Hawk-Rod: The Restoration

[Ron 73]

LOL, that can work both for and against you! I like the blame my addition of A/C on my wife, but I have to be honest and state that I wanted it for the drive across country. Could I survive for hours in the car, day after day, without A/C? Sure, but do I want to? Nah...

Hawk, I totally agree with you and my wife is worse then i am with the heat but yes sir, it gets to me too.. The 73 didn't come with it or it may be eaiser to get put in but with all the work and more, the money going into it i just hate taking money from one to do the other, maybe next summer ill give it a shot it would be a welcome relief from and i do blame the majority of the heat on the headers... There is other things i need to get done on it like my K-frame bushings ive had for close to a decade, i have those but ive never replaced them, i have new front shocks to get in to but i keep heading into the 69 when im not doing other things, i guess maybe im neglecting some needed stuff, i REALLY need the new bushings.. And im certain it wont take to many miles before you are very happy with the AC!!!

 

[HawkRod]

Hawk, I totally agree with you and my wife is worse then i am with the heat but yes sir, it gets to me too.. The 73 didn't come with it or it may be eaiser to get put in but with all the work and more, the money going into it i just hate taking money from one to do the other, maybe next summer ill give it a shot it would be a welcome relief from and i do blame the majority of the heat on the headers... There is other things i need to get done on it like my K-frame bushings ive had for close to a decade, i have those but ive never replaced them, i have new front shocks to get in to but i keep heading into the 69 when im not doing other things, i guess maybe im neglecting some needed stuff, i REALLY need the new bushings.. And im certain it wont take to many miles before you are very happy with the AC!!!

I had to replace the same bushings on my 73 - if I recall, not too bad if you do one at a time. Of course, the big question is if your bolts come loose. As long as they do, you should be in good shape.

I have been extremely busy, so sorry for the limited posts - a few are coming. I have been doing some tuning of the computer, and with the help of my father-in-law, the car timing and performance seems to work really nicely. The car is smooth and comfortable, with no shakes, rattles or vibrations EXCEPT for some noise from the rear end. My father-in-law is all but certain it is not the rear, so I will be looking at bearings tonight. I STILL don't have the interior in, although once I get some parts from my door panel trim I should be ready to install it.

Soon I'll move to trip planning, but that will come late and on another thread. For now, the last couple of weeks thrash to get the car done will continue. :tongue3:

 

[tallhair]

I just caught up on your thread Hawk and always a great read. I'm hoping you are able to ride the last few miles or so on this build to victory w/o any major headaches

I'll be following along

 

[HawkRod]

I just caught up on your thread Hawk and always a great read. I'm hoping you are able to ride the last few miles or so on this build to victory w/o any major headaches

I'll be following along

Thanks. I have been a bit slow on updates because I have been working to finish stuff. Many tasks involve just fixing or messing with stuff to get the car "sorted", so pictures aren't really applicable. I also have been a bit lax on taking pictures as I have gotten to the last "mad rush". Here are a few though:

After I had the front wheels aligned, I installed the splash shields. Here I what they look like:








I now have the interior fully installed. I elected to reuse my existing door and panel trim. My car had fake wood grain on them, but to the best of my knowledge it is not correct for the car. However, I replicated that so I could further hide the seat belts in the rear of the car. The wood grain I received was not the ideal color, but I am out of time so I installed it. I am not in love with it but it will have to do for now. I think a later modification will be to put polished ones in the car. I think they will look better.

I just a couple of pictures of the interior. Not great pictures to be sure as they are a bit blurry, but hopefully you get the idea. Note the seat belts coming through the trim in the back seat picture.




The car is essentially done, although I still have some small tweaks to ensure everything functions well. For example, my A/C belt is squealing, so I need to align the compressor better and tighten the belt back up. I think with the belt setup and hidden location, this A/C compressor could be problematic. I think the belt and pulleys need to be set up perfectly for this to work well.

Back to the garage to finish final details!

Hawk

 

[NZ 70 RR]

The interior looks fantastic, an always envious of cars with a pistol grip, love my pool ball, but . Floor mats look great, have got the same ones. A friend had them in his challenger but he was happy to part with them for a good cause.
Your trip is getting close now, must be excited and a touch nervous. You will have so much fun.

 

[HawkRod]

So I have been neglecting my restoration thread - I guess I will have to call the car "done" since I am leaving for California with it tomorrow! :grin: If you want to follow along with the trip, check out this thread:
http://www.forbbodiesonly.com/mopar...7639-Hawk-s-Cross-Country-70-Road-Runner-Trip

I had a last minute issue with the clutch that was resolved. If you are interested, read about that here:
http://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/showthread.php?97959-Need-Help-with-Clutch-Linkage-Chatter

Of course, these cars are never "done", but the primary restoration is complete. Since I ran low on time, there were several things that I didn't quite do up to my standards at the end, but they will do for the trip. These can get cleaned up as projects over the winter.

I plan to finish this thread with an evaluation of the car, what things I really liked vs. which I didn't. I will evaluate each "upgrade" or change, but that is probably best to do once I have a couple of weeks of driving on the car. However, I may not get to it until I get back. Until then, stay tuned!

Hawk

 

[GetX'd]

May the force be with you! Stay safe and be good...... Nah just stay safe.....

 

[HawkRod]

I plan to finish this thread with an evaluation of the car, what things I really liked vs. which I didn't. I will evaluate each "upgrade" or change, but that is probably best to do once I have a couple of weeks of driving on the car. However, I may not get to it until I get back. Until then, stay tuned!

Hawk

OK, as promised, let me do an evaluation of many of the things I did to my car. I drove 5,800 miles on my trip. We drove in very hot weather, and on mornings where the temperature was just below freezing. We had the car up to 107 MPH (according to GPS, not my speedo). We had up to 4 passengers in the car and the trunk STUFFED full of things. For those of you that followed along on my trip thread, you know we didn't baby the car!

This will likely take several posts, but here it goes:

Fuel Injection System
For this part I am going to include all parts of my Fuel Injection system. I installed a FAST EZ EFI 2.0 system in my car, but I did not follow their standard installation instructions that suggest drilling a 3" hole in the firewall. I wanted to hide my system as much as possible so I did a lot of custom routing and wiring.
I will rate the overall FI system as an A-, but I will rate FAST tech support as a D-. I have a whole separate thread on why I was unhappy with their tech support. I won't repeat that here, but here is a thread on that if you care to check it out: http://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/showthread.php?96089-I-ve-Had-It-With-FAST-EZ-EFI

Note that I also bought the FAST distributor, so I also had the computer controlled timing. There IS some setup with the FAST system, and you can easily set it up so your car runs like crap. So this is not a direct bolt on and do nothing type of install. However, once I got my ECU issue resolved and got it tuned (especially timing), it worked like a champ. Overall, it was trouble free the whole trip and never lost power or had issues with lower octane gas or high altitudes. I did need to enhance my timing settings when we reached higher altitudes, but that is not a FAST issue but a tuning one. I believe the revised tuning parameters will make my car run better back East too.

My gas tank was custom made by Hot Rod City. I will rate the gas tank as a C and their tech support as a B+. My filler neck is welded in a little bit crooked. Nothing unusable but it still bugs me. I also had a fuel pressure issue. It turned out that they used regular band clamps with the high pressure hose inside the tank. This started leaking at pressures above 29 PSI, and it was a bitch to figure out what was going on. They should have used high pressure FI clamps. Furthermore, while I was fixing that I found a lot of aluminum shavings in the tank. Yes, the filter will take care of that but why not wash the tank out carefully after cutting all the holes and grinding? On the good side, the tank fit really well and I had no issues mounting it. It also holds an extra gallon which I like.
When I called their tech support they were very friendly and helpful. They provided part numbers to me so I had a listing for spares if I needed it.
Finally, I found out during the trip that my tank was blowing a lot of fuel out of the vent. This is not a problem with the tank but more so with how I designed my vent line - so back to the drawing board with that...

Finally, I will rate my own installation of the FI system as a A-. I think the things I did to hide it turned out very well. The down side is I mounted my MSD box above my glove box. That seemed like a good idea at the time, but once I got the dash and Classic Air system installed I could not remove the glove box. This means getting to the MSD box is all but impossible without extensive parts removal. I think placement of the ECU and all other parts have worked out well.

Classic Air and Bouchillon A/C bracket
I bought the Classic Air Perfect Fit A/C system for my car. I also bought a Bouchillon A/C bracket to mount the compressor down low so it could be mostly hidden. I will rate the Classic Air System as an A and their tech support as an A+. The system has worked without any issues whatsoever. The air has been cold when I wanted it cold, and my defroster quickly blew hot, dry air when it was freezing and my windows were frosted up. The only reason I won't rate the system as an A+ is because I think the under dash vents are a little bit small and also a bit cheesy. They just don't seem all that durable, although I have had no issue with them. Distribution was also a bit of a problem if you had passengers in the back seat. This really isn't Classic Air's problem - it is more of an issue by having the vents located under the dash. When we had 4 people and it was hot, the front seat people got cold and the rear passengers were still hot.
The Classic Air tech support was awesome. Since I wanted to hide my installation as much as possible, I called and worked with a tech over the phone to custom design my hose routing and placement of components. The tech was knowledgeable and spent a lot of time on the phone with me so I could get my system designed the way I wanted. I never felt rushed, and he truly was "thinking out of the box" to help me get a set of parts that worked well for what I wanted. Great experience with tech support!

I will rate the Bouchillon A/C bracket as a B- and their tech support as N/A (didn't call tech support). I love the hidden bracket, especially since my car is an Air Grabber car. However, getting it to work without squealing is a PITA. First of all, the A/C pulley must be PERFECTLY aligned. And then, it took three tries to get the new belt tight so it didn't slip and squeal. Each time you adjust the A/C compressor the alternator must be fully removed. Adjusting the A/C compressor requires loosening three nut and bolt combinations. You cannot reach these without removal of the alternator.
However, after the third tightening (which we did at Paul's house near Chicago), the belt worked trouble free with no more squealing. I would still buy this again since it looks so nice to hide the A/C, but just expect to have to play with it awhile to get it right.

 

[HawkRod]

Let's keep going...

O/D Transmission
I stored my original numbers matching A-833 transmission and was waiting for the Passon A-855. I could not get one in time so Jamie built me a A-833 overdrive. Essentially, what this does is reverse 3rd and 4th gears. The new 3rd gear (old 4th) remains 1:1 and new 4th gear (old 3rd) becomes the overdrive. In my case it was .73.
I'll rate the transmission a B and tech support as an A+. One the good side, the OD tranny is fantastic for long trips. It made the car very comfortable on the highway, even approaching speeds of 100 MPH. This would be uncomfortable with a 3.55 rear for any length of time without overdrive. The down side to this type of arrangement is that you have much greater spacing between the first three gears, so acceleration is not as good. I also found it was hard to find that ideal gear if going between 45 and 60 MPH, which happens often around twisty roads.
I lost the 3rd gear synchronizer fairly early in the trip. Of course, this was not a good thing as it forced us to double clutch the tranny. However, Jamie's customer service was impressive. No BS, no excuses, no blame. He immediately offered to build another tranny and send it out to wherever we wanted it. In discussions with him, we decided against that because it would cause a lot of unnecessary cost and hassle to both of us, so we agreed to fix it when I got home. Also, prior to the trip Jamie helped me get some of the parts I needed to fix my clutch rod issue. From a customer support perspective, this was great.

So bottom line for the tranny: I like it, but I would prefer a 5 speed. I will remain on Jamie's list for a A-855 but use the 4 speed OD in the mean time.

I should add some clutch details here too. I had clutch issues as I drove across country. Two of those were self inflicted. Jamie told me to change my pilot bushing, but mine seemed good and I was short on time so I didn't. My pilot bushing lasted 3,500 miles before it started chattering. Lesson learned.
The other issue was the adjustment of the clutch fork. Initially I was sloppy in my adjustment of the fork rod. As a quick measure to address it, I backed it off too much. Once it was set right the issue largely went away, but then it returned later. It seems my fork rod nut was not holding its position. I will either replace it or put a jam nut to hold it in place.
Finally, my clutch pedal needed some "toe up" for the pedal to come back up. One of the few pieces I did not completely tear apart was my gorilla spring and clutch pedal. That was a bad choice, as just a little bit of resistance made a difference. That will come apart too when the car comes home - that is a another self inflicted issue.

So in general, of all my transmission issues the 3rd gear synchronizer issue was not my fault. I think I likely caused all the other issues. Lesson learned - DO IT RIGHT!!!!

 

[HawkRod]

Suspension and Steering

I changed my manual steering to power steering, but I installed a Firm Feel stage II power steering box. I will rate the Firm Feel stage II box as an A, their tech support as N/A (didn't use tech support). The steering felt great. Gone was the overpowered, dead feeling Chrysler power steering. The steering in my car is precise, controlled and predictable. I really like my steering in the car, and I had no issues in tight parking lots either. Note that I also added a sector support kit for my car and PST tubular upper control arms so I have more caster. Beyond that, the steering is stock. The only time I ever felt a bit uncomfortable with my steering was when we were in Kansas with strong cross winds and we were driving 100 MPH. Here the car felt like it had just a small "dead spot" in the center which allowed the car to wander a bit with the strong, gusty winds. This was the only time that I wondered if I should have opted for the stage III box. I still can't say if I would prefer a stage III box, as I have never driven a stage III box in a parking lot. As I don't plan to drive 100MPH routinely in strong Kansas winds, I am very happy with the steering.

For my suspension, my car came with the Hemi suspension and I reused all the original suspension parts. I added PST greasable control arm pivot shafts. I also boxed my control arms. I guess I should also include here that I had Mark install the complete US Car Tool frame stiffening parts as well. This includes frame rail connectors, torque boxes, lower radiator support and fender support brackets. All bushings in my suspension are rubber except for the pivot shafts, upper control arms and my front sway bar. I should note that I have 15" rims with 60 series tires that have a fair amount of sidewall.
All the above suspension components gave the car a comfortable, quiet, yet capable ride. I always felt in control with the car, and it never shook, rattled or bothered me with the ride. After many hours in the car I could still walk and function! As a complete package, I will rate my suspension as an A. Overall, I feel like my suspension is a good compromise between comfort and cornering capability. No, it won't carve corners like a modern day Challenger, but it works very well and I wouldn't want to jar out my fillings in order to gain a bit more cornering capability.

 

[Derwud]

Great Info, thanks!!
Fast (Off my list)
Hot Rod City (Nope)
Classic A/C (Back on the list)
Bouchillon (They were off the list when they said there might be squealing when using the hidden compressor)
Passon (on the list for a conversion.. I want the 5 spd.)
Firm Feel, (Back on the list, stage 3 though)
Looking at QA1 for suspension stuff.

 

[HawkRod]

Cooling
My car was built with the 26" radiator. I had Glen-Ray radiator rebuild my original radiator. They re-cored it and restored it back to its original condition. It looked great, and functioned just as well. Throughout our whole trip, even with the A/C on in stop and go and in very hot weather, it never broke a sweat. My fan and fan shroud are original, although I did replace the fan clutch.
I'll rate the work Glen-Ray did as an A+, and their tech support as A+. The radiator looks absolutely perfect and backs those looks up with perfect operation. Can you ask for more? By the way, in a separate interaction with my 1973 Road Runner, their tech support was awesome - I was able to get a fan shroud for the difficult 73 A/C based Road Runner radiator for free. This is because he refused to charge me for a fan shroud that had a crack in it. I insisted I wanted it because I had nothing. So he boxed it up and sent it to me for free - didn't even charge me any shipping. How is that for customer support?

Body and Paint
This is a tough category as I hear so many horror stories. I was worried when I sent my car to Mark as I wasn't sure he would come through for me - he did. The body and paint look great. Mark even came up to my house for the installation of the glass since he wanted to make sure it was installed correctly, and he helped on several other occasions to install and line up fenders, hood as well as other parts after the car was all together and needed a couple of tweaks. He owns his work and stands by it. As with anything, no one wants to have issues - the key is what is done when an issue comes up. Mark was the first one to find and point out an issue on the driver side of my car - right where the quarter and roof come together. We discussed it and agreed that I would send my car back to him after my cross country road trip to fix any other issues that happened during the trip. So I will have him clean up some chips I got in my paint from the trip as well as the bubble that appeared. I will rate his bodywork and paint as an A and his tech support as an A+. I would use him again for another project - great guy.

Radio and Speakers
This may seem like a strange category to have, but on a long trip a good sound system gets to be important. My car originally had no radio, so I bought a 1970 AM radio and had it converted to an AM/FM Bluetooth radio by Retro Radio. I will rate the Radio as a B+ and their tech support as N/A, although to be fair, they seemed very customer oriented and insisted I call them if I had any questions or issues. Retro Radio did a really nice job converting the radio, and it looks brand new. I love that the radio looks totally stock. I rated it a B+ simply because with an AM radio it makes it a royal PITA to find any given FM station. You don't know where it is! So my gripe is not with Retro Radio, but more with my own choice of donor radios. In hindsight, I should have found an AM/FM radio and used that as a core. Since my car never had an antenna, I did not want to put a hole in my fender and add one. I added a hidden antenna but that only works with strong stations.
When using the Bluetooth, my sound system sounded great. For my dash, I used a 4x10 speaker that was a single 4x10 with two separate voice coils for stereo separation. It has some bass capabilities but also handles the high notes as well. For the rear I installed two 6" round speakers. These are the only part that you can see that does not look stock. I also added a subwoofer behind the back seat. These components give my stereo a great sound. It can go very load, yet remains pretty crisp and well defined. Overall I am very happy with this system.

- - - Updated - - -

Small Stuff
So I added a few other small things. I broke my arm patting myself on the back because I added a hidden 12v power port in the glove compartment. I'll rate that as a D. While it looks nice and was installed well, it is all but useless. This is because I neglected to think about the fact that most things that are powered from a power port have some huge honkin' piece that plugs in to the power port. Most are large enough that you can't use the power port and close the glove box door. I would have been better off installing extra power ports under the dash.
By the way, on a long trip, you WILL use them. I had a dash cam, GPS and power to a smart phone in use most of the time. Count it - that's THREE. So I am planning to add two more power ports under the dash so I can use the ash tray and the two under the dash in the future.
I also added a power port in the trunk. I didn't use it much, but I did charge a flashlight with it. I put that there mainly to power a thermoelectric cooler. I didn't use one for this trip, but I might in the future. So I still think a power port in the trunk isn't a bad idea...

I bought a short, small center console for the trip. The one I ordered is here:
http://www.cupholdersplus.com/product/bench-seat-console/BC-SHORTY.html
Cup holders are a necessity on long trips, and this worked well. I had to get a short one since I have a pistol grip shifter. Otherwise a longer one the full length of the seat bottom may have been better. The quality of this unit was nice and it served us well. I will rate this unit a B+.

Seat Belts: I put more modern 3 point belts for all four outboard passengers. I will rate my installation and the operation of my rear belts as an A+. They work really well and are comfortable to wear, even when I sat in the back seat (I am 6'0"). They look factory too.
For my front belts, I installed the retractors below my rear window so the retractors are hidden. I will rate the installation and operation of the front belts as a C. Overall, the hidden retractors look pretty good, although I think I could improve where they pass through the inner panel and trim. However, the main issue is with the comfort. I initially had 8" plastic extensions that hung down from the roof. However, these made the belts hard to pull out since the routing did not allow the belt to move back and forth. I removed those and just attached the belts with D rings at the roof. This made the belts easy to pull out but now they cut across my neck a bit. So the bottom line is that if I had simply mounted the retractors in the car, I would have gained some comfort but lost room and a "clean look". I will continue to work on these and see if I can improve their comfort.

Overall, I am super happy with my car - it turned out really well. I will continue to "tweak it" and try to further improve it.

Sorry about all the brain dumps above, but hopefully a few of you find this helpful in making your decisions with what to do with your car and who to use.

Hawk

 

[747mopar]

Sounds like your pretty happy and I can second the bluetooth stereo... Love mine! I've racked up allot of chips behind the rear tires and honestly think I'll chip guard them next time around...... I hate to but if your gonna drive them build them for it right.

That's one hell of a shake down test drive.......... Wow, I would have been over analyzing every little squeak and fretting the whole way. Way to go!

 

[HYRDGOON]

Great breakdown Hawk, Really helpful for anyone debating the same or similar upgrades. Has the car arrived back home yet? I saw it was picked up from CoronetDarter

 

[HawkRod]

Great breakdown Hawk, Really helpful for anyone debating the same or similar upgrades. Has the car arrived back home yet? I saw it was picked up from CoronetDarter

Should be any day tomorrow through Thursday. You think I could do without it after driving the darn thing for a month, but I miss it!!!

 

[440+6]

Awesome info Hawk, great follow up to the build and trip thread.

 

[Bigbehr21]

Hey Hawk, great wrap up! As someone who is in the beginning stages of a similar build, I appreciate the parts feedback. I had planned to use several of the parts/systems that you did, so in a few cases you have confirmed that I made good choices.

Once again, thanks,

Jim

 

[HawkRod]

Hey Hawk, great wrap up! As someone who is in the beginning stages of a similar build, I appreciate the parts feedback. I had planned to use several of the parts/systems that you did, so in a few cases you have confirmed that I made good choices.

Once again, thanks,

Jim

Glad it helped. After quite a bit of real world driving, I figured some of my experiences might help others out.

 

[conv67bdere]

Hope you don't mind me adding one more update ( please modify if I have it wrong )

FBBO Members
The members of FBBO across the entire nation were always there to lend a hand, assist with repairs, talk about cars, share a meal, and participate with the cross country trip.
I will rate the FBBO members as an A+ and their tech support as an A+.

 

[HawkRod]

Hope you don't mind me adding one more update ( please modify if I have it wrong )

FBBO Members
The members of FBBO across the entire nation were always there to lend a hand, assist with repairs, talk about cars, share a meal, and participate with the cross country trip.
I will rate the FBBO members as an A+ and their tech support as an A+.

You are 100% correct!!! :hello2: