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Hello?
I been abandoned...
I been abandoned...
What carb to choose? Mostly stock 440 GTX
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Burns69RT
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I'm a double pumper fan, but just get yourself a 800cfm Holley street avenger. With vac secs. You'll be happy.
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Well, it appears Edelbrock has the market price-fixed on their 1812 Thunder AVS. No matter where I look, the thing is going to cost $401.59 plus.
None of the usual discounts at Advance, Autozone, etc. apply to it.
That makes the decision even tougher.
Think I'll pursue the Carter AVS I've linked to in this thread first. Willing to take the risk for half the money.
None of the usual discounts at Advance, Autozone, etc. apply to it.
That makes the decision even tougher.
Think I'll pursue the Carter AVS I've linked to in this thread first. Willing to take the risk for half the money.
Burns69RT
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I've never been a fan of edelbrock carbs or Carter's. Like said before try pro systems best in the biz so far
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Gentlemen,
The later Carter AVS carbs, beginning in 1969 had adjustable "off idle air bleed" for a leaner off idle transition (the MOPAR CAP, cleaner air package, mandated this). the off idle transition system is very easily "fixed", by 2 small lead split fishing sinkers, lightly installed in the carb's base near the primary throttle valves. In addition, the idle mixture was limited by the use of stops, to prevent the mixture screws from being turned out too far, adding more fuel. I believe the 1969 and 1970 AVS carbs, the idle mixture screws were sealed behind small lead plugs, which were at the base of the carb running perpendicular to the base. All one had to do was carefully remove the plugs that hid the real mixture screws, and thru the use of a small screwdriver, adjust the mixture screws while the engine was running. The AVS is critical to float level, especially for secondary transition. If the float level is low, the secondary nozzles will be begin feeding fuel later and the result will be a bog or sag until the secondary nozzles begin to feed fuel. Remember, air flow will respond faster than the fuel flow due to the different densities. The AVS has no additional secondary fuel feed transition circuits unlike the Quadrajet (demand operated not mechanically supplied which help with the secondary transition). The AVS's air valve setting is critical; error on the slightly tighter spring setting---this helps with the secondary transition....but keep the static fuel level spot on or maybe 1/8" higher than specified. This is just my opinion of course.
Cheers,
RJ Renton
The later Carter AVS carbs, beginning in 1969 had adjustable "off idle air bleed" for a leaner off idle transition (the MOPAR CAP, cleaner air package, mandated this). the off idle transition system is very easily "fixed", by 2 small lead split fishing sinkers, lightly installed in the carb's base near the primary throttle valves. In addition, the idle mixture was limited by the use of stops, to prevent the mixture screws from being turned out too far, adding more fuel. I believe the 1969 and 1970 AVS carbs, the idle mixture screws were sealed behind small lead plugs, which were at the base of the carb running perpendicular to the base. All one had to do was carefully remove the plugs that hid the real mixture screws, and thru the use of a small screwdriver, adjust the mixture screws while the engine was running. The AVS is critical to float level, especially for secondary transition. If the float level is low, the secondary nozzles will be begin feeding fuel later and the result will be a bog or sag until the secondary nozzles begin to feed fuel. Remember, air flow will respond faster than the fuel flow due to the different densities. The AVS has no additional secondary fuel feed transition circuits unlike the Quadrajet (demand operated not mechanically supplied which help with the secondary transition). The AVS's air valve setting is critical; error on the slightly tighter spring setting---this helps with the secondary transition....but keep the static fuel level spot on or maybe 1/8" higher than specified. This is just my opinion of course.
Cheers,
RJ Renton
I would call barnett they always give me the best price on edelbrock, msd, etc... They sell them on ebay for $400 so ebay and paypal fees are costing them a few bucks, most of the time they will pass that savings along to you if you pay over the phone, just have to ask the right way, lol... even if its 5%, thats $20 on that carb.... 866-522-3019
PS I would STILL call promax and buy a rebuilt holley off of him, he will dyno tune it and you will just bolt it on, probably for less than the $400... That edelbrock aint' gonna treat you better out of the box than something someone already dyno tuned for you...
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As bad a taste in my mouth as I have for Holley anything right now, that might be the most economical game in town right now, at least for one somebody has at least gone thru.
Somebody has the right, rebuilt Carter AVS on here for sale right now for $200 + the ride. I offered $200 incl. ship and the crickets started chirping...
dieseldazzle
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I can dig around this weekend and I think I have an edelbrock or carter carb sitting on the shelf that you can play with and see how you like it before you dole out big money??
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Holy cow, really? What a generous offer! Perfect scenario for me, too - if the engine does the exact same thing with a different carb, it'll tell me a lot.
I'm game if you are. THANKS!
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Guess not...
just buy a carb already ,lol.. I would have went to autozone and pulled one off the shelf, just to be able to drive the car by now 
shipping a carb back and forth is going to be $50 alone and then you may still need a carb...
shipping a carb back and forth is going to be $50 alone and then you may still need a carb...
dieseldazzle
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The car is quite drivable and we do so often. It ain't "right", but after all the heartaches, work and cubic $$$ expended, I'm gonna drive the damn thing.just buy a carb already ,lol.. I would have went to autozone and pulled one off the shelf, just to be able to drive the car by now
BTW, the current Holley is an Advance Auto "shelf buy".
Money has gotten damn near unobtanium and I tend to research the living hell out of things, so I want to do this one....last....time and be done with it, that's all.
- - - Updated - - -
Done, sir.
dieseldazzle
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Replied. I cant get one to you until 9/21 and at that time I plan to ship one out to you unless I hear differntly. Check your PM>
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In the meantime, a "new" remanufactured Cardone distributor and my favorite Accel tan cap and rotor are on the way. That will eliminate the other possibility perhaps?
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Update:
Well, I had ordered the Cardone distributor from what I thought to be a reputable bunch, in this case AutoZone.
My first time trying their online ordering - hey, 20% off and no core charge to boot.
Good deal from a huge, known vendor, right?
Well, not so much...
After waiting patiently over a week, I contacted them and was told that it hadn't actually shipped directly from Cardone to me, but instead had been received by AutoZone and they'd be forwarding it on promptly.
Again, not so much as it turned out.
It seems the customer service reps at the ZONE routinely lie to customers.
Yeah, I said it. LIE.
When it didn't arrive some days later, another call resulted in a promise to act immediately, that they'd contact me via phone the first thing next morning.
Another lie.
When I contacted them the third time that evening, a rep told me none of the previous arrangements/promises were even on file in their computer system. They promised to "make it right" pronto, too, including something "for my trouble".
Lie #3....sense a pattern here?
It's a stupid distributor, AZ. You show it as immediately available on your site. My invoice said it would directly ship to me from the manufacturer (bullsh..), not from you as your website indicated - but then, that never happened, either.
FINALLY...
Last Saturday (!) I get a call from them and am informed that CARDONE HAS NONE and they also are not offering any timeline to produce more.
In other words, AutoZone sold me a distributor that THEY DIDN'T HAVE and CARDONE DOESN'T MAKE ANYMORE, then lied to me for weeks about the whole thing.
Idiots. Deceitful idiots at that.
Refunded, I turned to a more reputable vendor and the damn distributor (with tracking number) is on the way...
Exhausting stuff, dealing with such.
Well, I had ordered the Cardone distributor from what I thought to be a reputable bunch, in this case AutoZone.
My first time trying their online ordering - hey, 20% off and no core charge to boot.
Good deal from a huge, known vendor, right?
Well, not so much...
After waiting patiently over a week, I contacted them and was told that it hadn't actually shipped directly from Cardone to me, but instead had been received by AutoZone and they'd be forwarding it on promptly.
Again, not so much as it turned out.
It seems the customer service reps at the ZONE routinely lie to customers.
Yeah, I said it. LIE.
When it didn't arrive some days later, another call resulted in a promise to act immediately, that they'd contact me via phone the first thing next morning.
Another lie.
When I contacted them the third time that evening, a rep told me none of the previous arrangements/promises were even on file in their computer system. They promised to "make it right" pronto, too, including something "for my trouble".
Lie #3....sense a pattern here?
It's a stupid distributor, AZ. You show it as immediately available on your site. My invoice said it would directly ship to me from the manufacturer (bullsh..), not from you as your website indicated - but then, that never happened, either.
FINALLY...
Last Saturday (!) I get a call from them and am informed that CARDONE HAS NONE and they also are not offering any timeline to produce more.
In other words, AutoZone sold me a distributor that THEY DIDN'T HAVE and CARDONE DOESN'T MAKE ANYMORE, then lied to me for weeks about the whole thing.
Idiots. Deceitful idiots at that.
Refunded, I turned to a more reputable vendor and the damn distributor (with tracking number) is on the way...
Exhausting stuff, dealing with such.
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Update, Part Deux:
New distributor installed quite easily and she fired right up no sweat.
New Accel cap and rotor also installed just fine.
Result?
No change.
I've second-guessed myself so much at this point that I actually thought perhaps the spark plug wires were all in the cap one spot off, so I checked that too - then it occurred to me that thing wouldn't be running as well as it is if things were a whole cylinder off on timing.
Duh me. Grasping at straws...
Current timing is set at TDC (again), at least as indicated on the marks. I set it by ear for max smoothness @ 3000rpm.
If I hook up the vacuum advance, she gets all jittery at part-throttle, acting like it's too much advance.
I guess I can rule out distributor as a cause, at least.
Sigh.
New distributor installed quite easily and she fired right up no sweat.
New Accel cap and rotor also installed just fine.
Result?
No change.
I've second-guessed myself so much at this point that I actually thought perhaps the spark plug wires were all in the cap one spot off, so I checked that too - then it occurred to me that thing wouldn't be running as well as it is if things were a whole cylinder off on timing.
Duh me. Grasping at straws...
Current timing is set at TDC (again), at least as indicated on the marks. I set it by ear for max smoothness @ 3000rpm.
If I hook up the vacuum advance, she gets all jittery at part-throttle, acting like it's too much advance.
I guess I can rule out distributor as a cause, at least.
Sigh.
SlinktRR
Well-Known Member
That sounds like maybe ecu? Some boxes do not like vacuum advance at all, rev n nator being one...and that is what happens. Jittery at cruise with vac line hooked up. Mopar chrome box is a good unit and it plays well with vac advance. Are you sure your timing marks are correct I'd check tdc with a piston stop.
When buying parts stick to summit-jegs-Mancini, rinse and repeat.
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I think I've eliminated ECU by trying three different ones - two Mopar orange ones, one new, one used, and now a "store bought" stock non-performance new one as well.
Same results w/very minor differences.
Yep, next step is to pull all the plugs, fashion up a piston stop and find true TDC - but again, she idles so nicely and revs over 5k out of gear that I gotta think at least initial timing is in the ballpark, regardless of what is indicated on the balancer?
- - - Updated - - -
Question for everyone, though:
If the harmonic balancer is shot, what are the symptoms?
Vibration at certain RPM I would imagine (which I do have), but what else? Would the engine behave as I've described?
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