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Got the engine full disassembled

That 451 stroker will make a lot of power in a low deck package. You can build a good performing pump gas motor with a small roller cam and some head work. The only advantage the 915 have over the 906 head is the smaller combustion chamber, ports are the same. The heads are going to have to be worked which ever you choose. Your builder may suggest using 2.14In & 1.81ex valves as well as some pocket porting. Have him give you a completed cost estimate for the 451 before you move forward. The heads will be the HP limiting factor in your build I believe. But with the additional CID you will not have to spin the mill over 6500 rpm so it should last a good long time. You might want to speak with the guys at Muscle motors on Michigan; they have been building the 451 combos for many years with great results. It would also be a goods cost compare metric for you. Good luck, let us know which engine you build. And like Runner said, you can have some fun by labeling the mill as a 383.
 
Talked to the builder again today and he wrote me up a build sheet using the 400/451 and the 915 heads. Quoted me around 3 grand for the whole set up. I didn't relize how expensive building an engine is. I might be waiting for a while longer but I'm also thinking I'm going to pull the trigger on getting the Stealth heads from 440source. Both builders I talked to said the heads are what is going to hold me back. Since I'm not looking for originality or racing in any brackets that require stock components I more than likely don't need either sets of heads I have (915s or 452s) so I'm going to throw those up for sale so I can get some money for my build. Also I found out that if I get Utah vintage plates for the car safety and emissions are not required.
 
I have seen the 440 source heads and they will work great on a 451. Spring for the CNC ported units if you can. Another plus is you can run higher compression to make more power. Finish it all off with a single plane intake and good internals you be all set. Cam selection is what will make your combo. Let us know your dyno numbers. Good luck.
 
Don't be too quick to toss the little B engine to the way side. I'll say it again and it worked for me very well. 3700 lb 68 RR with a 383 on circa 1989-ish pump 92, stock converter, P/S, 4.88 dana, 8" slicks = 12.65 @ 108. Same set up except 3.55's = 13.20's. Earlier on I ran a different 383 with cast pistons with a .465" / 280 Isky mega cam in the same car (except with 4 spd) and it was a reliable 13.50 - 13.60 @ 105 MPH car on street tires with no traction what so ever. Not a damn thing wrong with a 383. Not to say the other suggestions mentioned are bad - not at all. That 12 sec 1/4 mile day was great when the 440 E body guys realized they were looking at a 383 in a B body running 1/2 second quicker than they were.

The only reason I prefer the 915's is because of the quench chamber and I got hooked on those long before the advent of quench dome pistons and inexpensive aluminum heads, which are also closed chamber by the way. 915's also have a good port for that size displacement and the quench will help reduce detonation on the big bore while keeping the compression at a decent level when a slightly bigger cam is used. However, these days it may not make sense to rebuild a set of iron heads with $1000.00 aluminum units piled up and ready to ship.

Yes, you can add up a hefty bill building an engine but if you stick to the basics you can keep it under control. No matter what you will need to machine a block, heads and crank, etc... and don't get sucked into a bunch of whiz-bang fancy talk and special gadgets. All you need is good basic machine work to factory tolerances. Stroker motors are great (and I like the 451 concept) but it can be costly because of special pistons, crank mods, the required high flow heads to feed that thing at high RPM's, clearance the block for the rod bolts (for longer stroke), yadda-yadda. What I like about the 383 is you darn near can't blow it up even with quality cast pistons. The short stroke makes for lower piston speed, which is a big stress reliever and I think physics saved my butt more than a few times when I saw my tach bounce off the 8K mark on occasional missed shifts. Ever heard a 383 sound like a chain saw?? I have!

Hot rodding rules:
Rule # 1. There is always somebody faster.
Rule # 1. How fast you want to go = how much money you got. And yes, the only substitute for cubic inches is more cubic inches.
Rule # 1. Learn to drive your car! You can do a lot if you know how the car reacts in what gear at what speed. This rule reminds me of when I put my semi stock 68 4 spd Mustang 302 in 1st gear at 50 MPH to pull a fender on a hopped up El Camino. All I needed was that initial jump and he couldn't catch me.
 
Well I decided to go with the 383 mainly because the cost difference was fairly substantial for a 26 year old. Plus I agree with Runner I want to tell those that fall behind me that it is just a 383. I don't have the build sheet right next to me but going from memory here is the plan. They are going to bore it out .020" and use KB hypereuetic pistons. The cam choice is kind of in the air so I'll ask you guys is 241/247 degrees duration at .050 inches, with .545/.545-inch lift on a 110-degree lobe separation way too big. I don't know much about this stuff so I'm not sure how it will run. Also I'll be getting a set of the Stealth heads as well. Also what carb size or type should I use. Thanks so much for all help and suggestions thus far. Once I actually get the engine in, which will be a while because I plan on totally restoring the engine bay while it out, I'll post a vid on you tube so you can hear it.
 
Big cams require a lot of compression to work properly. You better plan on an honest 10:1 or better and make sure the pistons are at zero deck to about -.005" in the hole. The KB's that I have for my 440 build have really big valve relief cutouts and those eat up compression. You may want to go with some dead flat TRW forged units and cut just enough valve relief necessary (I just needed one for the intake with a .528" cam). A single plane intake like a Torker and a 750-780 Holley (3310) would be my starting point. 700 DP would work well too.
 
Yeah I was afraid of that. I think we might be reducing the lift a little so we don't run into any added cost. I already have an edelbrock dual plane intake that I'll be using. It came with the motor. Do you know of any good places to buy a rebuilding kit? My builder quoted me $1,055 for the kit he can get which includes all the bearings, pistons, rings, gaskets, freeze plugs, cam/lifters, and a true roller timing set.
 
Yeah, I like Summit. Seems the stuff is on my doorstep 5 mins after I hit the order button! Prices seem OK too.

Forget about valve lift but rather focus on the point of intake valve closing. It's this event that must coincide with the compression ratio. The later the valve closes the more cylinder pressure is reduced and must be made up my high compression pistons.

Do you have the STD Performer? If so then I don't think they respond well to big cams tuned for upper mid range torque.
 
Yeah I have the standard performer I believe. All that is stamped on it is Edelbrock Performer 383. Choosing a cam is hard. What would be my best choice so I don't bog down so much and my stall isn't crazy high. I do love the sound a nasty cam gives but if I can't do it with a nice running engine I guess I'll sacrifice. The smallest cam in the Comp cam high energy extreme lift grinds is .525" is that still to big for me? Sorry about all the questions but I'm completely dumb when it comes to this stuff but if any of you hvae any questions about F-16s I can answer them. LOL.
 
Ok I just read an article on another site about choosing a cam so it looks like I need a hell of a lot more information to choose wisely. I'll probably call Comp cams when I get all the info needed. Is there a way to find out what my gearing is with out tearing the rear diff out? I don't have a build sheet and I'm not sure if it needs rebuilt any way but if it does I guess I can put what ever gears I want in it.
 
Your builder should be the guy that helps with cam selection. Most of these guys have a contact at Isky or ComP or one of the other cam suppliers. Plus your builder has built more engines than most of us on the forum. You have to make the choice if you trust the guy or not, to many people have various ideas on what works. Best thing, is the do the research and quiz your builder. Good luck
 
I know what you mean but I already have trust issues with people touching my car unless I see their shop full of Mopars. I have had my car to three different places: a frame shop, alignment shop, and an old vet that has a "I'll fix what ever you have shop". And the only one that hasn't done something to either piss me off or break things on the Runner is the Vet. My builder suggested I go two steps below the .545" lift comp cam xtreme hi-lift which would put me at the .507/.510 xtreme energy cam. I guess that sounds about right I just really don't want to be let down anymore by shops and want to be for sure I'm doing the right thing.
 
You will have to work around available gas, compression, gearing, and stall if you have an auto. If you will run the standard Performer then you are working around the intake RPM range of 1500 - 5000 or so. You might consider one of the Edelbrock cams or something else that falls in that RPM range or a factory Magnum cam. If you go with a single plane intake like a Torker and minimum 10:1 CR then go with a Hemi grind or similar 108-110 LC cam that has a power band in the 2000 - 6000 RPM. The Magnum cam requires 9.5 - 10:1 compression.

To check ratio you can jack up the car and count how many turns the drive shaft makes for one revolution of the wheels. If you don't have a sure grip then you need to rotate both wheels at the same time.
 
Ok I talked to my builder he suggested the Comp 21-227-4 grind which has a lift of .525 but 275/287 duration. We'll have a CR of 10.1:1 using the KB400 pistons. I ordered my kit from PAW they seem like really nice guys to deal with and were a lot cheaper than buying through my builder. I'm getting pretty excited even though it will still be a long time before the engine actually goes in. I still have to rebuild the steering gearbox, replace the radiator and pretty much every wire in the bay, plus paint it. Next summer will be funny because my underhood will look great but everything else will look like crap. Now that's a sleeper.
 
I think that cam would be much happier with a single plane intake and a 700-750 CFM Holley. No taller than 3.55 or better yet, 3.91 or 4.10 gears.
 
Meep would I still have good low end torque with the single plane? Why Holley? Are they better than Edelbrock or Demons? Would it be better to get a double pumper type carb as well or does it even matter?
 
I say Holley because that's what I had the most experience with and they always worked well for me. A 700 AFB (Edelbrock) or Demon (isn't that a modified Holley?) should do well too. No matter what you need to tune the carb around what your idle vacuum will be and over all combo.

Low end torque with an aggressive cam comes in the form of low gears. The only way to cover good performance in a wide RPM range is to run something like a Magnum cam with 115 deg LC. The shorter 108 LC cams will have the classic lumpy idle and typically make more power than the wide RPM range cams but at a specific RPM range and usually higher up the scale. Kind of like a two stroke when it gets on the pipe.

Back in the 80's I ran my 383 with a .465" / 280 (224 @ .050") Isky Megacam and it was a solid 13.60 car on street tires. I also ran a 4 spd back then. Drive to the track; run 13's @ 105 MPH; drive home - over and over again. I could have used more gear (had 3.55's) but somehow never happened. That was a fun combo and very driveable. I would incinerate the tires from a 15 MPH roll by just mashing the pedal and continue through second. Yeah, I used to do that a lot!!
 
A single plane with a holley 750 and 3:91s would work great with the rest of your combo. We used to use the 3310 vacuum 780cfm a long time ago on top of a Torker intake with good results. I do not know if Holley still makes that carb but there 750 will be fine.
 
Dan, would the holley 750 double pumper pn# 4779-9 be a good choice? I found one for $175 is really good shape not sure if the price is fair or not.
 
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