I'm going to slam college education.

[padam]

I think what the main theme in this thread is that kids going to school racking up huge debt to graduate with a gender studies degree or social justice degree, or liberal arts degree, all of which prepare you for absolutely nothing in this world is a huge waste of money and time. For example, 60 years ago, a business management degree from a good university would get you an entry level management job at a factory or some other manufacturing place, now, it's a guaranteed spot at McDonalds. Things have changed. We need more kids to go into the trades for sure.
And congrats on your grandkids success.

Main issue I see is the manufacturing jobs are going away. Hard to build a community on fast food, gambling and tourism.

 

[patrick66]

If you have a young person interested, Grobb is offering apprenticeships in western Ohio. Looks like a great opportunity.

I’ve done both: tool and die apprenticeship and later an associate degree. The apprenticeship was harder. It was really hard to get one back then and even now few companies offer them. 40 years ago if you didn’t perform or keep up your night school grades the company would fire you at the drop of a hat. Pay was crappy (less than non-apprentices doing the same work.) Hours were long, you had to do crap jobs and were treated like a dog.

College, I think anyone can get into some sort of school. Sit in class and do book work. Too bad I hate sitting in class. But it doesn’t take any physical skill like skilled trades.

But, I think a college degree (bachelor and up) opens way more doors down the road.

I look at this as such: An 18-yo kid, fresh out of high school, has three real choices to pick from...

One. College, which is a huge waste these days, considering the crap that students are forced to "learn", along with incurring ridiculous student debt (which is ultimately the student's choice and responsibility to pay it all back, job or not!), with or without scholarships. And stuck with jobs usually not related at all to the field of study. Not really "ready to work" out the gate. Unless one has an engineering or medical degree.

Two. Trade or vocational school. Kid learns a trade for a couple of years and is then equipped to gain an apprenticeship, easily making what that college kid is making; and without the crushing debt! Out the door, ready to work! Plus, depending on the trade, he/she/it is making $50K - $85K right out the gate!

Three. Military service. Even with a two-year USA enlistment, you get the Post-9/11 GI Bill. Go to school as your military job allows time for, get out, and continue with a vocational pursuit OR college, as one sees fit to do. Working immediately with a decent paycheck, plus the choice to make the military a career or pursue civilian life. Win-win!

OK, four choices. Fourth, be a bum. A drag on society. A leech to the welfare system. Do absolutely nothing. Be the person the newspuke interviews, with the caption that says "homeless by choice for 12 years"...

 

[j-c-c-62]

Most of the people I know with a College Degree have jobs out of their field. The reason that a business hires someone that has graduated from college is that it demonstrates commitment and extra effort. The people that get hired for their chosen field are "Educators", and we all see how that works. The system works as it is designed and there is no reason to get upset about it. Go have a beer and throw a rock at the neighbors dog.

I somehow lean towards the thinking those who are college educated are best positioned to share their opinion on its lifetime merits vs those on the sidelines. One thing that surprises me and is very telling IMO is the position of the non-college educated that college is solely for career advancement, and from what college taught me, nothing could be farther from the truth.
And I have yet to meet anyone who has learned too much.
The cost of college today is a huge issue, but a separate one, and has little basis to be directed at the students.

 

[hdwrench]

post high school certainly seems overrated and overpriced. the student loan scam and current forgiveness going on right now is foolish. i’ve been out of school for a long time but from what i gather i wouldn’t want any kids learning today . to many outside agendas and ideas being brought into a classroom, k-12 and beyond. what happened to the three “ r’s “ reading , riteing and rithmatic ? ( had to add a lil humor to my rant ! but truth also .. ;)

 

[j-c-c-62]

post high school certainly seems overrated and overpriced. the student loan scam and current forgiveness going on right now is foolish. i’ve been out of school for a long time but from what i gather i wouldn’t want any kids learning today . to many outside agendas and ideas being brought into a classroom, k-12 and beyond. what happened to the three “ r’s “ reading , riteing and rithmatic ? ( had to add a lil humor to my rant ! but truth also .. ;

I agree on the over price aspect. I disagree a lot on the rest. These are not "kids" in college. Legally they are adults, they need to hone their critical thinking skills, that is done somewhat by educationally throwing everything at them and they acquire the ability to sort things out for themselves, like they have to do the remainder of their lives. As long as we have a free country, they will have to and should think for themselves, that has to start sometime. An educated citizen is a country's asset.
This country will not lead the world with just highly skilled welders, plumbers, truck drivers, window washers, etc., but if they have any higher learning, we all benefit.
Seems like with some arguments shared here, that anything beyond the 8th? grade is a waste and also overpriced.

 

[mopar 3 B]

The country is full of educated idiots. If a college education is required for one of these pampered what evers to deal with every day life situations where the heck where their parents. Likely more educated idiots.
Parenting isn't about dragging their little pablum puckers around to every school event and making sure they are in with the spoiled in crowd that has no idea what life is about beyond their parents purse strings.

 

[hdwrench]

I agree on the over price aspect. I disagree a lot on the rest. These are not "kids" in college. Legally they are adults, they need to hone their critical thinking skills, that is done somewhat by educationally throwing everything at them and they acquire the ability to sort things out for themselves, like they have to do the remainder of their lives. As long as we have a free country, they will have to and should think for themselves, that has to start sometime. An educated citizen is a country's asset.
This country will not lead the world with just highly skilled welders, plumbers, truck drivers, window washers, etc., but if they have any higher learning, we all benefit.
Seems like with some arguments shared here, that anything beyond the 8th? grade is a waste and also overpriced.

I agree on the over price aspect. I disagree a lot on the rest. These are not "kids" in college. Legally they are adults, they need to hone their critical thinking skills, that is done somewhat by educationally throwing everything at them and they acquire the ability to sort things out for themselves, like they have to do the remainder of their lives. As long as we have a free country, they will have to and should think for themselves, that has to start sometime. An educated citizen is a country's asset.
This country will not lead the world with just highly skilled welders, plumbers, truck drivers, window washers, etc., but if they have any higher learning, we all benefit.
Seems like with some arguments shared here, that anything beyond the 8th? grade is a waste and also overpriced.

personally i have never asked nor do i want this country to lead the world. i don’t believe it’s this country has obligation to lead the world as you call it . as a team i believe the welders , dish washers and the highly educated politicians should lead this country . why is it the “we” are so concerned with somalia or bangladesh or the world yet ignore our own homeland? i’m all for assisting after a disaster but the continuous meddling is beyond our concern…..i’d love to go on but why ? i’d love to discuss this critical thinking subject but i best not …..

 

[Nxcoupe]

personally i have never asked nor do i want this country to lead the world. i don’t believe it’s this country has obligation to lead the world as you call it . as a team i believe the welders , dish washers and the highly educated politicians should lead this country . why is it the “we” are so concerned with somalia or bangladesh or the world yet ignore our own homeland? i’m all for assisting after a disaster but the continuous meddling is beyond our concern…..i’d love to go on but why ? i’d love to discuss this critical thinking subject but i best not …..

I think he meant be the best in the world. I for one, am sick to death of going to the doctor and they can't speak english and have no idea where they got their degree. Same with engineers, most I work with are from india or pakistan and who knows where they got their degree. In order to be the leader in tech and manufacturing, we need the best of everyone from the top down. All Americans.

 

[451Mopar]

Problem with higher education is the government subsidizing it. Same with health care costs. If students were paying with their own money the schools would have to charge reasonable fees. When you pay with other peoples money there is no cost constraints.

 

[Pops1967GTX]

teaching from the past....