• When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.

Starting a warmmotor as opposed tocold start.

Nick 916

Member
Local time
10:56 AM
Joined
Mar 22, 2017
Messages
15
Reaction score
10
Location
New York
Hey guys, 74 Charger 360 with Thermoquad 4 Barrel. Cold start procedure perfected: One pump, crank, if no fire, repeat, and she fires up. However after fully warmed up, and left to sit for an hour or so, she cranks for a looooong time. Is a pump of the pedal necessary? Is fuel boiled out of floats? Just let it crank with no pump? Just looking for suggestions. Thanks.
 
The next time you have it all warmed up, and you think it's going to take a lot of cranking, look down in the carb, pull the throttle and see if you have a good squirt of gas. If not, you've lost the gas in the carb from sitting. Could be draining back, boiling over ect.

If you have a good squirt, then you'll have to experiment on throttle position to see what it likes to fire up.
 
Hey guys, 74 Charger 360 with Thermoquad 4 Barrel. Cold start procedure perfected: One pump, crank, if no fire, repeat, and she fires up. However after fully warmed up, and left to sit for an hour or so, she cranks for a looooong time. Is a pump of the pedal necessary? Is fuel boiled out of floats? Just let it crank with no pump? Just looking for suggestions. Thanks.

You may well have lost most of the fuel in the bowl(s) or possibly your having an issue with lack of vacuum initially to activate fuel vaporization. One things for sure, it wasn't sold to the public with this issue, so somethings amiss. Many manufacturers realized the side effect of "hotsoaks" and installed a vent at the top of the bowl which was nothing more than a rubber pintal covering a small hole. It was mounted at the end of a small piece of spring metal that was screwed onto the bowl.When the metal got hot enough it deformed opening the vent hole. Others used carb spacers and some off shore cars (Honda) had a little fan that blew air on the carb to cool it down. I can see only one solution if your bowl(s) are evaporating dry and that's an electric fuel pump to replenish them quickly. You may also find that the butterfies at the base of the carb are a bit too far open especially if you idle at a higher rpm due to the type of engine (modified). This will surely drop the amount of vacuum the carb needs to function. Try a "hotsoak", press the accelerator pedal and crank. No difference? Set the preload on the choke properly and try again. No difference? Set the choke to it's closed position, like when cold, and try the same hot start.If none of the above proves useful in diagnostics, take the top off the carb and have a look in the bowls cause it's the only way you'll know for sure if the fuel is disipating.
 
The Edelbroke carb I have does the same thing. The workaround is push the gas pedal down and hold it down until the engine starts.
 
When you shut the engine off, have a listen in on the carb. I'm betting the fuel is boiling and is draining dry. You'll be able to hear it bubbling like a pot of pasta. The fuel today is horrible. My car does exactly the same thing as your's does. I've tried spacers, heat shields, etc.. to try and make it better. Nothing really worked well enough for me to keep those items on there, particularly when I had an Edelbrock carb on the car. Switching to a Holley helped a little, but it didn't cure it.
 
They didn't have this type of fuel back then either.
Bingo!! Just like our oil they changed the blends for modern cars where fuel is delivered to injectors under higher pressures not being stored on top of a hot motor. Like mentioned, check if there's fuel in the carb after getting it nice an warm after it's sat. Another thing to try is run the gas out and fill it up with non ethanol fuel if you can find someone that sells it and see if it quits.
Phenolic carb spacers, insulating and rerouting fuel lines and Air Gap intakes all help but haven't fixed mine.

I'm switching to an electric fuel pump with a return line from the regulator after trying everything else. This will allow you to refill the carb just by turning the key to the run position for a few seconds before starting. Running a return style regulator will save on pump wear and keep the fuel moving which should help keep it cool.
 
Thanks for all the responses guys. I will try your suggestions. Thanks again!
 
I am running a 360 with 800 cfm thermo in the truck. Start it the same as you described. Have no problem with heatsink. No need to touch the gas pedal to start it after warm up the rest of the day.
If you have hard starts with a thermo check the needles and seats or plastic body for cracks. Bet it's dumping fuel after you shut it down and flooding it. Has nothing to do with heat sink that's why the thermoquad got a poly boul.
 
Yeah... I'm doubtful on the heat thing as well. A lot of times my Edelbroke will do this even if I just shut the engine down for a few seconds. That gas would have to be flashing into steam to evaporate that quickly.
 
I am running a 360 with 800 cfm thermo in the truck. Start it the same as you described. Have no problem with heatsink. No need to touch the gas pedal to start it after warm up the rest of the day.
If you have hard starts with a thermo check the needles and seats or plastic body for cracks. Bet it's dumping fuel after you shut it down and flooding it. Has nothing to do with heat sink that's why the thermoquad got a poly boul.
This is where the sight glass is very handy, easily visible.

Never ran a poly but I imagine it would help fight heat soak.
 
Yeah... I'm doubtful on the heat thing as well. A lot of times my Edelbroke will do this even if I just shut the engine down for a few seconds. That gas would have to be flashing into steam to evaporate that quickly.
the problem clearly sounds like vapor lock. it does happen extremely quickly, try to touch anything in the engine compartment after a drive and see how long you can leave your hand there. gasoline doesnt really boils, it more so instantaneously vaporizes (which is why its so volatile and useful for internal combustion engines) and that occurs at only 93F (fill up your lawn mower from a plastic jug in the summer and that jug is puffed out and swollen from the vapor having expanded) everything under the hood is way above that. bringing back my heat transfer class, follow that curve up to a couple hundred degrees and the flash over speed is exponential. thats why frozen turkeys blow up in turkey fryers, the ice skips liquid going straight to gas, and those millions of bubbles escaping the oil it what violently sprays the oil everywhere. those tiny bubbles of gas vapor within the liquid violently expand fill the space, pushing the liquid gas out of the way, causing pressure on both sides of the bubble and lock it up. what stops it from occurring while running is the steady movement of the gas with cool gas coming in right behind it, as well as that fact that youre dirivng, air is moving through the engine compartment. it doesnt have to happen in the carb either, it could easily be a spot in the fuel line thats near something warm. that spot in the line has only a bubble of vapor and causes vapor lock. the mechanical fuel pump cant push gas if it cant pull it either. so yes one solution is an electric fuel pump that has the balls to push the gas through the bubble. you could also run your fuel lines as far away from the motor as you can. an extra inch or two from the pump to the carb lifts the line farther from the motor and will help alot. or another solution is to look at your intake manifold and see if it has a crossover. im not familiar with that late a model of motor but its right in the middle of all the oil smog BS. if the intake is stock it might have a "heater" built directly into it, and that will vaporize gas in the lines or the carb. either its an exhaust or more likely a coolant crossover. the intent was to heat up the intake to help carbed motors start easier in colder weather so it can start faster and be running at its intended efficiency much quicker. change your intake gasket to one that has the crossover blocked off, and it will probably solve your problem, if not it will at least help it quite a bit. This exact $15, 1 hour fix has solved your exact problem on three different vehicles for me.
 
i also agree with bruzillas hold down the pedal instead of pumping. but it works to fix what i just described. with essentially one end of the fuel system open to air, it releases pressure on one side of the vapor lock, giving it a path of least resistance.
 
Numerous ( including me) have talked about the quality of gas these days; it's crap.. Ok for EFI but not carbs. I even tape off the funnel on my gas can for the mowers,etc.!
 
My 440 would spit gas out the squirters after sitting for a few minutes in the heat, I wrapped the fuel line with the self-adhesive heat wrap anywhere it's near the exhaust and it seems to have cured it...
 
Auto Transport Service
Back
Top