New 360 build with oil leaking into coolant

[1 Wild R/T]

Ohh..well as I had the pan off, I just did pressure going into the oil galleys from the bottom? I was getting air up top. Thats when I ran the camera into the right water bank looking for air bubbles with soap water and WD and I found no leaks there. Now that won't get me to the web, but everywhere else.

If you had no air bubbles what makes you believe you had air up top? You mentioned having the cam blocking air to the top.... The oil pump is what's referred to as a "positive displacement pump" which means if it's turning it will displace oil... But if it's not turning it acts as a blockage... The oil sender port will be an un-restricted point to pressurize the oil system....

 

[chermik1999]

If you had no air bubbles what makes you believe you had air up top? You mentioned having the cam blocking air to the top.... The oil pump is what's referred to as a "positive displacement pump" which means if it's turning it will displace oil... But if it's not turning it acts as a blockage... The oil sender port will be an un-restricted point to pressurize the oil system....

Hum....you're right. So I had no real test. But I swore I had air up top??
Well I have a proper tester coming tomorrow as I didn't have proper fittings for my air system. I'll give it another go from the sender this time...

 

[69Bee]

You are chasing your tail and the "Symptoms" caused by the problem. You keep talking about the pass side head does not compress the head gasket, and THAT is your problem causing to symptoms that you are chasing. Remove the head gasket and put the head on the block. If the head cannot go all the way down to the block deck, this is the problem. You need to find out what is holding it up. I have had it happen a few times with aftermarket heads where the dowel holes are not perfect and the head hangs up on them. Also, the aluminum heads are wider than the stock head IIRC, and the outer edges can protrude above the deck if the block has not been decked. If one or both of these are taller than the deck, it can hold the head up, preventing complete gasket sealing.

 

[gtxrt]

You are chasing your tail and the "Symptoms" caused by the problem. You keep talking about the pass side head does not compress the head gasket, and THAT is your problem causing to symptoms that you are chasing. Remove the head gasket and put the head on the block. If the head cannot go all the way down to the block deck, this is the problem. You need to find out what is holding it up. I have had it happen a few times with aftermarket heads where the dowel holes are not perfect and the head hangs up on them. Also, the aluminum heads are wider than the stock head IIRC, and the outer edges can protrude above the deck if the block has not been decked. If one or both of these are taller than the deck, it can hold the head up, preventing complete gasket sealing.


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omg thank you. I thought I was going crazy or reading his post wrong.

 

[chermik1999]

Well i I thought about that. So before I torqued it down again, I put a sheet of heavy 8 x 11 paper under first. Then the head ..it's tight. The paper won't slide all the way through. So has to be flat.
I installed a set of these on 2 more 360 blocks in the last 4 years with no problems. Now mind you the manufacturer process can have faults, I get that. But it's flat.
These are

Performance World 63171A-2 PWHeads 179cc Aluminum Cylinder Heads Pair (Complete). Fits SB Mopar 318-360

SB Mopar 179cc Complete Aluminum Cylinder Heads. 63cc Combustion Chamber. Manufactured from A356-T6 aluminum.

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I have a set of speedmaster heads that have 2 leaking ex valves out of the box. For the heck of it, I'll install those and see.
I found the leaking valves when I was removing the inner spring for cam breakin. At that time I was not doing a pressure test as I did here. See what happens.

 

[69Bee]

Well i I thought about that. So before I torqued it down again, I put a sheet of heavy 8 x 11 paper under first. Then the head ..it's tight. The paper won't slide all the way through. So has to be flat.
I installed a set of these on 2 more 360 blocks in the last 4 years with no problems. Now mind you the manufacturer process can have faults, I get that. But it's flat.
These are

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I have a set of speedmaster heads that have 2 leaking ex valves out of the box. For the heck of it, I'll install those and see.
I found the leaking valves when I was removing the inner spring for cam breakin. At that time I was not doing a pressure test as I did here. See what happens.

I always vacuum check "New" heads to check valve seal and usually find at least one valve I have to cut the seat and grind the valve for it to seal. When they build the complete heads, they take the bare heads, populate the valves, install seals and springs, and stuff it into a bag and box. There can be no way they are vacuum checking the heads, or maybe the assembler does not know what he is doing. Btw, Speedmaster is the lowest of low of chineez garbage. (Procomp Electronics-->Speedmaster79-->Speedmaster). Every time they get bad BBB complaints and more, they change their name.

 

[chermik1999]

Actually both sides were wet. And this is pass head on #8. So ya..sealing.

 

[chermik1999]

I always vacuum check "New" heads to check valve seal and usually find at least one valve I have to cut the seat and grind the valve for it to seal. When they build the complete heads, they take the bare heads, populate the valves, install seals and springs, and stuff it into a bag and box. There can be no way they are vacuum checking the heads, or maybe the assembler does not know what he is doing. Btw, Speedmaster is the lowest of low of chineez garbage. (Procomp Electronics-->Speedmaster79-->Speedmaster). Every time they get bad BBB complaints and more, they change their name.

I know. This engine is for my son and he's cheap..lol. I had a chance to exchange them in July for eddy at Summit just paying the diff even after they dropped the line.
As my boy said no dad, it'll be ok, I left it. Went install and pressure cylinders to remove inner spring, and low and behold. Leaking valves. Spent a day trying to lap it out and just got worse. So have to be fixed. Of course bought em in Sept 23. So out of warranty.
I'll get machine shop to go over them with the repair at the same time. Lessons.....next time I follow my gut..lol.
But the PW heads I've always had good luck with no issues. And serviced if needed here in Canada.

 

[chermik1999]

Now I'm waiting for a machinist straight edge to show up to check the deck. My cheap SS ruler isn't cutting it. It could be the deck as it's still original.
Thanks all for the feedback. That's why this is awesome...get others experience.

 

[chermik1999]

I always vacuum check "New" heads to check valve seal and usually find at least one valve I have to cut the seat and grind the valve for it to seal. When they build the complete heads, they take the bare heads, populate the valves, install seals and springs, and stuff it into a bag and box. There can be no way they are vacuum checking the heads, or maybe the assembler does not know what he is doing. Btw, Speedmaster is the lowest of low of chineez garbage. (Procomp Electronics-->Speedmaster79-->Speedmaster). Every time they get bad BBB complaints and more, they change their name.

You're right. But this head for sure was vacuum tested. It was a return that got sent to me by mistake. I tested them after install and found a leaking valve. Sent them back
new valve and seat and was returned the next day fixed! So that I know. But both of you are correct. It's not sealing the gasket. It should be dry and it's not.

 

[chermik1999]

Hi..maybe this will help clear this up a bit. This head is torqued and verified all cylinders aren't leaking as I ran pressured air in each. When applied air into the coolant system, it's blowing out the #4 cam journal.

 

[chermik1999]

OK...last update as I'm going to mexico shortly for the winter.
Oil pressure tester finally came in. Lifters in place and coolant still blocked off as best as possible with heads still on.
I flip the air on from the sender and I hear air coming from the waterpump.
Either there is a blind plug somewhere missed or I have a hole in the block. It's more than a hiss

 

[1 Wild R/T]

Hi..maybe this will help clear this up a bit. This head is torqued and verified all cylinders aren't leaking as I ran pressured air in each. When applied air into the coolant system, it's blowing out the #4 cam journal.

You need to show us a video showing your whole setup... How are you pessurizing the cooling system? You have no intake, are the four water ports blocked?

 

[chermik1999]

I'll take one. So I have confirmed when I spin the cam to feed oil to the pass side rocker, I get air out the waterpump as well. That's the side that filled up the water galley with oil. I have blocked off the oil galley on the head just to create more pressure to hear air out the waterpump

 

[chermik1999]

 

[chermik1999]

Almost like the wrong head gaskets

 

[1 Wild R/T]

First I would pull the heads, block the oil passage on the head gasket surface & put a rubber blow gun tip in the rocker bolt hole & see if the heads hold pressure...

next turn the engine so the cam blocks the oil passages to the heads & pressurize the passage from the deck down toward the cam...

Has the block ever had water in it & froze?

Whatever the case it sucks.........

 

[chermik1999]

First I would pull the heads, block the oil passage on the head gasket surface & put a rubber blow gun tip in the rocker bolt hole & see if the heads hold pressure...

next turn the engine so the cam blocks the oil passages to the heads & pressurize the passage from the deck down toward the cam...

Has the block ever had water in it & froze?

Whatever the case it sucks.........

Don't forget about these 2 chunks I found. I believe they are from below the oil galleys and one broke through.

 

[chermik1999]

First I would pull the heads, block the oil passage on the head gasket surface & put a rubber blow gun tip in the rocker bolt hole & see if the heads hold pressure...

next turn the engine so the cam blocks the oil passages to the heads & pressurize the passage from the deck down toward the cam...

Has the block ever had water in it & froze?

Whatever the case it sucks.........

To test that i need to block off the whole bolt hole. It comes in the hole and back out to the deck.

 

[1 Wild R/T]

To test that i need to block off the whole bolt hole. It comes in the hole and back out to the deck.

Yes, which is why I suggested a rubber tipped blow guy... The rubber tip would seal at the very outer edge of the hole..