engine in particular brought in to us was tore down, only to find the previous shop's Tech had actually went .067 OVERBORE! Hardly anything left between water jackets & pistons! Yours doesnt sound like this one, as it ran up to 240° and HAD to be shut off! Ended up Re-Sleeving the block.

 

[Ghostrider]

Has anyone considered your ignition timing and carb tune? Too lean and too much timing will cause heat. Hot at speed can also indicate timing (failed vacuum advance etc) too.

 

[GTX JDC]

What are you using for coolant? My local Mopar shop recommended VP Stay Frosty (blue color) coolant to help with my overheating problem. They did not dilute it, it is 100% Stay Frosty. It seems to be helping. Driving it around this summer should be the real test.
Good luck.

 

[RJRENTON]

What are you using for coolant? My local Mopar shop recommended VP Stay Frosty (blue color) coolant to help with my overheating problem. They did not dilute it, it is 100% Stay Frosty. It seems to be helping. Driving it around this summer should be the real test.
Good luck.

What is "VP STAY FROSTY" coolant?? Made by ??? What is it's specific heat value of the material? Who is your local Mopar Shop? Specifics please.......what are your b4 and after temps??? Inquiring minds want to know.......
BOB RENTON

 

[Phoenix440]

Take it, this is a 440 "Punched Out" to a 512?
Had a customer with this EXACT complaint. As we did the machine work & build, but, Customer didnt want advice on how to setup once he got it into his '68 Dodge. These comments look like what we'd advise. However, I've ran across 2 or 3 blocks that weren't "Hot Tanked' Thoroughly BEFORE boring & assembly. Even with 7 blade clutch fans & 180 thermostats, ONE engine in particular brought in to us was tore down, only to find the previous shop's Tech had actually went .067 OVERBORE! Hardly anything left between water jackets & pistons! Yours doesnt sound like this one, as it ran up to 240° and HAD to be shut off! Ended up Re-Sleeving the block.

Take it, this is a 440 "Punched Out" to a 512?
Had a customer with this EXACT complaint. As we did the machine work & build, but, Customer didnt want advice on how to setup once he got it into his '68 Dodge. These comments look like what we'd advise. However, I've ran across 2 or 3 blocks that weren't "Hot Tanked' Thoroughly BEFORE boring & assembly. Even with 7 blade clutch fans & 180 thermostats, ONE engine in particular brought in to us was tore down, only to find the previous shop's Tech had actually went .067 OVERBORE! Hardly anything left between water jackets & pistons! Yours doesnt sound like this one, as it ran up to 240° and HAD to be shut off! Ended up Re-Sleeving the block.

As far as I know it's 60 over 440. Trying to avoid having to find a new block, pistons etc, but as you have found with those couple of blocks you mentioned may be that this block cannot be cooled due to wall thickness or. Will exhaust all options before pulling motor down.

 

[Bird 426]

Personally, I like the Flowkooler water pump, pricey, but they do move the water. They are my only choice. Guessing the reason you do not have room for a stock type clutch fan is the crossflow radiator? Not all radiators occupy the same space.

 

[Ron H]

Some will think not, but when chasing down excessive heat with my motor after rebuild, came across tech coolant and oil reports. I applied the advice. It was higher percentages of anti-freeze can impede cooling, it retains heat longer than water. As such, I run a 70/30 ratio since the car sits in a heated garage and only driven during the warmer months. Also noticed crazy high oil pressure even after driving 50-miles in hot weather. Info from various racing articles described more heat retention with higher viz oils. I was running 20/50 and switched to 10/30 racing oil, high-zinc having solid lifters. Pressure improved and motor was running cooler.

I’ll qualify I did a bunch of things, switched from a 4 to 7-blade, added an OEM shroud, and top-seal my ride didn’t have, though these were options on police/taxi vehicles.

Don’t know if it was mentioned or if applies – if your motor is fresh still in its break-in phase, it will run hotter.

 

[Butch Harley]

Who sell a lower radiator hose with a spring in it? thanks

 

[Jeff Peterson]

Who sell a lower radiator hose with a spring in it? thanks

One option

Mustang Radiator Hose Spring Big Block 1967 1968 1969 1970 1971 1972 1973 | eBay

 

[Bird 426]

I think that CJ Pony Parts also sells them, the spring, not the hose.

 

[Geoff 2]

Make your own spring using welding wire, fencing wire or wire coat hanger. Wrap a few turns around a broom handle......

 

[oldkimmer]

This is my findings. Years ago my gf car ran over half way on the gauge. This bugged me to no end. It had a 195 t stat. I put in a 160 t stat. Never made 20 miles b4 the temp was almost all the way over to hot. Limped home then tried a 180 t stat. Made about 80 miles and same result. Put the 195 back in and it was back to its normal self. Kim

 

[Ron H]

Thermostat has nothing to do with excessive engine heating, unless it isn’t opening due to defect or clogged. It also restricts water flow velocity by design. A 195 stat will stay shut longer than a 180 or 160, a feature for cold climates keeping coolant in the block longer to heat up faster to obtain defrost/cabin heat sooner. Lower temp stat such as a 160, I use since my car is only driven in warmer weather and never sees surrounding temperatures below 45-degrees. As I understand, not using a stat at all allows increased velocity flow and may override the purpose of the radiator.

 

[GTX JDC]

What is "VP STAY FROSTY" coolant?? Made by ??? What is it's specific heat value of the material? Who is your local Mopar Shop? Specifics please.......what are your b4 and after temps??? Inquiring minds want to know.......
BOB RENTON

Check out vpracingfuels.com. Don't know the specific heat value of the coolant. VP could probably answer all your technical questions. MoTech Performance in Murrieta , Calif. did a lot of work on my car and recommended this brand and type of coolant. This is the blue, race version. Find them at motechperformance.com. Since getting the car back, it runs between 180 and 190. Before it would go up to 200 -210. It hasn't gotten hot yet here in Riverside so I can't say what will happen this summer. Time will tell.

 

[RJRENTON]

Check out vpraceingfuels.com. Don't know the specific heat value of the coolant. VP could probably answer all your technical questions. MoTech Performance in Murrieta , Calif. did a lot of work on my car and recommended this brand and type of coolant. This is the blue, race version. Find them at motechperformance.com. Since getting the car back, it runs between 180 and 190. Before it would go up to 200 -210. It hasn't gotten hot yet here in Riverside so I can't say what will happen this summer. Time will tell.

Your link abt. vpraceingfuels.com would not connect.....spelling??? Thanks
BOB RENTON

 

[not so famous bob]

Totally different circumstances and equipment.......and application......not comparisons between apples and oranges.......circulation rates, temperatures, fluid volumes, primary and secondary heat exchangers, fluid velocities, etc..........just my opinion.....
BOB RENTON

not sure what ur saying here , but raise the rpm on one of the pipeline engines and see how hot it would get before it broke forever !!
hi perf. engines will run hotter than stock engines...

 

[RJRENTON]

not sure what ur saying here , but raise the rpm on one of the pipeline engines and see how hot it would get before it broke forever !!
hi perf. engines will run hotter than stock engines...

I'm totally familiar with the science of thermodynamics and heat load, circulation constants, heat losses of the heat source (engine) ....why do hi perf engines will run hotter.....more losses?? than stock engines?? Numbers please......
BOB RENTON

 

[not so famous bob]

I'm totally familiar with the science of thermodynamics and heat load, circulation constants, heat losses of the heat source (engine) ....why do hi perf engines will run hotter.....more losses?? than stock engines?? Numbers please......
BOB RENTON

plain and simple they create more heat ...