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Ethanol blended fuel info.

What about regular sta-bil that's what I put in my tank when storing for winter.
 
Ethanol just pisses me off, you pay for it with your taxes (subsidized), you pay for it at the pump, you pay for it at the grociery store (almost all food comes from corn in some way), it's not as efficient, ruins your old fuel systems and on top of all that it isn't any cleaner by the time you figure in all of the farming and refining .
 
Well, I see this thread ended up in the political forum.....
 
Cranky said:
Well, I see this thread ended up in the political forum.....
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Haha, I think so...I have no idea about the taxation, social and economic issues with Ethanol, but from a technical point of view it's an excellent fuel...cooler engine, more power and cleaner exhausts...the bigger the Ethanol mix, the better in my opinion!
 
Normally id stay out of this kind of conversation and im leaving anything political by the wayside. But E10 is HELL on EFI systems. It gums those up like no tomarrow and it will destroy the rubber seals around the fuel injectors, it shreds apart head gaskets, burns hotter in the combustion chamber and can damage aluminum heads and blocks, drags fuel milage down, and if you have paper or coro gaskets, it strips the gasket out quick. If your engine is BUILT for it, special pumps and metal gaskets, running near ice cold. Its great to use full ethanol. But mixed E10 seperates, and parts sitting in it will corrode and rust out quick. It also evaporates off bad. And good luck on piston rings holding a seal too. This stuff is bad.
 
Yes. It vaporizes under extended idle heat soak conditions. Less btu's, less mileage.
 
SwedCharger67 said:
Haha, I think so...I have no idea about the taxation, social and economic issues with Ethanol, but from a technical point of view it's an excellent fuel...cooler engine, more power and cleaner exhausts...the bigger the Ethanol mix, the better in my opinion!
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Now here is a good example of someone that doesn't know what they are talking about.
 
I have had the same fuel pump on my RR since 1989. We have E10 now everywhere. I like it because car will tolerate more spark advance with E10. I did have to jet up some but other than that no big deal in lawnmower or cars.
 
SwedCharger67 said:
So tell me what's wrong and why it's wrong in my statement. I really look forward to that.
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Ethanol is alcohol and will attract/ absorb water into gas resulting in phase separation of fuel. Ethanol reduces self life of gas to about three months. Long term, ethanol will deteriorate components made of rubber, aluminum, etc. That means fuel lines and carburetors. I drive a 2003 BMW M5 to work everyday and it's surprising how my MPG goes down when I use ethanol fuel. While I don't see much of a difference in performance the MPG does go down. Of top of the bad effects of ethanol it takes a lot of water to grow corn. With the water supply shrinking in the mid-west it really doesn't make sense for the long term. I have to mention that we are paying much more in food prices since we started burning corn in our gas tanks. On top of it all ethanol is subsidized by the government which means taxpayers are paying for it twice. The only reason we have ethanol in the U.S. is because corn companies like archer daniels midland have gotten smart and started giving money to both dems and republicans. More could be written but the bacon is ready
Ethanol does nothing good for the environment.
 
ga66mopar said:
Ethanol is alcohol and will attract/ absorb water into gas resulting in phase separation of fuel. Ethanol reduces self life of gas to about three months. Long term, ethanol will deteriorate components made of rubber, aluminum, etc. That means fuel lines and carburetors. I drive a 2003 BMW M5 to work everyday and it's surprising how my MPG goes down when I use ethanol fuel. While I don't see much of a difference in performance the MPG does go down. Of top of the bad effects of ethanol it takes a lot of water to grow corn. With the water supply shrinking in the mid-west it really doesn't make sense for the long term. I have to mention that we are paying much more in food prices since we started burning corn in our gas tanks. On top of it all ethanol is subsidized by the government which means taxpayers are paying for it twice. The only reason we have ethanol in the U.S. is because corn companies like archer daniels midland have gotten smart and started giving money to both dems and republicans. More could be written but the bacon is ready
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So you are just broadly echoing incorrect rumors.

There is one rubber type that doesn't fit well with E85, that's natural rubber. Where is natural rubber used nowadays? All other other rubber types work well with E85.

Aluminium is slightly affected by E85, but the impact is so small that aluminium can well be used with E85. I can supply you with details about the compatibility of E85 and hundreds of materials.

Of course the MPG goes down, E85 and pump gas have totally different air/fuel ratios. If your car is unable to adjust the engine to correct air/fuel settings, of course it won't run well.

In terms of power, again, if your engine management is unable to adjust to the correct settings, your power will be down. If your engine management can fully adjust to the ethanol contents, you will have more power than with pump gas. I can show you how to calculate it if you want.
 
SwedCharger67 said:
So you are just broadly echoing incorrect rumors.

There is one rubber type that doesn't fit well with E85, that's natural rubber. Where is natural rubber used nowadays? All other other rubber types work well with E85.

Aluminium is slightly affected by E85, but the impact is so small that aluminium can well be used with E85. I can supply you with details about the compatibility of E85 and hundreds of materials.

Of course the MPG goes down, E85 and pump gas have totally different air/fuel ratios. If your car is unable to adjust the engine to correct air/fuel settings, of course it won't run well.

In terms of power, again, if your engine management is unable to adjust to the correct settings, your power will be down. If your engine management can fully adjust to the ethanol contents, you will have more power than with pump gas. I can show you how to calculate it if you want.
Click to expand...

You just confirmed everything I stated. The engine management system on my 70 roadrunner is unable to adjust to corn based fuel. It is good to know that some politician has the money to get re-elected while guys that have classic cars have to figure out how to survive. Again ethanol does nothing good for the environment. It's just a big scam brought to us by our politicians. But I do respect other peoples opinions.
 
Take sythetic rubber, put in ethanol, let dry out. Its now a powder. An engine built for E85 will run E85 more efficently than one not built for E85, just as a jet engine burns jet fuel more efficiently. Paper or cork gaskets will not survive longer than a few years with it. And it causes pitting in aluminum and that causes hotspots. In the southern states where the temp is over 90+ regularly, it can vaporise without even running. Its like how unleaded fuel will -work- in older engines, but goodbye to any reliability. Even the new flex fuel vehicals get 5-10 mpg less, and even less HP than regular gas. The manuals also tell you NOT to use it alot or it can void warrentys.
 
snakeoil24 said:
Actully Cranky it did not end up in political forum it should be in the common sense forum!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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It did get moved and I asked Joey about if my first post had political content or was it the replies that got it moved. I guess he reviewed it and moved it back out.

And this isn't directed to anyone in general....but my take on the ethanol is that it doesn't last very long and I have to treat all of my fuel for my small engines or empty the tanks. Emptying all of them is a pita. Stuff like my chain saw is easy but having to do that is still a pita. Ethanol degrades very fast and the refiners are not doing much of anything to add in additives to keep that from happening. Alcohol based fuels IS corrosive to metals and is one of the main reasons auto manufacturers went to plastic fuel tanks. How many steel gas cans do you see on the markets these days?

Both methanol and ethanol are chemically characterized as weak acids - keep this in mind. The chemical descriptions of each are: methanol- CH3OH; ethanol- CH3CH2OH. Methanol is synthesized from the methane present in natural gas while ethanol is distilled from fermenting vegetable starches such as corn, barley and wheat. Both alcohols are readily miscible with water - not only do they mix with water they actually attract it....which is not really a good thing for fuel systems.

Methanol is corrosive to aluminum, magnesium and zinc, and the presence of brass serves as a catalyst which speeds up the process. Ethanol is most corrosive to ferrous metals - those metals which contain iron, such as steel. This corrosion leaves behind salt deposits and a jelly like substance, both of which can clog filter screens and fuel filters.

Gasoline will varnish up all by itself over a period of time and now add in this other junk with it to make it even better....yeah, that was sarcasm :D And it's been mentioned before how much it costs to produce while pushing up the cost of everything else that uses corn products and that's a lot of products. Studies have proven that it actually uses more energy to produce and refine...ie, we're using more than a gallon of fuel to produce one gallon of ethanol fuel. And once the the subsidies stop, prices at the pump are going to go through the fuel roof.
 
E85 is nice for high cylinder pressures. The shop I help out at has a 461rwhp 2011 Turbo Hayabusa that runs on it. Zero detonation and that is with 11:1 dish pistons and 26psi boost. The 93 octane tune was only able to hit 8psi before detonation.

I was thinking of running a 14+ :1 440 based engine jetted for E85 in the future.
 
bangshift440rt said:
E85 is nice for high cylinder pressures. The shop I help out at has a 461rwhp 2011 Turbo Hayabusa that runs on it. Zero detonation and that is with 11:1 dish pistons and 26psi boost. The 93 octane tune was only able to hit 8psi before detonation.

I was thinking of running a 14+ :1 440 based engine jetted for E85 in the future.
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Why not run straight alcohol? Do some research on it and you might find it to be a better alternative....
 
Lots of classic car folks using aviation fuel more and more. 100 octane and completely free of any additives. Costs about the same as race fuel...around here (S.E. Michigan) anyway.
 
and that's why I run alcohol free gas in my Barracuda's, Harleys, and other small engines.
 
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