Loud and scary noises coming from my 440...

[383MovingViolation]

Sounds to me like the starter is still running when you let the key up off the start mode. I would check the start circuit and also take the starter out and check it on the bench.

 

[Hemi Rebel]

That was one of my first thoughts too. I got under the car and looked through the inspection cover. I literally watched the solenoid engage the gear spin the motor over, then retract back. All worked exactly as it should. Can't be the starter.

Then I would say its in the trans. You ran it with the belts off, and there is no way anything in the engine will make that noise. If it did it wouldn't do it for more than 15 seconds before it blew up. good luck. Keep us posted.

 

[Meep-Meep]

Did you remove the tranny inspection cover? That noise has a sheet metal ring to it, and it's high frequency and completely uninterrupted like the ring gear is sawing on something. It has to be something that you were in contact with during this change over.

 

['67Satellite]

Well i set a personal best Solo Transmission removal of 1 hour 45 minutes. Pulled the torque converter off and was upset that there seems to be nothing wrong. Both spline shafts seem to be well lubricated and in good shape. The torque converter itself doesn't seem too upset, it was totally full of fluid so that's a good sign.

Can I take off the plate behind the torque converter to have a look inside without any parts falling out?

I'll be honest, i was kind of hoping to see carnage in there, but nothing seems to be wrong. I'll post pictures tomorrow, we've got to figure this all out.

 

[Hemi Rebel]

Well i set a personal best Solo Transmission removal of 1 hour 45 minutes. Pulled the torque converter off and was upset that there seems to be nothing wrong. Both spline shafts seem to be well lubricated and in good shape. The torque converter itself doesn't seem too upset, it was totally full of fluid so that's a good sign.

Can I take off the plate behind the torque converter to have a look inside without any parts falling out?

I'll be honest, i was kind of hoping to see carnage in there, but nothing seems to be wrong. I'll post pictures tomorrow, we've got to figure this all out.

The "plate" behind the converter is the trans pump. You can take it out (puller required) and disassemble it if need be. Whatever it is rubbing like that, you would think it would do it simply turning it over by hand. Did you hear or feel it when taking the TQ converter bolts out? How does the converter feel when its installed in the pump and you turn it by hand. If its ok I wouldn't go pulling the pump just yet.

 

[red 69 runner]

Can you start the motor with the trans out?

 

[BeastlyBirdie]

He can't start it without the trans unless he has a bellhousing and flywheel from a stick. Hemi rebel is right, it wouldn't make that noise long if it was an internal engine noise. As for a bearing, if he drained the oil as he said, and saw nothing, as he said, most likely the bearings are fine. The noise continues for a moment after shut down, at least how I heard it on video. Meaning that it iscconnected to the engine, not the engine.

 

[tallhair]

If it was the starter I'd think it would have been burnt up by now and no longer want to crank it.

I know you ran it w/o the WP and fan but if not I would wonder if your clutch fan was shot .. if it is a clutch fan

 

[dryheat]

That sounds like the starter not disengaging. How did you check to check the starter

I would agree with this ... to my old ears it sounds like the starter motor is continuously spinning without the solenoid being engaged to the flywheel.

 

['67Satellite]

Starter is fine, i watched it with my own eyes start the car and stop spinning. Motor has ran with every component off the front of the engine. Its not the water pump, alternator, fan, steering pump, fuel pump, or oil pump. Im thinking it must be the trans, but i cant see anything obvious. Youd think that a noise that loud would leave an obvious trail of damage.

 

[dryheat]

OK ... does the noise intensity change/follow the engine RPM? The video was only the engine at idle ... at least I think it's at idle.

 

[HEMI-ITIS]

This is a head scratcher/tool throwing problem for sure.I also thought it was the starter:eusa_doh:

You have removed just about everything and found no witness marks.something HAS to contacting to create that sound:angryfire:
When I has a similar issue,it was the water pump:edgy:

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Jack the rear wheels off the ground,start it up and put it in gear and see if the pitch of the noise changes any.

 

['67Satellite]

Heres some pictures. Nothing immediatly evident. Splines looks ok. Im running out of ideas guys. Any thing i can check out internally? If i pull the front pump, can i get it back together easily?



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OK ... does the noise intensity change/follow the engine RPM? The video was only the engine at idle ... at least I think it's at idle.

The noise changes a little bit when its revved, but not very much.

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Well hemi-itis, the car is on stands and has no drive shaft installed. As i mentioned, i wanted to get it going to show myself some progress more than anything.

 

[HEMI-ITIS]

I assume you have a yoke stuck in to hold trans fluid right???

 

[BIGSHCLUNK]

Your trans pics "look" normal to me. I don't believe its the starter. HEMIITIS water pump pics could make that noise, but you loose me on that when you say you ran this motor for 300 hun miles. (something in the cooling system got jammed in the pump impeller maybe?) Hmmm, how are things looking on the flex plate area? The noise doesn't sound like its "in deep" so to speak. Converter only spins one way (internally) right?

 

[bigmanjbmopar]

If it's not the starter with the relay stuck in then where is it loudest, you say you took everything off put in the video I can see the fan spinning which means you have the water pump attached. With that much off already it is easy to take it off just to check, some sealant and gaskets is the only cost. check the pump blades.

Also like others rev it does it change with the rpm's? if it does than it is something attached to the motor or internal.

 

[ga66mopar]

If it's not the starter with the relay stuck in then where is it loudest, you say you took everything off put in the video I can see the fan spinning which means you have the water pump attached. With that much off already it is easy to take it off just to check, some sealant and gaskets is the only cost. check the pump blades.

Also like others rev it does it change with the rpm's? if it does than it is something attached to the motor or internal.

In his first post he eliminated the water pump. I had a friend spin a bearing yrs ago in a small block chevy and it made a odd whinning noise. Man I hate it for you. I know these problems can cause a person a lot of stress. I seen one guy put bolts that were to long in the crank pulleys on a hemi one time and the bolts were hitting the timing chain cover but you have already had the timing chain cover off.

What I've tried:
Ran motor without alternator/water pump/steering pump (no change in sound)
Ran motor without mech. fuel pump hooked up (no change in sound)

 

['67Satellite]

I assume you have a yoke stuck in to hold trans fluid right???

No, but i havent had any leakage. The trans is making pressure though, because i had fluid in the cooler and lines.

 

[Hemi Rebel]

If you pull the trans pump out you will need a new seal and gasket and some vasaline to put it back together. Why can you guys with these crazy problems never be closer. I have a 4 speed bellhousing and flywheel just sitting here that we could throw on quick to eliminate the engine or trans as the source

 

[Lenny Arsenault]

Sounds like you have tried just about everything external mhow about something metal rubbing on the harmonic balancer lioke the timong index pointer just a thought because you said you removed all the belts and it still made the noise.