noisey 440 valve train

[coloradodave]

Lenny, Do you have stock valve covers on your motor? I ask because I had interference problems with Harland Sharp rockers hitting the baffles inside my stock steel covers. Sounded like the rockers were loose as they were barely touching. Easy to see marks if they are...

 

[Lenny Arsenault]

Thanks everyone for all your ideas and recomendations. I will be back home in a few weeks and the motor should be back together and in the car. I have MP valve covers on the motor so not stock but, I can check the inside that's easy enough if the noise continues. I post the results after I hear the motor running again and go from there. thanks for everyones support Lenny

 

[benno440]

yeh comp cams lifters have gone to S**T, i put 3 sets through my 505, 5 lifters dropped and went soft after 600 miles. changed to lunati micro trol lifters and been going good ever since

 

[Charger686970]

I have a comp hyd. roller cam in my indy headed 383 in my 68 charger and within a few hours of starting the motor after it was built my lifters were bad. Kept running excessively rich and had low vacuum the mixtures screws with my pro-systems carb were not responding as they should so I called the engine builder and asked him to stop by and check the valve lash and starting with cylinder number 1 he said I think these lifters are bad!! He went through and re-lashed them all and said they are bad you will knew for sure when you start it. He sent them back to comp and they just told him we are going to warranty them but would not tell him why they thought they went bad I put them in but still have yet to run the lash on them, found out a lot of the comp stuff is from china cores go figure. I do not have any faith in the new set. benno440 how long have you had the micro trol lifters and did you install them on the comp cam or change the cam also?

 

[benno440]

I have a comp hyd. roller cam in my indy headed 383 in my 68 charger and within a few hours of starting the motor after it was built my lifters were bad. Kept running excessively rich and had low vacuum the mixtures screws with my pro-systems carb were not responding as they should so I called the engine builder and asked him to stop by and check the valve lash and starting with cylinder number 1 he said I think these lifters are bad!! He went through and re-lashed them all and said they are bad you will knew for sure when you start it. He sent them back to comp and they just told him we are going to warranty them but would not tell him why they thought they went bad I put them in but still have yet to run the lash on them, found out a lot of the comp stuff is from china cores go figure. I do not have any faith in the new set. benno440 how long have you had the micro trol lifters and did you install them on the comp cam or change the cam also?

i always had a lunati cam and was using comp lifters, went through a fe sets as they just kept getting loose ( dropped lifters)
put the microtrol in adjusted them and have not even need to re-tighten them yet and have done about 2000km

 

[Hemirunner]

Lots of posts with lash mentioned in the same breath as hydraulics. Hydraulic lifters have preload, solid lifters have lash. Big difference.

 

[snakeoil24]

Lifters are made by one company these days. Again believe it or not only one company left who makes flat tappets. National Tool makes for everyone. Crane, Comp Isky Federal mogul, Sealed Power, Everyone buys from the same supplier. Tjhey moved most operations to China years ago. Another industry that has disappeared.

 

[Charger686970]

yes, Hemirunner you are correct with my hdy. roller it is lifter preload not lash ever one I am around says lash for both and I know it's not correct and I hear it so much they have me using lash now and I still have no faith in the new set of lifters comp sent guess I will find out once I get a chance to set the preload not sure if I should use the comp instructions for the preload with aluminum heads or if there is another way people like to set them with aluminum anyone set their lifters different from the instructions and have them work?

 

[Hemirunner]

Is the noise coming from the rockers or the lifters?

 

[IQ52]

yes, Hemirunner you are correct with my hdy. roller it is lifter preload not lash ever one I am around says lash for both and I know it's not correct and I hear it so much they have me using lash now and I still have no faith in the new set of lifters comp sent guess I will find out once I get a chance to set the preload not sure if I should use the comp instructions for the preload with aluminum heads or if there is another way people like to set them with aluminum anyone set their lifters different from the instructions and have them work?

So I called Comp Cams and questioned them about the two different sets of instructions they have on line for the 8921-16 hydraulic roller lifters. One set says zero to 1/8 turn preload and the other says one full turn preload. During the conversation with Comp tech they say "sorry about the two different instructions" use 1/2 turn, it's best. Even Comp doesn't know what they are doing. I have used zero to 1/8 on iron heads and 1/8 to 1/4 on aluminum heads to account for head expansion. At these settings the lifters are sometimes a little noisy. At 1/2 to 1 turn preload I've experienced lifter collapse and noisy lifers at RPM. You will have to experiment from 1/8 to 1 full turn to see what works best for you.

I will never run a hydraulic roller cam again. As hydraulic roller lifters are compatable with solid roller lobes, if the customer wants a hydraulic roller cam I order the cam with solid roller lobes and when it's too noisy we switch to solid rollers. Problem solved.

 

[Charger686970]

So I called Comp Cams and questioned them about the two different sets of instructions they have on line for the 8921-16 hydraulic roller lifters. One set says zero to 1/8 turn preload and the other says one full turn preload. During the conversation with Comp tech they say "sorry about the two different instructions" use 1/2 turn, it's best. Even Comp doesn't know what they are doing. I have used zero to 1/8 on iron heads and 1/8 to 1/4 on aluminum heads to account for head expansion. At these settings the lifters are sometimes a little noisy. At 1/2 to 1 turn preload I've experienced lifter collapse and noisy lifers at RPM. You will have to experiment from 1/8 to 1 full turn to see what works best for you.

I will never run a hydraulic roller cam again. As hydraulic roller lifters are compatable with solid roller lobes, if the customer wants a hydraulic roller cam I order the cam with solid roller lobes and when it's too noisy we switch to solid rollers. Problem solved.

So I have been debating on whether to give these lifters a shot or since the carb and intake is off and I have the indy 2pc valley plate off to put in the lifters comp sent do I just go a little further and swap the cam to a solid roller? I was looking at Hughes stuff lately seeing I don't like comp after this. My current comp cam specs at lsa 106.0 int.549 exh.544 and duration at .050 int 242 and exh 248. Was thinking of e-mailing Hughes and send them my specs and seeing what they would recommend in a solid roller and I know I will probably need springs and pushrods unless I was luck and my pushrods could be shortened. I also have comp pushrods with comp pro-magnum roller rockers. Thanks IQ52 for the preload info that will help if I decide to give them a shot I want to since I spent the money for the stuff but I don't want a failure that could be worse and damage the heads. How long do solid roller cams last in street use? Thanks again

 

[Dennis H]

I nominate this thread for the run-on sentence award.

 

[Lenny Arsenault]

Hemirunner could be a combination of the two, sounds like rockers at lower rpm's then at about 2 thousand rpm's and higher sounds deeper to me. Last time I talked to the machine shop the motor should be together and running again this week so we will see what they figuired out for a fix. My guess is the lifters are bad again or lifter the lifter bores have to much clearence. What else will make the lifters bleed down to a rate you can see them bleed down.

 

[texas69bee]

I agree with WP29. All 16 lifters??? Why not pre load them with oil to begin with. Put them in a container of oil and pump it with a push rod. Your rocker arms may also be side specific.