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Hemi build

T

Tunis

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Hi,

I need some advice on a Hemi build. First of all, it is going to be a 472 Hemi that is going into a 70 'Cuda 4 speed car with a shaker. I want something like 5-600 hp. This will mostly be a street driven car. My pocket is not that deep so please take that into consideration when recommending parts, nothing exotic...

Now to the engine questions:

Crank:
How is the quality of the Eagle cranks? I see them sell for around $700 for a 4.15" stroke whereas a Mopar crank goes for somewhere around $1500. Is the Mopar unit that much better? What crank do you guys recommend?

Heads:
Going for aluminum heads and 10.5:1 CR. Is the Mopar heads good enough and should I buy them bare and choose the springs, valves etc myself or is the assembled heads good enough for my build?

Intake:
I want to use either a 2x4 intake or preferably the Hemi six pack intake to go with my shaker. I have the six pack shaker base plate already, but I'm concerned about the height of the intake compared to the 440-6 under the shaker. What do you think about fitting a Hemi six pack under a factory six pack shaker setup?

That was it for now, cam selection, lifters etc will come at a later part.

Thanks for all and any input!

Per
 
I'm building almost the exact same engine for one of my cars. I chose the K1 crank and rods but the rods I will use are the 7.1" long to keep the R/S ratio as near to OEM as it can be. Tom Molnar at K1 said if my crank doesn't measure to spec I'll replace it free. So far so good! The rods are ready to go with ARP bolts and the machine work is spot on.

The cam I plan to run is a custom grind from Loffgren Automotive. It's ground on a 114 lobe separation, produces good vacuum and should make nearly 580 HP with the factory dual quad intake and carbs and even exhaust manifolds. Headers are worth 25 HP on the big end. I may stretch my legs a bit and run a rat roaster or something else but the basics will be good for whatever direction I will go. The heads I have are the MoPar aluminum and they are completely assembled and unported. I will check them out before running, especially the valve spring pressures.
 
K1 crank and rods, need 2.200 main pins if you want internal pickup, .990 pins are ok, StageV heads, StageV intake with carbs of choice. LSM is a good crank choice. If using stock rockers, the ratio's need to be measured BEFORE you buy a cam. I have a set of stock rockers and the ratio's are 1.4 ex, 1.5 intake. That was after getting them corrected. Unfortunately I already had a cam so I am stuck with the rockers unless someone needs them. Crane Mech roller lifters are good, get the 66550-16, they have pushrod oiling to keep from wearing out the cups and adjusters. Contact Chase Knight at crane and tell him Tim Popp sent you. A billet roller timing chain is a must, price them, they can run between 90-150 depending on where you get them. Dont get an 8 quart oil pan that sticks below the K-member, Milodon has a stock style pan for a hemi for around 220.00 with the pickup. M63HV oil pump is sufficient. If you dont already have a Hemi K-member, Al Debevec will modify yours for around 800 including all of the mounts. Google him for contact info. I guess that is enough for now. Tim
 
The Eagle crank is more than adequate for for what you're wanting to build and so are their 7.100 rods. The mopar crank isn't any better than an Eagle and for that money you could buy a Callies if you want top shelf. I won't use the K1 7.100 rod with a hemi piston because of the small beam size coupled with the heavy hemi pistons. The Eagle or RPM H-beam rods are a better choice IMO. You don't need the Stage V heads to make 600hp with a 472, the MP's will do it no problem. The valves that come in them are fine for most applications but the springs won't work with anything but a hydraulic flat tappet cam. Buy 'em complete and just get springs to work with whatever cam you choose. I run two fours on my street hemi but the Indy Mod Man w/6 pack top looks interesting as well. Don't rely on the internet hype to build a good combo, find someone who has the experience to tell you what works and what doesn't.
 
Hemirunner said:
The Eagle crank is more than adequate for for what you're wanting to build and so are their 7.100 rods. The mopar crank isn't any better than an Eagle and for that money you could buy a Callies if you want top shelf. I won't use the K1 7.100 rod with a hemi piston because of the small beam size coupled with the heavy hemi pistons. The Eagle or RPM H-beam rods are a better choice IMO. You don't need the Stage V heads to make 600hp with a 472, the MP's will do it no problem. The valves that come in them are fine for most applications but the springs won't work with anything but a hydraulic flat tappet cam. Buy 'em complete and just get springs to work with whatever cam you choose. I run two fours on my street hemi but the Indy Mod Man w/6 pack top looks interesting as well. Don't rely on the internet hype to build a good combo, find someone who has the experience to tell you what works and what doesn't.
Click to expand...

What piston did you use with the 4.15" crank and 7.1" rod to end up with 10.5:1 CR? Did the dome profile start at zero deck with a 10.7" block deck height?
 
A custom Diamond. Anytime you build a hemi, a custom piston is the only way to go. It costs more, but will be much lighter and can be built for that particular combination.
 
Thanks for the input!

I bought a used Scat crank from a member here so I have that covered for now.

I have another question regarding harmonic balancers. I have no idea what works and what doesn't. This is for a street Hemi that will see little to no strip. Are all balancers okay to use? I was looking at a billet BHJ. Are they any good or what do you recommend?

Thanks!

Per
 
I can take it to the strip for you so you get a timeslip :skier:
 
Tunis said:
Thanks for the input!

I bought a used Scat crank from a member here so I have that covered for now.

I have another question regarding harmonic balancers. I have no idea what works and what doesn't. This is for a street Hemi that will see little to no strip. Are all balancers okay to use? I was looking at a billet BHJ. Are they any good or what do you recommend?

Thanks!

Per
Click to expand...
ATI or innovators west. Anything else is a waste of money.
 
Great! Thanks!

Is there any damper that looks even remotely stock that is good? :)

Or are the dampers from ATI and innovators west fully compatible with stock pulleys and other hardware?

Thanks!

Per
 
ATI doesn't seem to have one (I'm looking too) but not sure about Innovators.
 
Neither company has one that looks stock, but by the time you get all the front pulleys and accessories on, you can hardly see it anyway. You could probably paint up an ATI orange and no one would no the difference if it meant that much to you.
 
Get the mopar performance damper, it works with the 440 pulleys. I got one off the bag for 200.00. Its a work of art and not a fluid damper. Tim
 
When your spending this kind of money only use a new crank. stay away from duel carbs, they look nice but a single 950 Holley or Quick Fuel is a far better option. I recommend diamond for pistons. Eagle cranks are fine for the street. Cast iron heads for Street motor, I know every will argue this. But Ive been around these engines a long time and Iron is better for street use. Use a roller cam with oil thru push rods. Smith brothers push rods. Try to stay away from Tri carb systems they leak and are a fire hazard. A MSd Distributor and vacuum pot. With 8 12 inches vacuum. Stage 5 rockers. Be careful of Mopar Aluminum heads problems with pressed in valve seats. Duel plane intake is the easiest. These engines make lots of power. You wont need a 114 degree lobe separation with 472 inches. It will suck the eye balls out of your head. A 110 lobe separation is fine. also Look at crane for cam and solid roller they still have the best quality bar none. Use a 8 quart pan and install a double ribbed skid plate. If you want to save money on pulleys go to Randy at Bouchillion Performance. The nicest guy and he never rips you off for parts.
 
Mancini sells a really nice Damper that looks original and is under 250.00 also remember with the size of the mass of Hemi balancer have its balance checked. Avoid using an old balancer with dry rotted rubber elastomer.
 
It's 2012 now...LOL.... iron heads?? Seriously? There is no way in hell I'd put iron GENII hemi heads on anything unless it was called for by class rules. I run aluminum heads and twin edelbrock 800's on my street hemi. No fires, no leaks and I've tuned them well. I also run a single plane intake as horsepower is my concern.
 
Iron heads technically make more power if they flow the same as the aluminum, but the weight is a killer for me. I went with StageV that only had mild blending. Tim

Hemirunner said:
It's 2012 now...LOL.... iron heads?? Seriously? There is no way in hell I'd put iron GENII hemi heads on anything unless it was called for by class rules. I run aluminum heads and twin edelbrock 800's on my street hemi. No fires, no leaks and I've tuned them well. I also run a single plane intake as horsepower is my concern.
Click to expand...
 
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