Help/advice on my new engine build.

[Mike Gaines]

I am going to have a new motor built for my 65 Belvedere.
I want it to run in the B/Gas class here at my tracks in California.
That class is 8.60.
I checked with Wallace Racing Calculators and it looks like I will need 950HP at my 3100lb weight (with driver) to get to that ET.
I know I will for sure need a block with 4 bolt mains to handle that HP.
The ignition/carb/intake/headers are pretty straight forward but it is the following I am asking on input for:
1) Camshaft / Lifters / Pushrods / Springs
2) Rocker Arms / Shafts
3) Compression Ratio
4) Oiling System.
5) Rods
INDY has their 572 "Bracket Master" listed at 930HP for $22k
a) 572" 4 Bolt Iron Block
b) Aluminum Rods
c) 572-13 CNC 385 Heads
d) Jesel 1.7 Rockers
e) Roller Cam with 284/300 @.050 with .816/.765 lift with the 1.7 rockers.
f) 1150 Dominator with their tall intake.
Is this the route to take ?
Does INDY still supply iron 4 bolt blocks or do they only have aluminum 4 bolt blocks.
The Aluminum block is $3k extra.
Buy it from INDY or have someone else build it ?
Your thoughts....
I know I can get my tranny from A&A or Cope and my Converter from Lenny at Ultimate Converters.

 

[67belsat]

I am going to have a new motor built for my 65 Belvedere.
I want it to run in the B/Gas class here at my tracks in California.
That class is 8.60.
I checked with Wallace Racing Calculators and it looks like I will need 950HP at my 3100lb weight (with driver) to get to that ET.
I know I will for sure need a block with 4 bolt mains to handle that HP.
The ignition/carb/intake/headers are pretty straight forward but it is the following I am asking on input for:
1) Camshaft / Lifters / Pushrods / Springs
2) Rocker Arms / Shafts
3) Compression Ratio
4) Oiling System.
5) Rods
INDY has their 572 "Bracket Master" listed at 930HP for $22k
a) 572" 4 Bolt Iron Block
b) Aluminum Rods
c) 572-13 CNC 385 Heads
d) Jesel 1.7 Rockers
e) Roller Cam with 284/300 @.050 with .816/.765 lift with the 1.7 rockers.
f) 1150 Dominator with their tall intake.
Is this the route to take ?
Does INDY still supply iron 4 bolt blocks or do they only have aluminum 4 bolt blocks.
The Aluminum block is $3k extra.
Buy it from INDY or have someone else build it ?
Your thoughts....
I know I can get my tranny from A&A or Cope and my Converter from Lenny at Ultimate Converters.

View attachment 776144

 

[67belsat]

Mike a buddy runs a 604 B1 headed motor on alky and dynoed at 1008hp cant remember tq car has run best of 8.79 in a 66 belvedere with a glide car weighs under 3000# motor is all aluminum haven't got it totally tuned in yet.Not sure of all specifics of engine.Hope that gives you a little insight.He races at Norwalk ,Oh summit raceway

 

[Tex013]

My 2 cents , from watching and listening .
Have someone else build your motor .
Bulldog is only current iron block , i think from your goal you would be best off going aluminium block .
2 choices Indy or KB .
Beyond that comp will be 13-15:1 range .
Can you run a small ,100hp , shot of gas ?
Beyond that its above my paygrade
Oh i would also expect a high maintenance regime

Tex

 

[dvw]

8.60 index on Motor in this type of car is a tall order. You need to drop into the 8.50's and coerrect from there. No way is 950 at 3100 going to get you there. You will need at least 1050-1000 corrected before factoring in weather conditions. As the 950 is a corrected dyno number. There are very few 1000+hp BB Mopar's. The ones that are are high maintenance. 2700-2800 race ready weight with a good $30-$40K motor may get you close. KB block only. I doubt if Indy -1 or 572-13 heads will get you there. Good B-1, maybe? Predator, yup. The Hemi stuff may, but piston weight and standard valve train geometry can make it tough. Anything is going to take 8000 rpm+. There are a few cars around that are close Spencer Schreindl, Len Grinwald, Chris Baum.
Good Luck.
Doug

 

[Mike Gaines]

8.60 index on Motor in this type of car is a tall order. You need to drop into the 8.50's and coerrect from there. No way is 950 at 3100 going to get you there. You will need at least 1050-1000 corrected before factoring in weather conditions. As the 950 is a corrected dyno number. There are very few 1000+hp BB Mopar's. The ones that are are high maintenance. 2700-2800 race ready weight with a good $30-$40K motor may get you close. KB block only. I doubt if Indy -1 or 572-13 heads will get you there. Good B-1, maybe? Predator, yup. The Hemi stuff may, but piston weight and standard valve train geometry can make it tough. Anything is going to take 8000 rpm+. There are a few cars around that are close Spencer Schreindl, Len Grinwald, Chris Baum.
Good Luck.
Doug

Doug, Thanks
Maybe I should just give up on the 8.60 B/Gas class and go to the 9.60 C/Gas class. I think now that would be much easier to do in regards to parts, maintenance and money.

 

[dvw]

Doug, Thanks
Maybe I should just give up on the 8.60 B/Gas class and go to the 9.60 C/Gas class. I think now that would be much easier to do in regards to parts, maintenance and money.

9.60 is very reasonable. Much more maintenance friendly. A lot less money as well. Indy block or good aftermarket iron if you can find one, ported-1 Indy's, smooth profile roller. I'd run a Molnar crank and rods. Good shelf piston, Weisco, Diamond,etc. T&D rockers, Pac springs and retainers, T&D pushrod. 540 or a 572. I'd make it 13.5-14/1 and run it on E85. Single 4 Dominator, Indy intake. Your looking at oil change and valve lash type maintenance. Will easily run your number.
Doug

 

[biomedtechguy]

I'd run a Molnar crank and rods.

Every time I see "Molnar" crank, it seems to be used in the better builds.
Is Molnar one of or the best "strength" manufacturers of Mopar engine crankshafts?

 

[dvw]

Every time I see "Molnar" crank, it seems to be used in the better builds.
Is Molnar one of or the best "strength" manufacturers of Mopar engine crankshafts?

Just a good quality part for the price. It's no Callies $3k crank. But gets the job done at the 950 HP level.
Doug

 

[bwheeler051]

9.60 would be more attainable in a lower maintenance piece. I have been 9.490 at 139.99 with my 540 and at 3580lbs.
My combo is not exotic at all.
540
indy aluminum block
4.5 stroke crank
4.375 bore diamond shelf piston
13.5-14 to 1 comp
Indy 440-1 345 cnc heads
T&D rockers
683/683 roller with 284/288 duration easy on valvetrain parts
727 with an ATI 8 inch converter
dana with 4.10
weighs 3580
Indy modman and 2 edelbrock carburetors

At your weight you would have a good 9.60 car without a lot of maintenance and likely a better induction system.

 

[Endangered Species]

To add to Doug's comments Kevin Dundas 64 Plymouth and Harry Shillings cuda both from Canada are running mid to high 8's along with the list that Doug ran off.
Kevin and Harry are both running 604 all aluminum Hemi's.
950hp is not going to get it done.

Ask them how much they have in there Transmissions...

If you want a high maintenance, and inconsistency then go for it. Chris Baum was probably the most consistent out of the list, but he's dumped a tone of money into it to keep it going.

Either way... your car needs a HEMI! LOL

 

[oldkimmer]

Mike, the 470 stroker I bought for my duster race car came out of a 70/71 duster weighing 3300 with driver. It ran 10.1s with a dual tunnel ram. 9.85 with a 100 shot of nos. It ran the best of 9.03 but I think then it had a 300 shot(I could be wrong here). It dyno’d at 655 hp with Dominator on it. Motor is 11.25 compression, stage 6 Mopar heads, .625 lift comp cam. So 9.50s shouldn’t be too much of a problem. Kim