New 440 street engine build recipe needed

[Randall Miller]

Thank you gentlemen. I really appreciate it. My local guy is older, legendary and too cheap imo and will stand behind his work. I work towards the advice everyone has given and hopefully at the end of the day we don't miss any finer points.

 

[wyrmrider]

curious
what cam for the mileage build?
Wild has great suggestions what I would have said
I like tight quench so dish is required either stock stroke or stroker
long rods, 2.2 crank pins all good cast crank is fine not eagle
you do not need rolller tip rockers with any cam for your build
use adj Iron,cup adjusters, HD at least 3/8 pushrods bigger is better some grinding
oil through the pushrods for long life of rockers I'd get them from Rocker Arm rebuilders in nor cal hard chrome shafts, bushed rockers - put your $$$ here it matters
I'd go TQ carb or new replacement TQ or EFI
hp manifolds or headers? makes a difference on the cam
EDM solids would work beehive springs
if roller cam I'd run pressure oiled cost it out no benefit for you for a daily driver

my build ported 915 wedge heads, motorhome valves, (inconel exhaust) .030 quench d dish pistons 9:1 Jones Cam stock HP exhaust TQ carb ductile moly rings Isky double springs, viton stem seals built 40 years ago still runs great with good mileage
TF tall gears custom converter

 

[Curiousyellow71]

curious
what cam for the mileage build?

We were running a 484 MP cam at that time narrow Lsa.

 

[Randall Miller]

Read up on this cam. Aggravating. Found a thread where one group of people thinks it's the best thing since naked lady parts. Next group thinks its dog meat. It's the internet.

 

[Curiousyellow71]

Sorry for the confusion.. I wasn't recommending the outdated cam that we used 25 years ago... Just answering wyrmriders question. We were running 11:1 on that engine which created a surprisingly efficient engine with that cam. The .484 cams timing events seemed to work with the combination. We had the same cam in a 440 and a 383 perhaps 14 mpg. Keep in mind a stroker needs about 2 sizes larger of cam to pull in the same power band as a smaller engine. In a 383 the mp .484 cam didnt have any bottom end...in the 510...it pulled like it had a rv torque cam. But we still shifted it at 5500.
The main point I was conveying is a stroker has a lot of potential...even mpg.

 

[Randall Miller]

Thanks for clarifying.

 

[IQ52]

We Machined/Built/Dyno Tested a couple of 440 Combo's .... posted the results over on DC.com
You know... pump Gas 500 to 550 hp 440 Hydraulic Flat Tappet Cam Combo's, but just using Flat tappet Hydraulic Cams because we don't see the "benefit" in Hydraulic Roller Cams other than holding the garbage can lid open versus the COST... which a guy might as well just use a Street Roller instead ?

Might be worth a read over here on the 440 Combo's we built/tested?
With a good core ? all can be done under $10K Machined/Built/Dyno'd
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,106687.0.html

If you've never read the Challenger340 440 builds you're missing out on some quality results.

Yeah my delivery really sucks of late.... just getting old and crotchity I guess ?

Hah! Crotchity for sure. I resemble that too.

 

[wyrmrider]

Yes I just wanted to know how he got that great mileage
MP 284
who'd a thought

 

[Curiousyellow71]

Yes I just wanted to know how he got that great mileage
MP 284
who'd a thought

We checked the mileage several times. With a thermoquad it typical got 21 hwy. With a race holley 850 dp we got 23. Quarter e.t. the carbs were equal. But you could watch the gas gauge go down every pass down the drag strip with the double pumper... The thermoquad really was a great carb used way less gas at the track.

On a side note...
...one way to get good gas mileage is to try driving 11:1 w a 484 cam on pump gas. LOL you wont be accelerating much. Sounded like a rattle snake in the car when you floored it.

 

[wyrmrider]

interesting
my cam is about 50% bigger than a DC 260 @.275 lobe lift but shorter on the seat 9:1 motor
trying to get a grip on how much smaller than the 284

 

[Curiousyellow71]

Most cams run in a stroker engine typical have wider Lsa and dual pattern with more exhaust duration. So we always looked hard at what exhaust lobe was doing on the single pattern 484 cam installed on 106 to "try" to understand why it got 20+ mpg?. For a stroker engine it started opening the exhaust valve pretty late. Our thoughts were...a combo of things helped make torque at highway speeds 50-70 mph. It was actually quite strange how little you had to step on the gas. Going up hills it didn't much care either. It would've been interesting to lower the compression for pump gas and seen how much less economy it got. My guess it still would've done pretty good, the 510 had stock valve ported 452s, iron dual plane and 1 3/4 headers back then. Power peaked at 5200. Ran 13.2 @ 108 mph at the track in 3950 lb car w 3.23 w hard crappy tires w mufflers and no traction in first anywhere.