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Question about wedge heads

fmahannah

1963 Dodge Polara Max Wedge Tribute
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I have a 63 polara 500. The engine is a 62 413 60 over. Right now it has ported 906 440 heads on it but I want to put wedge heads on it along with crossram setup to be more like a wedge car would have been. With original heads and intakes so pricey, I am considering the mopar performance cast iron heads supposedly designed to replace the 62-64 wedge heads. For example the P5007494 or P5249824. My concern is that I saw something about for certain valve sizes the cylinder wall needed a relief cut into it to clear the valves?

My block does not have the relief cutouts so I have no idea which heads I can use without having to machine or change the block?

Might consider aluminum wedge heads if anyone has recommendations, but needs to be bolt on mod.

Thanks
 
Hi
Well, Sir; I went through thes same challenge and decided on ported 452s and the 440 as a short block (punched out of course) with the A&A cross-ram and carb/linkage set-up.
Why specifically?
1. Save money
2. Driveability
Because for my application, going with that "full Race" MAX WEDGE head I would suffer in street driving capabilities.
For me the heads are too radical.
Mr. Dale Reed, Baldwin Park, CA built my engine (yes I helped a bit) and he builds MAXIES for a living.
His advice was 440, 906s or 452s.
 

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Stock bore on 413 is 4 3/16 (4.1875) + 1/16 (.0625 exactly) = 4 4/16 (4 1/4 or 4.250) . You now have a 426 wedge engine. All B & RB engines are wedge engines and the 906 head is a wedge head and quite a bit better than the 62-65 383 & 413 heads. Those older heads had smaller ex. valves than the later 906 and closed combustion chambers. 906 has open chambers. The closed chamber will give more comp. ratio but may cause problems running pump gas. The 906 is about as good as you can get in a factory stock head. You will not run into any valve collision problems unless you go to an oversize valve, usually a 2.140" intake. And you have said you want to avoid a hi cost situation. What crossram intake are you considering? The short crossram (426 max wedge) will only work w/ max wedge heads due to the large intake ports. The intake ports on the max wedge intake would overlap the intake ports on the 906 head. And, if you use the max wedge head you will have to notch the block for intake clearance ( depending on valve lift). The long crossram intake as used on Chry 413 and some Dodges should work OK W/ the 906 head. A sensible low buck upgrade to the 906 head would be a set of 452 heads since they have the hardened ex valve seats. Wait till someone weighs in on 426 max wedge info for more info on valve clearance issues.
 
What about the crossram that I think A&A makes for 440 heads? If I can keep my current heads and don't actually need the wedge heads it would save money but would it get me the same performance?
Note I am new to mopars so I can use all the advice I can get. The 906 heads on it now are already redone, ported, and have hardened seats and adjustable valve train, but they also have the exhaust crossover passages which I am not sure will work with any crossram?
 
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All 361, 383, 413, 426 and 440's are WEDGE engines because they all use WEDGE heads. The 426 Hemi on the other hand uses Hemi heads, hence the name HEMI. If you use your current WEDGE heads and purchase from Mancini Racing or some other Mopar supplier the A&A casting Max Wedge intake made to fit "as cast" factory 440 heads, it will work with or without a heat crossover passage. http://www.manciniracing.com/440crmawican.html
 
What about the crossram that I think A&A makes for 440 heads? If I can keep my current heads and don't actually need the wedge heads it would save money but would it get me the same performance?
Note I am new to mopars so I can use all the advice I can get. The 906 heads on it now are already redone, ported, and have hardened seats and adjustable valve train, but they also have the exhaust crossover passages which I am not sure will work with any crossram?


GOLLY, Did you mot read my POST?

READ my post
It is exclusive.
Built by Mr. Dale Reed, the Max Wedge Guru
YES: It has the A&A Cross Ram
YES: It runs the existing 906 heads (my Case: 452s)
YES: More manageable on the street
YES: Cheaper than spending the $$ for a set of Max heads
YES: Looks identical to a Max Wedge engine without the cold start issues
 
GOLLY, Did you mot read my POST?

READ my post
It is exclusive.
Built by Mr. Dale Reed, the Max Wedge Guru
YES: It has the A&A Cross Ram
YES: It runs the existing 906 heads (my Case: 452s)
YES: More manageable on the street
YES: Cheaper than spending the $$ for a set of Max heads
YES: Looks identical to a Max Wedge engine without the cold start issues

Yes I read your post, but yours is a 440 not a 413, and you did not mention exhaust crossover and I am not familiar enough with mopar heads to assume that your 452s had the crossover passage or that the 413 and the 440 can take the same top end components. Sorry but I did say I am new to mopars.
 
Yup
You are correct,
You have the 413
My suggestion: Use your existing heads
Save you BIG Money from purchasing the Edelbrock Max Wedge Heads

Firstly: What do you want to do with your car?
Race?
Street application with mild hot rodding, show off that Mopar?
That is what my plans are as soon as the 63 Gets out of Body Shop.

Street driven, ocassional 80 foot burnouts to scare the Camaros and Chevelles

Getting into the Max Wedge head can be costly.
Performance wise, they are "Race-purpose"
Some on the Forum may disagree or kindly dispute this claim but remember: Original Max Wedge cars were as fast or faster than the 426 Hemi.
It was made for Race, to beat the Pontiac 421 Superdutys and the Ford 427s.

Remember:
The 413 was not developed to be a racing engine, but a high torque, medium horsepower powerplant to haul the Chrysler luxury barges. Still, because it was Chrysler’s biggest engine in displacement for some years, the Petty racing clan did their own development work on the 413 starting in 1960. Then, in 1962, a special version of the 413 known as the “Max Wedge” was sold for drag racing and street use, with an official 420 bhp at 5,000 rpm.

Good luck with your decision

Most importantly, a fellow B-bodies Forum member has at the bottom of each post:
"Fill your Library before you fill your garage"

So: before you blow big buck$ and then regret it because you can not appreciate or enjoy it, do your research.
 
My 413 was dynoed at 365 like it is (blueprinted and balanced, 509 cam, etc), has about 1000 miles on the rebuild by a speed shop in CA. Car will never be raced, street and show only. Just want the wedge setup under the hood for my own satsifaction more than anything. And most likely the wedge manifolds and exhaust with cutouts.
 
Since you keep writing "wedge setup under the hood" it is confusing. As has been said, if it's not a hemi, it's a wedge. If you write 'MAX WEDGE set-up under the hood' then we all will picture a crossram intake with dual carburetors.
Just clarifying everything, not preaching.
 
Sorry, a bit of misinterpretation on the use of wedge in wedge head. You are obviously talking about the max wedge or the 426 Ramcharger and Superstock engines. The term came about long after the 60's era. Back then they were known as Stages 1, 2 & 3 engines. Stage 1 being the 62 413, stage 2 being the 63 426, and stage 3 being the 64 426 wedge (not a hemi). The stage 3 was eclipsed by the 426 hemi introduced that year. Both the stage 1&2 came w/ 2 comp. ratios, 11.5:1 & 13.5:1. All max wedge engines had closed chamber heads and will produce rather high cr and could cause problems w/ pump gas. The 13.5 engines were intended for all out drag racing and even by today's standard they are pretty awesome. Had to go to some old tech articles to find info on the heads. Ex valves were 1.88" and ports were 20% larger than standard heads. No heat crossover either. They are kind of rare and would be kind of extreme to run on the street. If, as some say, the new crossram will work on 440 heads (906 & 452) then you'll be OK. Valve notches: according to the tech articles I have the notches were for valve relief as well as to improve flow. Max wedge engines had valve lift of .510 to .520". If you are running a street cam you shouldn't run into trouble. 906 heads, especially if they are ported and have hard seats are about as good as you can get in a stock head. A word of caution on the carbs: Don't go crazy on size. Remember that you will be running on two carbs 100%. They aren't staged like inline 2x4 setups. For street a 500 cfm would be adequate. Good luck with your build
 
If I get that far...

For a Chrysler big block (except the hemi), all are mostly the same. Main dif is cubic inches. Past that, RB (Raised Block) motors can use same heads, intakes, so on, bolt on stuff.
The 413 is a RB engine, and pretty much same as a 440, besides the bore.

Have a 440 I'm setting up, 906s, and a 63 model crossram. Pretty much a slap on deal. What I did do, for what it's worth, mild porting, and matched ports, by chamfering the 906s ports simply to ease flow. Cannot fully port 906 heads, since there's not enough meat, possibly going into the water jacket.
Heat cross-over...made my own intake gaskets, bonded two layer, adding stainless steel plates to block the cross-over ports.

Time will tell if it will work, but ways to get around things.
 
Thanks for all the advice guys. For someone new to mopars this is the place to get the information needed to make intelligent decisions on upgrades. Looks like I will go with the A&A 440 crossram. Will share the results when done. Can anyone recommend a cam with better manners but similar choppy idle as the 509 that is in it now. The low idle vacuum (5") makes her a little tough to get tuned but I have a vacuum pump for the brakes and managed to get a decent idle by changing timing and running the weakest step up springs (was real rich at idle because these were not getting pulled down to lean setting).

Thanks again!

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Nice Polara. One suggestion I have is you'll have to get very creative if you want to keep your air conditioning. I don't believe your compressor will fit in that location with the Max Wedge intake. Also it will look pretty odd since there were very few, if any Max Wedge cars that had A/C. As a matter of fact, I don't believe it was even available with the Max Wedge option. There is a bracket made by Bouchillion Performance http://www.bpeusa.com/BPE4705.asp that will relocate the compressor and move it from the top of the engine down where the power steering pump normally goes, but it will only work if your car has manual steering. Also needs the shorty Sanden compressor. One other thing you'll need to do in order to make it look right is repaint the engine the correct orange color. All Max Wedge engines were Race Hemi Orange - Mopar part #P4120751.

If you're looking for a choppy idle and don't intend to go racing, check into the Hughes Engines Whiplash series. I don't know your compression ratio but if its fairly low one of those will do the trick. Choppy idle but very streetable cam.

Since you're new to Mopars you probably should know that Mopar people aren't like Ford and GM types. Generally speaking Mopar people are so passionate about the brand that we can be kind of **** sometimes. If you're going for the Max Wedge look, you need to do it so it looks fairly correct. Just slapping on parts like the Chevy and Ford guys do won't garner you much respect. Good luck with your build and keep us up to date on your progress.
 
I knew I had to repaint the block, but did not know the AC would not fit. Previous owner added it, but it needs the dash switches repaired before it will work. Car is power steering. So I may have to remove the AC completely (but it gets pretty hot here in GA). Compression is supposed to be around 10 to 1 per PO?
 
HOLY COW!
GREAT 63 DODGE POLARA!

You can go with the Sanden AC compressor set-up.

BTW: there is a Cross Ram manifold for sale on the forum right now: http://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/showthread.php?101882-Cross-Ram-Setup-with-Valve-Covers

I have a 63 Polara in the auto-body shop now (You saw the 440 built as a Maxie going in to it see pics above)
BUT I did put the Sanden AC set-up on my 70 Superbee with the 426 Hemi
See pics:

So: You CAN fit the sanden in your Max Wedge style 413 build-up
Call Bouchillions, he is a Mopar expert and has entire kits for Sanden AC with Mopar


AC on 426 Hemi:
 

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63 Fury with max wedge, P/S, A/C. Not concerned with originality. Driven 4-5 times a week year round. Summers around Sacramento are hot, 100*+ now and then. Custom bracket and Sanden compressor:
 

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