Warning: Dealership Rant!

[Chargerjase]

I don't even know where to start with this. I took my 2017 Challenger T/A to San Antonio Dodge. The issue was that my touch screen had delaminated and was causing random things to happen on the display. This is a known issue of course, but no, no, the guy from the dealership said they needed the car for 2 days while they diagnosed it. So as I had no other car to use at the time, I had to rent one. About half an hour after I rent the car I get a phone call from the dealership. Its all ready to pick up, we need to replace the radio. Seriously, WTF, I just rented a car for two days. Get back to the dealership to pick up my car and its absolutely covered in ****. I said to him that I freshly detailed the car and now look at it. His answer, oh sorry, we have a lot of trees around here and that must be sap from them. After noticing that not one other car on the lot had sap on it, I called bullshit. Sorry, we will wash it for you. So another wait at the dealership while they do that.
Then a week later I drop the car back at the dealership and wait two hours while they fit the radio. The guy comes out and says it's all done. I get in my car and notice immediately that nothing works. I asked the guy what he did. He said just pulled the old one out and put the new one in. Yes but what about all of the codes that digitally connect the radio to the car??? A blank look, then he told me they have never had to do that in the past. So for $1300, that was what I got. Fortunately the car was drivable, so I drove it away and vowed that those idiots would never see another dime of my money again. I also wrote a scathing review on their website which unfortunately, joined a whole lot more poor reviews. I ended up programming the thing properly with the help of a friend that had access to another dealership. What a bunch of incompetent rogues. Rant over.

 

[68BabyBlue]

My dad was in the new car sales business from 1968-1995. He told me many times that the parts and service department were expected to cover ALL the operating expenses of the dealership. Car, truck and van Sales were the gravy on top of that.

When the Clark family owned the Chrysler Plymouth dealership in my town, they made a point of telling their customers the importance of the service department to their business, and the family had a reputation for treating their customers well. My dad was loyal to them for four decades. The business changed hands in 2007, acquired by a statewide chain of stores. I never bought another new Mopar after that, started hearing the stories like the earlier posts. Rob Clark and I are still friends today, sadly his family's way of doing business seems to have vanished.

One of the fringe benefits of living in economically depressed rural PA is the existence of small independent shops with labor rates under $100 per hour, who can perform decent work.

 

[moparedtn]

I can't remember the last time I dealt with a dealer. Maybe on those factory recall of the air bags?
Yes, I realize we've been blessed not to need dealer support on anything. The '04 Ram and the
'12 Charger R/T have both (knock on wood) been rock solid reliable and I've kept up on routine
maintenance - but that was the plan all along. Thankful it's worked.

 

[Dennis H]

Dealer experiences need a name attached. Normandin, San Jose. Dealer from Hell. Incompetent too. I’ve got three of the ZF A8’s. Watch the youtubes on a fluid change for these. NO DEALER I ever had contact with is capable of doing this. Warm, lift, fill, cool, repeat. No way. If they ever get miles on them, my shop will do a drain and fill.

 

[AR67GTX]

I bought a 23 RAM a few months ago, the first full size truck I’ve ever owned. It’s like a Cadillac in ride and drive but got more nanny features than my wife’s Lexus. And then I started reading on the forums about the cracked manifolds, Hemi camshaft tic, the leaking rear window/antenna frying electrical components on the back cab wall. I keep hoping that after 5 years into the model change that they will have cured a lot of this stuff but if they didn’t after 4 years I doubt they got around to it by the 5th year. It’s funny too, I was looking at the new Consumer reports rating last night on RAM and it was green in all but one category and is rated a Best Buy by CR. But at the top of the chart it was rated as overall unreliable? I think I need to stay off new car forums and CR.

 

[HawkRod]

Did you actually get to see the Crack?

I heard the ticking one day. I've had enough header leaks to right away know what the sound was. I opened the hood and verified it was the passenger side. It sounded like it was coming from the middle of the manifold and from under it, but I never laid eyes on the crack.
If the repair hadn't of been under warranty, I'd have a set of headers on it now!

I know I’m going to sound like I am sticking up for the dealerships. The overhead at these dealerships is crazy. Each year they are sent thousands of dollars in special tools. About 75% never get opened for years. Not to mention salary’s of the people you don’t see. I was told by a Nissan G.M. That in order for then to sell the Z cars, they had to buy 180k of special equipment. Everything is very expensive these days.
Hell we sell a 42k tire changer, and people are buying them!!

I agree, and this is part of my point. My wife's Lincoln MKZ (which has been a great car, by the way) has these weird screws that need a Phillips with 3 (not 4) tabs - like a Mercedes symbol. This to remove a cover so you can drain the oil. There is absolutely NO REASON to have these other than to discourage people from doing their own work. But, in order to remove them, you need a special Philips screwdriver. Ford could have chosen to use regular Philips screws, but they didn't.
I am convinced many of the weird tools needed are designed solely with the purpose of locking you in to go to the dealership. It becomes all but impossible for the mom and pop local repair shops to have the special tools, so people are forced to go to the dealerships.

I bought a 23 RAM a few months ago, the first full size truck I’ve ever owned. It’s like a Cadillac in ride and drive but got more nanny features than my wife’s Lexus. And then I started reading on the forums about the cracked manifolds, Hemi camshaft tic, the leaking rear window/antenna frying electrical components on the back cab wall. I keep hoping that after 5 years into the model change that they will have cured a lot of this stuff but if they didn’t after 3 years I doubt they got around to it by the 5th year. It’s funny too, I was looking at the new Consumer reports rating last night on RAM and it was green in all but one category and is rated a Best Buy by CR. But at the top of the chart it was rated as overall unreliable? I think I need to stay off new car forums and CR.

To balance my rant, I have to say my Ram truck has been great. I have 45,*** miles on it and I still have the original tires! It is comfortable, dependable and has lots of great features. So I can't say I've had any issue other than the cracked manifold.

 

[JackR]

The last few daily driver cars I’ve owned only until the extended warranties ran out.
Used to only think that was only required for the German cars.

 

[Dennis H]

Not too far off topic, but this is how a 16 year old 5.7 looks inside the valve cover. And why. No tick. MDS too.

 

[XS22J8R]

I’ve always done my own oil changes, but for my ‘21 Ram I’ve been taking it a dealer so the oil change will be documented if I ever have an engine issue with the 6.4. Also the 0W-40 SRT oil is a little hard to find.
Last year the oil change and a tire rotation were around $185 as I recall. I’m about due for an oil change, but recently got a Ram credit card which will give me a $100 rebate on my first purchase at a CJDR dealer and I have a link for a $25 rebate on a Pennzoil platinum oil change so this oil change should be cheap!
The bumper to bumper warranty is running out next month and I’m tempted to buy a factory extended warranty as any repair nowadays threatens to bankrupt an owner with the complex electronics etc.
I went through a nightmare with a dealership on an issue on the clutch master cylinder that Stellantis had extended the warranty for on my Dart a few years ago. The car ended up in the service department for over 2 weeks while the service manager gave me one BS story after another. First story was that my rear brakes needed replaced for $500, as the clutch cylinder got its fluid from the brake master reservoir and my brakes were worn out. The intermittent clutch pedal sticking issue had happened for 2 years so I knew damn well that low brake fluid wasn’t the issue. I told them I’d replace my own brakes when I got the car back, just fix the clutch master! New coated rotors and ceramic pads cost me $75 at Rock Auto when I did the brakes soon after.
Then came stories about superseded parts, sometimes the service manager wouldn’t return my calls so I had to call customer care a few times for help.
Finally he tells me they got the new part for my car but the line from the master cylinder to the clutch slave was leaking too, and that wasn’t covered by the extended warranty so I’d have to pay $600. I was so beat up at this point I said fine, I need my car back, but I want to see a $600 hydraulic clutch line, so give me the old part.
It was listed on my invoice as $160. It has O rings in the fittings and retained by roll pins. How was labor $440 when they were already replacing the clutch master under warranty??
Service manager had the gall to ask me for a good rating if I got a survey too!
I was robbed, crooks! At least they’d given me a loaner for the time they played their games and robbed me on that new line.
Recently a number of YouTube videos have come out about how slimy Napleton CJDR in Arlington Heights is. I’m pleased to see them getting called out. 0 star stealership!

 

[Hey-O]

My dad was in the new car sales business from 1968-1995. He told me many times that the parts and service department were expected to cover ALL the operating expenses of the dealership. Car, truck and van Sales were the gravy on top of that.

A friend of mine owned a Dodge dealership, he'd sell a car dirt cheap, just to get you in line at the service department. The profit on cars is not what you think, unless you buy a hellcat for thousands over sticker, no thanks. It's parts, used cars and service that keep a dealership in business. Fact!!

Believe it or not, used cars are a biggy. Giving you a deal on the sticker price and stealing your used car from you is what they want, if they want it....... You pay at one end or the other. That's how the world turns unfortunately.

 

[Hey-O]

Not too far off topic, but this is how a 16 year old 5.7 looks inside the valve cover. And why. No tick. MDS too.

View attachment 1620282

View attachment 1620283

There's a reason for everything!!

 

[RemCharger]

I heard the ticking one day. I've had enough header leaks to right away know what the sound was. I opened the hood and verified it was the passenger side. It sounded like it was coming from the middle of the manifold and from under it, but I never laid eyes on the crack.
If the repair hadn't of been under warranty, I'd have a set of headers on it now!



I agree, and this is part of my point. My wife's Lincoln MKZ (which has been a great car, by the way) has these weird screws that need a Phillips with 3 (not 4) tabs - like a Mercedes symbol. This to remove a cover so you can drain the oil. There is absolutely NO REASON to have these other than to discourage people from doing their own work. But, in order to remove them, you need a special Philips screwdriver. Ford could have chosen to use regular Philips screws, but they didn't.
I am convinced many of the weird tools needed are designed solely with the purpose of locking you in to go to the dealership. It becomes all but impossible for the mom and pop local repair shops to have the special tools, so people are forced to go to the dealerships.



To balance my rant, I have to say my Ram truck has been great. I have 45,*** miles on it and I still have the original tires! It is comfortable, dependable and has lots of great features. So I can't say I've had any issue other than the cracked manifold.

I had to ask about the Crack because I've done tons of them, and never seen a cracked manifold. The dealer parts guys have asked if I want a new manifold with the gasket, because it might be cracked. Sometimes they need to be planed.
The rear bolts broken? Pretty much all the time. Sometimes the fronts too.
The 2 rear bolts are " special" about 15 bucks a piece.

 

[HawkRod]

I had to ask about the Crack because I've done tons of them, and never seen a cracked manifold. The dealer parts guys have asked if I want a new manifold with the gasket, because it might be cracked. Sometimes they need to be planed.
The rear bolts broken? Pretty much all the time. Sometimes the fronts too.
The 2 rear bolts are " special" about 15 bucks a piece.

Yeah, honestly I don't know if it was a crack, blown gasket or whatever. All I know is that there was definitely an exhaust leak. Since it was under warranty, I really didn't care what they did. It's fixed now and the truck is quiet again.

On a slightly different topic, I have heard that the exhaust manifolds on the 5.7 RAMs are quite restrictive. I don't know if that is true but if it is, I'd be even more interested in eventually putting a set of good quality headers on it.

 

[AR67GTX]

I’ve heard about the broken bolts too. Some have said (theorized) that they went weak on the manifold bolts to sacrifice them over the manifold that’s prone to warping. It’s almost crazy enough sounding to be true. And a lot of RAM (and other make owners) hate the stop/start feature and defeat it. But they say idling excessively is the main cause of the cam/lifter tic. So I’ve decided to let it shut down at stops rather than idle. Also plan to use the forum touted oil/ oil filter/supplement brew in an effort to keep the motor healthy.

 

[RemCharger]

Yeah, honestly I don't know if it was a crack, blown gasket or whatever. All I know is that there was definitely an exhaust leak. Since it was under warranty, I really didn't care what they did. It's fixed now and the truck is quiet again.

On a slightly different topic, I have heard that the exhaust manifolds on the 5.7 RAMs are quite restrictive. I don't know if that is true but if it is, I'd be even more interested in eventually putting a set of good quality headers on it.

They don't look like much, but if they make 395 horse with a 345ci , they can't be all  that restrictive. You would think.
a back to back wheel dyno result would be the best predictor i guess.

 

[KiwiKid72]

That's insane pricing. Pretty much the same thievery goes on in New Zealand dealerships and service centres. You just know that they will make you grab your ankles.

 

[HawkRod]

And a lot of RAM (and other make owners) hate the stop/start feature and defeat it.

I have hated with a passion every single start stop feature on a car I have ever driven, except for my RAM. All other start stop features I have had the displeasure to drive start the car by using the starter. There is a noticeable lag once your foot comes off the brake and the car starts to move forward.
But my RAM uses an "Arnold Schwarzenegger" alternator that doubles as a motor. So when you take your foot of the brake the alternator turns the serpentine belt, which also moves the crank and starts the vehicle too. So you move forward while it starts and it really feels quite seamless. As I said, it is the only start stop feature that I haven't hated.

 

[DeltaV]

So far, so good with my wife's 2020 Charger R/T (5.7 Hemi). The odometer will hit 50k miles in a week or two.

I had one odd issue with a HID headlamp. It intermittently flickered over the course of several days, the color flared one night, and then it went out. I looked it over when I got home late and didn't see anything outwardly wrong. I decided to check the fuses and found one headlight fuse was distorted from heat. I swapped headlight fuses and the "problem" moved with the suspect fuse. Go figure. I replaced both fuses even though the other one wasn't distorted by heat. No headlight issues for two months now. BTW, I run the high beams for long periods of time every morning/evening.

I'm sure a stealership would have replaced a lot more than just the faulty fuse if I had taken the car to them.

 

[#41]

Of course the sky-high repair bills are now being reflected in our insurance premiums, so less people are getting mandatory insurance, which jacks up everybody's premiums even more. You really have to feel for the elderly, disabled, people with moderate incomes, and mechanically un-inclined. You used to be able to skate by driving old junk and fixing it your self, but owning a vehicle now is becomming unaffordable for many people.

I too am planning on getting down to only one newer vehicle when the current pair wear out. I will be the shaggy old man in the classic pickup truck going 10 under the speed limit. Don't hate me.

 

[68BabyBlue]

Of course the sky-high repair bills are now being reflected in our insurance premiums, so less people are getting mandatory insurance, which jacks up everybody's premiums even more. You really have to feel for the elderly, disabled, people with moderate incomes, and mechanically un-inclined. You used to be able to skate by driving old junk and fixing it your self, but owning a vehicle now is becomming unaffordable for many people.

I too am planning on getting down to only one newer vehicle when the current pair wear out. I will be the shaggy old man in the classic pickup truck going 10 under the speed limit. Don't hate me.

My friend with the Midas shop caters to folks with moderate incomes, and in my case, those with older vehicles. He treats people right, and his online ratings reflect what he does. I can't believe how many times he's fabricated a piece to complete a repair for under a hundred bucks, where a dealer would have whacked me for at least a grand for an entire new assembly. It's nice to see a guy who treats customers well have a prosperous business. He started with nothing years ago. He has zero turnover with his mechanics either.