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My 1978 Dodge Monaco 4 door sedan.

Thanks Hawkster.

This mornings findings are below in this video I made.

I got it idling, not much else. Please watch…


Why did you start the engine with a black plastic cap on top of the carburetor? Have you seen someone do that? Just curious, and as been mentioned, take it off. The PCV looks like it is connected correctly, but your symptoms sound like a vacuum leak unless you are not letting the engine get up to temp first.
When you set the timing, the engine has to be warm and idling at a low rpm or the mechanical advance in the distributor will not let you set the base timing accurately. So, let the engine warm up, once the choke is completely open, then set idle down to around 600 or so, set your idle mixture screws and set your timing to 10 deg before TDC. If the carb is done correctly, everything should work. Does this engine have an egr valve? Did you leave that disconnected from the carb? You need to do that or it will cause the engine to run horribly.
 
It looks like the paint cap is a temporary tool used to restrict air flow to allow the engine to idle.
I seriously doubt Gary intends to operate the car this way on the road.
In the video, you correctly identified the breather as the bigger hose on the right (Passenger side) valve cover.
 
At one point I think you indicated that you connected vacuum lines to the charcoal canister.
It just collects vapor from the carburetor. No vacuum lines to that thing. Your current carb may not have the same port connection available
 
At one point I think you indicated that you connected vacuum lines to the charcoal canister.
It just collects vapor from the carburetor. No vacuum lines to that thing. Your current carb may not have the same port connection available
Good catch.
 
At one point I think you indicated that you connected vacuum lines to the charcoal canister.
It just collects vapor from the carburetor. No vacuum lines to that thing. Your current carb may not have the same port connection available
The Lean Burn carb had lines running to and from the charcoal canister. You're right, there isn't the same outlets on the current carb so I've just tossed those.
 
It looks like the paint cap is a temporary tool used to restrict air flow to allow the engine to idle.
I seriously doubt Gary intends to operate the car this way on the road.
In the video, you correctly identified the breather as the bigger hose on the right (Passenger side) valve cover.
Correct. I drilled a lot of holes in it firstly to prevent anything being ingested into the carb (it's windy today, lots of debris flying around) and secondly to simulate an air cleaner being installed. I assumed although not critical, all of my attempts at adjustment would change once an air cleaner goes up on top.
 
Correct. I drilled a lot of holes in it firstly to prevent anything being ingested into the carb (it's windy today, lots of debris flying around) and secondly to simulate an air cleaner being installed. I assumed although not critical, all of my attempts at adjustment would change once an air cleaner goes up on top.
That will not simulate an air cleaner. And no, an air cleaner won't affect it that much, or something is wrong with your filter. That cap, no matter how many holes you drilled in it will not simulate an air cleaner being installed, just fyi.
 
The PCV looks like it is connected correctly, but your symptoms sound like a vacuum leak unless you are not letting the engine get up to temp first.
When you set the timing, the engine has to be warm and idling at a low rpm or the mechanical advance in the distributor will not let you set the base timing accurately. So, let the engine warm up, once the choke is completely open, then set idle down to around 600 or so, set your idle mixture screws and set your timing to 10 deg before TDC. If the carb is done correctly, everything should work. Does this engine have an egr valve? Did you leave that disconnected from the carb? You need to do that or it will cause the engine to run horribly.
Ok thank you Sir. Yes it has an EGR valve. I just read about someone blocking that off, so from your advice I should go block mine off too!
I couldn't get the engine to idle (off of full choke) long enough to bring the rpm down.
 
Ok thank you Sir. Yes it has an EGR valve. I just read about someone blocking that off, so from your advice I should go block mine off too!
I couldn't get the engine to idle (off of full choke) long enough to bring the rpm down.
That means you have a pretty large vacuum leak somewhere or your base idle screw isn't screwed in far enough. Turn your mixture screws in til they stop, then out 1.5 turns. that'll get you in the ballpark.
 
That means you have a pretty large vacuum leak somewhere or your base idle screw isn't screwed in far enough. Turn your mixture screws in til they stop, then out 1.5 turns. that'll get you in the ballpark.
Excellent thank you sir!
 
It's been a tough couple of weeks. No luck getting this car to run good. I sold my daily driver so I'm frantically trying to find a replacement, plus it's consistently touching 100F every day, which as you know can wear on a guy.

The massive oil leak that's been plaguing the car has been on my mind. At first, I thought it was the rear main seal. Then the oil pressure switch. Then the distributor seal. It was, through process of elimination, none of these, as a couple of you mentioned it could be the intake manifold gasket. Indeed. So I decided to get that done first before diving back into the carb et al.

Removing all the stuff carefully and taking pictures ensued. My main fuel line into the carb twisted out of shape at the end by the fitting...
IMG_1230.jpeg

...can I use some nice braided fuel line to replace this? I like the look of braided line.

Anyways, I was moving slowly due to the garage temp (110F on Saturday) but I finally managed to remove the intake manifold.
IMG_1236.jpeg

That there gasket be toast, I reckon.
I had the gasket kit on order and was "In Transit" for delivery Saturday, so it was perfect timing....except it never arrived. A quick look at the UPS tracking showed delays, so now I must wait. There's a LOT of cleaning up to do...
IMG_1239.jpeg

IMG_1245.jpeg

IMG_1246.jpeg


I bought degreaser and spent a good three hours cleaning the manifold up. I was going to do the same to the valve covers but I think I'm just going to buy some new ones.
IMG_1247.jpeg


So there's this little guy, which when I lifted it up, had already been blanked off underneath.
IMG_1242.jpeg

So I'm assuming I can make a better block-off plate from some sheet steel I have and do away with this altogether.

So I made a little progress, just waiting for the gasket set and I can get the intake back on.

I did think about buying a new intake but then I looked at the price :-O

Hope you all had a great weekend!
 
Before you put the intake back on, you should plug off the heat crossover in the intake.
I would use tin foil.
Just wad it up and put as much as you can in the crossover.
 
Before you put the intake back on, you should plug off the heat crossover in the intake.
I would use tin foil.
Just wad it up and put as much as you can in the crossover.
I used aluminium flashing in one and it worked fine.
 
Hi Gary,

OK, now you are into a project!

When you clean the head area (that the intake manifold bolts to), you need to protect the engine from the debris. Lay towel(s) or other protection that is carefully shaped so the towel(s) sit under the heads and under the front are rear as much as possible. Clean carefully but thoroughly. Ensure you don't get crap into the lifter valley. Obviously, all the surfaces that contact the intake manifold need to be nice and clean and oil free. Carb cleaner will help get it clean and nice.

Once your intake and engine are cleaned appropriately, try dry fitting the intake a couple of times. Especially with a cast iron intake manifold, it is not easy to carefully set one into fresh beads of oil resistant silicone without smearing and screwing it up.

So do this (once everything is clean):
a) Put the intake gaskets loosely on the heads (dry and without any silicone). These are the long gaskets with the 4 rectangular shaped holes for the intake runners. Your gasket set will also come with two shorter cork gaskets for the front and rear of the engine. Leave these small gaskets out for now.

b) Set the intake manifold on the engine. There are three things to learn by doing this:
1) How you need to place the manifold back on the engine smoothly and, when doing it for real, so you don't screw up your gaskets and silicone.
2) The front and/or rear of your engine will have little pins that help locate the small front and rear gaskets. If they stick up too high, they impede the ability of the manifold to seal. Are the pins hitting the manifold at all? One thing you can try is to rock the manifold side to side a little bit and try to feel if it is rocking on the pins. If the pins are too high, they must be filed down or removed. (You can also look on your intake manifold for witness marks these pins have left. If there are witness marks, you likely have an issue. If I'm not mistaken, some stock manifolds have a recess in them I think - then you are OK.)
3) Once the pins in the step above are OK, how much space is there between the engine and intake manifold at the front and back of the manifold? Look at this gap vs. the thickness of the cork gaskets that came with your gasket set. Is it bigger or smaller than the thickness of these gaskets? If the gap is significantly smaller than the height of the gaskets, you should use silicone only to seal the front and rear of the engine. If it is only slightly smaller, or bigger than the gasket thickness, I suggest you use those gaskets.

c) Repeat step (b) several times until you are comfortable with the fit and clearances of everything. When you are ready, go for the final "drop".

d) To seal the intake manifold, use oil resistant silicone. Don't just buy any silicone off the rack. I have attached a picture below of a good silicone I use.
20220725_084953.jpg


e) Now lightly smear silicone on the intake gaskets between the heads and intake manifolds only where the water jackets are present (a super thin amount should be on the gaskets - thick does not help you here). Leave the rest of the gasket around the 4 intake ports dry. Stick them to the heads where they belong.

f) For the front and rear of the engine: If using the cork gaskets smear both sides with silicone and stick them into place. You must make sure that the height of the silicone and gaskets is greater then the gap you measured in step b3, at most about 1/8" higher. Too much and you squeeze silicone into the engine. Too little and you have an oil leak.
If you are not using the gaskets, simply put a nice bead of silicone on the engine side that is at most about 1/8" bigger than the gap, but again, not less.

g) Put an extra bead of silicone at all four corners where the heads meet the engine block. These corners are problematic and you want to be sure the manifold does not leak here.

h) Place the manifold on the engine. This is where the practice from step b pays off. Once in place, check the placement of the gaskets by looking through the bolt holes in the manifold. Stick a small screwdriver in the bolt holes to slightly move the intake gaskets around if they moved a little.

i) Insert bolts and lightly snug them up. Then torque them down to 35 lb ft. Since you may not have a torque wrench and probably can't use one on some bolts even if you had one, that means tight but don't go ape $hit on the wrench. Always torque and tighten the middle bolts first, working your way out to the edges.

Good luck!

(If I missed any key suggestions or steps here, I'm sure the brain trust here will add on! - Please do so Gary will have a successful project!)

Hawk
 
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Oh, and one other thing:

I noticed in your video that you hooked two ports on your carb that went to the charcoal canister together (see green line in picture). I believe the bottom port (marked A) is manifold vacuum and the top port (marked B) is a bowl vent. Hooking the two together could very likely cause a large vacuum leak. If you want to take the charcoal canister out of the equation, then plug both - don't hook them together. (If I am correct and the top port is a bowl vent, then you can simply leave this open to the atmosphere.)

carb.jpg
 
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Hi Gary,

OK, now you are into a project!

When you clean the head area (that the intake manifold bolts to), you need to protect the engine from the debris. Lay towel(s) or other protection that is carefully shaped so the towel(s) sit under the heads and under the front are rear as much as possible. Clean carefully but thoroughly. Ensure you don't get crap into the lifter valley. Obviously, all the surfaces that contact the intake manifold need to be nice and clean and oil free. Carb cleaner will help get it clean and nice.

Once your intake and engine are cleaned appropriately, try dry fitting the intake a couple of times. Especially with a cast iron intake manifold, it is not easy to carefully set one into fresh beads of oil resistant silicone without smearing and screwing it up.

So do this (once everything is clean):
a) Put the intake gaskets loosely on the heads (dry and without any silicone). These are the long gaskets with the 4 rectangular shaped holes for the intake runners. Your gasket set will also come with two shorter cork gaskets for the front and rear of the engine. Leave these small gaskets out for now.

b) Set the intake manifold on the engine. There are three things to learn by doing this:
1) How you need to place the manifold back on the engine smoothly and, when doing it for real, so you don't screw up your gaskets and silicone.
2) The front and/or rear of your engine will have little pins that help locate the small front and rear gaskets. If they stick up too high, they impede the ability of the manifold to seal. Are the pins hitting the manifold at all? One thing you can try is to rock the manifold side to side a little bit and try to feel if it is rocking on the pins. If the pins are too high, they must be filed down or removed. (You can also look on your intake manifold for witness marks these pins have left. If there are witness marks, you likely have an issue. If I'm not mistaken, some stock manifolds have a recess in them I think - then you are OK.)
3) Once the pins in the step above are OK, how much space is there between the engine and intake manifold at the front and back of the manifold? Look at this gap vs. the thickness of the cork gaskets that came with your gasket set. Is it bigger or smaller than the thickness of these gaskets? If the gap is significantly smaller than the height of the gaskets, you should use silicone only to seal the front and rear of the engine. If it is only slightly smaller, or bigger than the gasket thickness, I suggest you use those gaskets.

c) Repeat step (b) several times until you are comfortable with the fit and clearances of everything. When you are ready, go for the final "drop".

d) To seal the intake manifold, use oil resistant silicone. Don't just buy any silicone off the rack. I have attached a picture below of a good silicone I use.
View attachment 1318339

e) Now lightly smear silicone on the intake gaskets between the heads and intake manifolds (a super thin amount should be on the gaskets - thick does not help you here). Stick them to the heads where they belong.

f) For the front and rear of the engine: If using the cork gaskets smear both sides with silicone and stick them into place. You must make sure that the height of the silicone and gaskets is greater then the gap you measured in step b3, at most about 1/8" higher. Too much and you squeeze silicone into the engine. Too little and you have an oil leak.
If you are not using the gaskets, simply put a nice bead of silicone on the engine side that is at most about 1/8" bigger than the gap, but again, not less.

g) Put an extra bead of silicone at all four corners where the heads meet the engine block. These corners are problematic and you want to be sure the manifold does not leak here.

h) Place the manifold on the engine. This is where the practice from step b pays off. Once in place, check the placement of the gaskets by looking through the bolt holes in the manifold. Stick a small screwdriver in the bolt holes to slightly move the intake gaskets around if they moved a little.

i) Insert bolts and lightly snug them up. Then torque them down to 35 lb ft. Since you may not have a torque wrench and probably can't use one on some bolts even if you had one, that means tight but don't go ape $hit on the wrench. Always torque and tighten the middle bolts first, working your way out to the edges.

Good luck!

(If I missed any key suggestions or steps here, I'm sure the brain trust here will add on! - Please do so Gary will have a successful project!)

Hawk
Hawk,
I agree with everything except spreading silicone around intake ports. Silicone is not fuel resistant, normally, and it will eventually absorb fuel and expand, then blow out and cause a vacuum leak. It takes time, but since these are wet manifolds, in that the fuel is introduced at the entrance of the runners, it will inevitably leave liquid fuel sitting on this silicone. Just read the back of the tube and see if it says gasoline resistant, if it does, then you are good to go, if not, then don't put it there, just around the water jackets. Just a tip from my years of doing this crap for a living. It's bit me in the butt before knew what I know now.
 
Hawk,
I agree with everything except spreading silicone around intake ports. Silicone is not fuel resistant, normally, and it will eventually absorb fuel and expand, then blow out and cause a vacuum leak. It takes time, but since these are wet manifolds, in that the fuel is introduced at the entrance of the runners, it will inevitably leave liquid fuel sitting on this silicone. Just read the back of the tube and see if it says gasoline resistant, if it does, then you are good to go, if not, then don't put it there, just around the water jackets. Just a tip from my years of doing this crap for a living. It's bit me in the butt before knew what I know now.
I stand corrected. The silicone absolutely does state to avoid use in direct contact with gasoline. Thanks for correction - what a forum should be for! I have fixed my post to Gary to avoid confusion.
 
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Update:

Thank you @HawkRod for that really detailed post above. You helped massively in my intake manifold gasket replacement. It is now done, and successfully back together, using the methods you outlined.

I've had the car running enough to know that the oil leak from the intake gasket, is gone. I'm very happy about that, and the transmission leak is fixed too, so no more puddles under the car.

Unfortunately I can't get this car to run good, with the old Lean-Burn carb, nor the other carb I have. So rather than look like an idiot and spoil my little fix-er-up thread for myself, I'll bow out, and add another update once something has been figured out. I have a friend who might be able to come by and help, but when that will be I don't know.

See ya for now fella's.
 
Don't give up on it Gary, you are probably very close to getting the issues resolved and getting back into the drivers seat, best wishes for you sir.
 
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