Mopar 528 camshaft

[sneezi]

Hey Guys

Looking for advice regarding the old school MP528 solid flat tappet cam.

My question is do i install it dot to dot which gives 104 intake centerline
or move it 2-4 degrees either way.

My combo is a factory appearing 440

493 stroker
ported stealth heads
11.1 comp
6 pack induction modded
HP exhaust manifolds

Thanks in advance

 

[RemCharger]

Pretty small cam for the combo, I'd go straight up or retarded.
Advanced will be too much compression at low rpm with 11:1 and will run out of rpm fast
IMO

 

[Kern Dog]

I ran that cam for several years. It is best to “degree” the cam if you want to maximize the potential. Some believe that it is pointless because machining is so close, they find that “dot to dot” works out to zero anyway. Others have found that with their setups, the degree process uncovered some improperly machined parts. Dot to dot was off by several degrees. In a high compression engine where piston to valve clearance is really close, being off a few degrees can be destructive.
I’ve done it both ways.
One 318 I had in a Duster ran smooth but was a gutless slug. I found out someone had replaced the timing set and the cam sprocket was off by 3 teeth. It only avoided damage because 318s are low compression engines.
My 528 ran great in my 440/493. It made great low and midrange power. The wide lash they call for does make for some clatter. Many suggest to tighten the lash to .022 intake .024 exhaust.

 

[gooser]

i have had the 528 in my rr for the last 28 years straight up stock bore short block just a intake 750 3310 holley 906 heads milled .020 a set of hookers. like kern dog said great low end and midrange car went 12.50 @110 thur the muffers

 

[BSB67]

I’d probably install it at 112 or 114

 

[RemCharger]

I ran that cam for several years. It is best to “degree” the cam if you want to maximize the potential. Some believe that it is pointless because machining is so close, they find that “dot to dot” works out to zero anyway. Others have found that with their setups, the degree process uncovered some improperly machined parts. Dot to dot was off by several degrees. In a high compression engine where piston to valve clearance is really close, being off a few degrees can be destructive.
I’ve done it both ways.
One 318 I had in a Duster ran smooth but was a gutless slug. I found out someone had replaced the timing set and the cam sprocket was off by 3 teeth. It only avoided damage because 318s are low compression engines.
My 528 ran great in my 440/493. It made great low and midrange power. The wide lash they call for does make for some clatter. Many suggest to tighten the lash to .022 intake .024 exhaust.

Kern I thought you were having problems with pinging and high compression, changing cams and eventually pistons to cure it.

 

[Kern Dog]

Kern I thought you were having problems with pinging and high compression, changing cams and eventually pistons to cure it.

Back around 2014, I switched to a rowdy Lunati cam on the advice of a FABO member. The concept was that a cam with a later intake closing point would reduce cylinder pressure and reduce the risk of detonation. That is a fine line to dance and while it may work sometimes, the risk is that a cam that does this may also build cylinder pressure even more than others as the rpms increase. Cylinder filling in higher rpms still results in detonation but now you can barely hear it.
Since I was extremely stubborn and didn't want to pull the engine to change pistons, (What I really should have done) I took the easy route, a band aid of sorts.... I pulled the heads and slipped in thicker Cometic head gaskets at .075. It did the trick....The engine didn't knock anymore. The Lunati didn't have good idle vacuum and was a little wild so I swapped in the '528. I had the '528 in the 440/493 for years with those Howards EDM lifters. Everything was fine until I switched oils. I wasn't aware of the drawbacks to running high detergent oil with added zinc....the thought is that the detergent wiped away the zinc as fast as it was deposited, therefore leaving no zinc protection in place.

 

[sneezi]

Thank you everyone for your inputs.
I am confused with BSB67 advice regarding installing
centerline @ 112-114, sounds extreme.

 

[lewtot184]

Cam is ground on 112 centers. Installing at 112 centerline is straight up. 114 is 2 degrees retarded. I think those cams have 2 degrees of advance ground into them that should give a 110 installed center line. 112 or 114 will work. I think the real issue is to not do the silly 28 and 32 valve lash.

 

[1968rt]

Running one in my 68 straight up. Stock lash was noisy, set it at .018 and .022. runs great 440 six pack with manifolds

 

[lewtot184]

I also think 11:1 true compression ratio is a deal breaker. It'll never work on California gas unless the timing is significantly retarded. I'd worry more about this than camshaft.

 

[PRHeads]

I’d shoot for 109-110 Intake C/L, and I agree it may not be happy of California pump gas.

I’d start out with the lash at .022” hot, and tweak from there.

 

[sneezi]

Thanks again guys.
I did forget to mention I'm from
Down under Australia, our fuel is 98 octane.

 

[lewtot184]

I think I'd do a cam with maybe a step more duration and spread the lobe centers to perhaps 114 with those exhaust manifolds.

 

[BSB67]

our fuel is 98 octane.

Is that RM/2 rating, or just Research (RON) rating? If it’s just RON method, it’s like 93 or 94 RM/2.

Just looked it up. It’s RON. 98 RON will not support 11:1 with that cam, IMO.

 

[Kern Dog]

RON versus MON.....

 

[Geoff 2]

Sneezi,
Our 98 is equivalent to about US 94. Every engine is different & the only way to find out is to.....try it. I have tuned two engines recently, both are 10.5:1 CR, both have alum heads. One is a 440 Mopar & it pings on light load [ more tuning to be done ]. The other is a 490 Pontiac...& it doesn't ping.

Keeping engine temp low plus cold air induction both help with detonation.
Reducing valve lash as suggested also increases seat duration, gives a rougher idle & lower idle vacuum. Large lash [ 028/032 ] does not necessarily mean a noisier valve train; it depends on how the cam was ground. The Comp XE hyd cams have a reputation for noise & they are zero lash on the opening side. I like to lash sol cams tighter than spec, but not for noise purposes. Newton's law...action & reaction. When the lash is taken up, the valve train gets slammed, takes a 'hit' [ action ]. It then recovers [ reaction ]...but that takes finite time & the cam lobe has moved on. And there is not much time at 6000 rpm... So if you are at the end of the lash ramp [ large lash ], there might not be much of the gentler lash ramp left for recovery & you might end up on the steeper cam flanks.

 

[lewtot184]

Is that RM/2 rating, or just Research (RON) rating? If it’s just RON method, it’s like 93 or 94 RM/2.

Just looked it up. It’s RON. 98 RON will not support 11:1 with that cam, IMO.

I was thinking the same thing but didn't know how to put it together.

 

[lewtot184]

I kind of hate to mention this but
, may be better off with something like the Mopar. 509/114lsa. I don't like big hydraulics much but this cam will probably close the intake valve about 8 degrees later. May be a usable band-aid.

 

[PRHeads]

Does MP even sell BB cams anymore?