V Code RR Results from Mecum

[biomedtechguy]

...you learn the talents to do things yourself. Also friends and forums like this are the best. The second option is to do what you do best that is profitable so you can pay someone else to do what they do best.

I'm glad you posted this Jerry. YOU certainly have experience and quite the stable!
I'm not as familiar with your cars as I'd like to be in that I'm not sure of your inventory and their relative status, stock factory original, or the other end of the spectrum, the Gen 3 Hemi PT Cruiser. I think you have a Daytona and a Superbird?
Anyway, how did you get the PT done?
The main reason for my reply is that in the 6 years I've had my car I have done a lot of fixes, taken both the 18 spline a833 and the Passon a855 out and put them in a few times, can't imagine anyone else (other than Promax) but me tuning the 6bbl, which the experience of tuning the idle mixture screws on the outboard carbs once I read the tuning tip someone posted that I've shared here, that was a Godsend of an epiphany, and the HUGE improvement that made, and the feeling of accomplishment, as well as the "ah HA! now I've got cha" leg up in my capabilities to tune and understand my 6bbl.
The initial tuning saga of my 6bbl began when I turned the center carb's metering block idle mixture screws all the way IN, but instead of the engine slowing, killing, it actually ran BETTER. BAM! I knew I had a problem. FAR too much fuel at idle being contributed by the outboard carbs.
Anyway, as much as I enjoy working on my car, I am limited by a lot of body pain, especially my lower back, knees, joints in general. I also have a choice sometimes, if I'm busy, I either do the job and get paid or I don't and I don't get paid. That leads directly to this:

do what you do best that is profitable so you can pay someone else to do what they do best.

...and THAT is what I'm doing now. I've had the shop and shop owner do major work for us before. The 9" rear axle and rear suspension upgrades, along with Wilwood 4 wheel disc brakes and line lock on my wife's GTO came out great. It was on that job I really saw how detailed he is with the work he does, he can solve problems or meet unexpected needs, like making a little bracket for the line lock that not only helped make it work, but made it look nice and neat too. With the massive number of systems and upgrades and parts that are going in my car, a guy like this is critical for making it all come together. No matter how hard I tried, how much research I did, tech support questions asked, and multiple adapters, pieces, parts, and "complete" kits I bought, there are a surprising number of odds and ends including machine work and fabrication that has to be done for everything to be truly finished, complete, and ready to go with little to no "keep an eye on_____and do _____if the ____does (something not so good)". Unless it's understood ahead of time that there may be the need for customer involvement or assistance, a full service installation should be: "Here's what I'd like done, here are the parts, if you have any questions here's the phone number(s) for tech support. How much? and Call me when it's finished"
Now I respect my mechanic's experience, know his work ethic, and I get involved in presenting options, making decisions, and I've been presented with options or suggestions for additional parts, systems, or pertinent upgrades as well. He takes a personal interest in an excellent outcome beyond professional responsibility, so that's another plus. Meanwhile I find additional motivation to get my work done because I've made that commitment to get him paid when the job is done.
Because my wife got impatient getting stuff done on her car, even though the guy who worked on her car was referred, and well paid, her car ran hot and ran out of gas on the 35 minute ride home, because the car WAS NOT ready, so really, how much time did she save?!
So yes, trading my labor and the money that makes for someone else's labor and that means I have to pay them, but they are experienced, skilled, fair, and TRUST WORTHY, that is definitely the best choice sometimes to get the best outcome.

 

[biomedtechguy]

I was looking at this $175k '69 hemi car yesterday and was thinking that was a lot of money, but if I win lotto I'd be interested.

To those saying the Mecum V-code black Roadrunner was sold for more than you feel it is worth, and I'm not debating that, I will point out that the Hemi 69 Roadrunner 66 Sat posted the link to has a #s Hemi, but NOT the a833 4 speed.
Not only was the black V-code fully #s matching drivetrain, it was VERY low mileage and ONE owner, never sold until now! Some of those enticements just cannot be duplicated.

 

[Jerry Hall]

I'm glad you posted this Jerry. YOU certainly have experience and quite the stable!
I'm not as familiar with your cars as I'd like to be in that I'm not sure of your inventory and their relative status, stock factory original, or the other end of the spectrum, the Gen 3 Hemi PT Cruiser. I think you have a Daytona and a Superbird?
Anyway, how did you get the PT done?
The main reason for my reply is that in the 6 years I've had my car I have done a lot of fixes, taken both the 18 spline a833 and the Passon a855 out and put them in a few times, can't imagine anyone else (other than Promax) but me tuning the 6bbl, which the experience of tuning the idle mixture screws on the outboard carbs once I read the tuning tip someone posted that I've shared here, that was a Godsend of an epiphany, and the HUGE improvement that made, and the feeling of accomplishment, as well as the "ah HA! now I've got cha" leg up in my capabilities to tune and understand my 6bbl.
The initial tuning saga of my 6bbl began when I turned the center carb's metering block idle mixture screws all the way IN, but instead of the engine slowing, killing, it actually ran BETTER. BAM! I knew I had a problem. FAR too much fuel at idle being contributed by the outboard carbs.
Anyway, as much as I enjoy working on my car, I am limited by a lot of body pain, especially my lower back, knees, joints in general. I also have a choice sometimes, if I'm busy, I either do the job and get paid or I don't and I don't get paid. That leads directly to this:

...and THAT is what I'm doing now. I've had the shop and shop owner do major work for us before. The 9" rear axle and rear suspension upgrades, along with Wilwood 4 wheel disc brakes and line lock on my wife's GTO came out great. It was on that job I really saw how detailed he is with the work he does, he can solve problems or meet unexpected needs, like making a little bracket for the line lock that not only helped make it work, but made it look nice and neat too. With the massive number of systems and upgrades and parts that are going in my car, a guy like this is critical for making it all come together. No matter how hard I tried, how much research I did, tech support questions asked, and multiple adapters, pieces, parts, and "complete" kits I bought, there are a surprising number of odds and ends including machine work and fabrication that has to be done for everything to be truly finished, complete, and ready to go with little to no "keep an eye on_____and do _____if the ____does (something not so good)". Unless it's understood ahead of time that there may be the need for customer involvement or assistance, a full service installation should be: "Here's what I'd like done, here are the parts, if you have any questions here's the phone number(s) for tech support. How much? and Call me when it's finished"
Now I respect my mechanic's experience, know his work ethic, and I get involved in presenting options, making decisions, and I've been presented with options or suggestions for additional parts, systems, or pertinent upgrades as well. He takes a personal interest in an excellent outcome beyond professional responsibility, so that's another plus. Meanwhile I find additional motivation to get my work done because I've made that commitment to get him paid when the job is done.
Because my wife got impatient getting stuff done on her car, even though the guy who worked on her car was referred, and well paid, her car ran hot and ran out of gas on the 35 minute ride home, because the car WAS NOT ready, so really, how much time did she save?!
So yes, trading my labor and the money that makes for someone else's labor and that means I have to pay them, but they are experienced, skilled, fair, and TRUST WORTHY, that is definitely the best choice sometimes to get the best outcome.

The PT Cruiser was professionally built by a race car shop in California, I stumbled on to it after the person that had it built had ran out of money or no longer supported the project. I don't know which. Anyway I satisfied the mechanics lean and became the owner. It had issues and I think the shop was milking this guy. One trip to the dyno and about $1500 in professional tuning and a few minor parts and I haven't had to touch it since. 35mph to 100mph in 2.5 seconds and I have to let off. Side by side I don't think the Hemi Dart stands a chance. It's a 6.1 Gen III Hemi bored and stroked to a 426. Your other questions. My main interest is in the 66-67 B bodies. I own a Superbird no Daytona. I also like 68 A bodies. I like my go fast stuff even though I have not been to a drag strip since 96. I also ran road courses and autocross from 94-04. I have never been a paid mechanic, bodyman, or fabricator. I worked for the other man 31 years before I became smart enough to know I didn't need to. You know it takes some people more time than others.

 

[66 Sat]

To those saying the Mecum V-code black Roadrunner was sold for more than you feel it is worth, and I'm not debating that, I will point out that the Hemi 69 Roadrunner 66 Sat posted the link to has a #s Hemi, but NOT the a833 4 speed.
Not only was the black V-code fully #s matching drivetrain, it was VERY low mileage and ONE owner, never sold until now! Some of those enticements just cannot be duplicated.

That may well be the case about the transmission - the advert is carefully worded to appear to suggest it's numbers matching but not actually saying it. Regardless, I thought the $175k hemi car was also pretty expensive. It's in super condition for sure, but those professionally photographed cars in the showroom type setting always look great. If it was my money I think I would pick up a 66/67 Satellite or Coronet hemi and pocket the $100k difference.

 

[super-bee_ski]

I agree - to an extent.
It's always been my opinion that we don't have the freedom to go crazy with any of the
rare "pedigree" cars out there, though. There's a responsibility, a stewardship that comes with
such cars - after all, if everyone went silly with them, there'd wind up being no examples of
what they were new - and hence, that whole special attraction, intrigue, magic they were.

If one wants to "do whatever they want", spiffy - sure, have at it...on a car that wasn't anything
special to begin with.
Just my opinion. That and $5 will get RC a cup of cheap java....

Gee Ed,
What gives?
that is exactly what "we" did back in the day....,
as some of the forum members posted: "my Car to do with as I please"
Yup, says a lot when "WE" find/see or hear about an untouched vehicle...all original.
As "they" played with the 1967 435 cars...many had replacement engines etc.
But presented them as "All Original"
My point is, truly not many have been left untouched as again, NOTHING was Rare back in the day.
I know you know that...
Just re-stating.
Heck, in many circles, a Vintage Race Car is restored back to it's Racing Glory...not as factory Original.
Poatao-Potatoe...depends on owner.
We start judging what he/she has done, the so called desecration of a car...we become the Car NAZI...
Let em' do what they wish...
Peace out.

 

[moparedtn]

Gee Ed,
What gives?
that is exactly what "we" did back in the day....,
as some of the forum members posted: "my Car to do with as I please"
Yup, says a lot when "WE" find/see or hear about an untouched vehicle...all original.
As "they" played with the 1967 435 cars...many had replacement engines etc.
But presented them as "All Original"
My point is, truly not many have been left untouched as again, NOTHING was Rare back in the day.
I know you know that...
Just re-stating.
Heck, in many circles, a Vintage Race Car is restored back to it's Racing Glory...not as factory Original.
Poatao-Potatoe...depends on owner.
We start judging what he/she has done, the so called desecration of a car...we become the Car NAZI...
Let em' do what they wish...
Peace out.

Pop quiz, hotshot:
What's different from back then and now?
I'll hang up and listen to your answer....love your show!

 

[barbee6043]

There is just something cool, interesting, intoxicating about a survivor... be it a '69 Hemi Roadrunner or '69 slant Belvedere. A car that has remained just as it came from the factory. What really made it all that different? An engine, a drive train, brakes, maybe some emblem. Some nmbers in a vin and fender tag. Both are cool to me.
It is cool to me that some people can afford a true and real and just like it was built by the factory Hemi RR and others can find that same Hemi RR in that survivor condition and preserve it.
But then it is cool to me the guy that can take a '69 Belvedere and build a '69 Hemi RR just exactly like it came from the factory and drive it just like 99% of them were driven and treated back then.
A lot of car things are cool to me. Guess I am just simple.
But then again, it is cool to me that my dad came home alive and in one piece after 4 years of WW11 and 1 of Korea in the USMC Air Corp. Dad was cool. Way to go Dad!
I know, I am an old soul. But real survivors are cool to me.

 

[super-bee_ski]

Pop quiz, hotshot:
What's different from back then and now?
I'll hang up and listen to your answer....love your show!

Hot shot?
Surely you are mistaken Ed...Shirley!
Hmmm,
Let me see if I can answer your question correctly and tactfully:
Perhaps that was (is) a bygone era?
What was hmm, relatively common then has become scarce now? (Rare)
Supply and demand?
And perhaps most important, "we covet what we used to have?"

Help me out a bit, as I must be missing the point....
Isn't this about the owner have the right to do what ever he/she wants to do to the car?
I am not sure anymore..
Back at ya!

 

[super-bee_ski]

There is just something cool, interesting, intoxicating about a survivor... be it a '69 Hemi Roadrunner or '69 slant Belvedere. A car that has remained just as it came from the factory. What really made it all that different? An engine, a drive train, brakes, maybe some emblem. Some nmbers in a vin and fender tag. Both are cool to me.
It is cool to me that some people can afford a true and real and just like it was built by the factory Hemi RR and others can find that same Hemi RR in that survivor condition and preserve it.
But then it is cool to me the guy that can take a '69 Belvedere and build a '69 Hemi RR just exactly like it came from the factory and drive it just like 99% of them were driven and treated back then.
A lot of car things are cool to me. Guess I am just simple.
But then again, it is cool to me that my dad came home alive and in one piece after 4 years of WW11 and 1 of Korea in the USMC Air Corp. Dad was cool. Way to go Dad!
I know, I am an old soul. But real survivors are cool to me.

Your Dad was a true American Hero!

 

[barbee6043]

I figure basically we "people" don't really own anything we are allowed to be the caretaker of, a piece of land, an animal, loved ones, old cars, whatever. We might have the right to will it or give it to someone in the end, but...
Maybe some objects, animals, or people deserve more care and consideration, but it is our own personal business how we choose to do so. IMHO

 

[66 Sat]

It's his car and he can do what he likes with it....however, as all these "special" models only differ from the lower base models by the different parts that were bolted/welded on during assembly, once those parts are removed (and sold off in this instance) the car reverts back to "just another Roadrunner, Charger etc" status in the eyes of most. The specialness and historical value is gone (again, in the eyes of most).

If the owner doesn't feel that way (and you can tell Biomed doesn't from his posts) then the above is all moot anyway.

Personally, I would have kept the V code Roadrunner mostly numbers matching (as it was bought), kept it if I could and bought a base model to do all the mods too, but that might not have been financially viable. If not I would have at least kept all the parts I took off, shoved them in the corner somewhere, just for the future.

 

[biomedtechguy]

Personally, I would have kept the V code Roadrunner mostly numbers matching (as it was bought)

There isn't a single piece of equipment that bears the VIN with the "V" that was on my car when I bought it that isn't on it now. The only parts of my car that had the VIN when I bought it are the VIN plate, the fender tag, the radiator support, and the rear trunk lip.
What "V-code" or 440 specific parts have been removed? The K-member with the skid plate and date coin, and I'm not keeping it because I'll never put it back on, and it doesn't bear the VIN. Even my radiator was the wrong year, but now it's a Cold Case, that is beautifully polished, and I can count on keeping my baby cool.
The Edelbrock aluminum intake bears no Chrysler part number or pentastar, and although it's a Track Pack car, I was just told in the last couple of weeks that the Dana 60 is a good bit older than 1970.
I know the subframe connectors and front and rear torque boxes will keep the rear quarters (one of which bears the VIN) from buckling when I mat the loud pedal and unleash near 700 HP and torque on the drivetrain, which also has a Strange chromoly driveshaft, slip yoke, pinion yoke, and 1350 U-joints, along with the properly installed (it was missing a stud and fastener nut at the 12 o'clock position) safety loop. That beefed up driveshaft and associated parts should keep the driveshaft from breaking and slicing through the original sheet metal, and from slicing through biomedtechguy too...
I definitely don't see how I am going to mourn the worn out leaf springs, and it sure will be nice to get a front end alignment that comes out perfect, something that hasn't been possible since I owned the car. Power steering and air conditioning are going to make taking her out during the brutal but car show and car event heavy summer months a LOT more enjoyable, so that means it gets seen by others a LOT more, and the story of what makes a V-Code 70 Roadrunner a very special example of the muscle car era gets told and passed along a lot more.
That open hood with some aftermarket "pretty" under it may also gain more attention, and how can someone whose attention is caught not see the 3x 2bbl Holley carbs, whether they are atop the aluminum Edelbrock dual plane or the aluminum Weiand CrossFlow 6bbl intake.
Once again, focusing on one the most memorable iconic features of ANY V-Code, the multiple carburetors.
So V-Code and A12 cars are known for legendary performance, that's true, and my respect is immeasurable for the guys who run F.A.S.T. racing style cars, but my skill level isn't near what theirs is, and I got tired of taking my car to the track with brakes that have been updated when I first got the car, and evaluated and had different parts replaced here and there by a couple of specialty shops, and every time I thought "This is it, they work great" only to have them get softer and the pedal get lower over the next few days or a couple of weeks. That's not going to be a problem because now EVERYTHING has been replaced in the braking system, even the lines, and not just some kind of "replacements" but 6 piston Wilwood disc brakes on all 4 corners. When was the first or last or ONLY time any of you saw 6 piston Wilwood calipers on ALL 4 corners of a 70 Roadrunner?
So now that I can count on it stopping, and steering, and nothing involving in making it GO breaking, the launch control, new split mono leaf springs, and traction aids will keep me from blowing the tires off every time I launch, without having to launch from an idle roll, which was producing crappy 60 ft times and the associated 1320 times that were consistently disappointing because I know the car is faster than I could drive it.
Now once I get it dialed in, and even the process of doing so, that all adds up to more trips to the drag strip, and that leads to more exposure, more stories of "V-Code" performance and unique characteristics, and a DAMN FINE looking ambassador for the B-Body nation (and my car is pretty nice looking too..lol)
So I see it all as a WIN, and I'm absolutely guilt free.
I wouldn't have done ANYTHING to that black Roadrunner that this thread was about, other than everything I could to keep it looking new, running great with all stock parts, and making it as correct and original as possible, but that is one V-Code that is WAY out of my budget, and other than appreciating it deeply for what it is, I'd be a nervous wreck with it on the road, in a parking lot or spot, I sure would have been reluctant to take it to the drag strip, and what kind of conversations would it start? "Nice Roadrunner man" "Oh, thanks, it's 100% factory original and correct." and then what?? Sure, what makes a V-Code special could have been the ensuing conversation, but the same goes for my car now. I'm sure I'd get the rare Mopar guy who would really be stoked by an original, correct car, but the stories and comments and conversations and hopefully new friends and acquaintances (and fan base) I may get with the "flashy/cool/racey" stuff I think will be a lot more people, and depending on what aspect of the changes I've made are the ones that garner the greatest interest of each individual, I think I'll ALWAYS have a good chance of chats with lots of people, and maybe even help them out making choices by sharing my experiences.

 

[Budnicks]

There isn't a single piece of equipment that bears the VIN with the "V" that was on my car when I bought it that isn't on it now. The only parts of my car that had the VIN when I bought it are the VIN plate, the fender tag, the radiator support, and the rear trunk lip.
What "V-code" or 440 specific parts have been removed? The K-member with the skid plate and date coin, and I'm not keeping it because I'll never put it back on, and it doesn't bear the VIN. Even my radiator was the wrong year, but now it's a Cold Case, that is beautifully polished, and I can count on keeping my baby cool.
The Edelbrock aluminum intake bears no Chrysler part number or pentastar, and although it's a Track Pack car, I was just told in the last couple of weeks that the Dana 60 is a good bit older than 1970.
I know the subframe connectors and front and rear torque boxes will keep the rear quarters (one of which bears the VIN) from buckling when I mat the loud pedal and unleash near 700 HP and torque on the drivetrain, which also has a Strange chromoly driveshaft, slip yoke, pinion yoke, and 1350 U-joints, along with the properly installed (it was missing a stud and fastener nut at the 12 o'clock position) safety loop. That beefed up driveshaft and associated parts should keep the driveshaft from breaking and slicing through the original sheet metal, and from slicing through biomedtechguy too...
I definitely don't see how I am going to mourn the worn out leaf springs, and it sure will be nice to get a front end alignment that comes out perfect, something that hasn't been possible since I owned the car. Power steering and air conditioning are going to make taking her out during the brutal but car show and car event heavy summer months a LOT more enjoyable, so that means it gets seen by others a LOT more, and the story of what makes a V-Code 70 Roadrunner a very special example of the muscle car era gets told and passed along a lot more.
That open hood with some aftermarket "pretty" under it may also gain more attention, and how can someone whose attention is caught not see the 3x 2bbl Holley carbs, whether they are atop the aluminum Edelbrock dual plane or the aluminum Weiand CrossFlow 6bbl intake.
Once again, focusing on one the most memorable iconic features of ANY V-Code, the multiple carburetors.
So V-Code and A12 cars are known for legendary performance, that's true, and my respect is immeasurable for the guys who run F.A.S.T. racing style cars, but my skill level isn't near what theirs is, and I got tired of taking my car to the track with brakes that have been updated when I first got the car, and evaluated and had different parts replaced here and there by a couple of specialty shops, and every time I thought "This is it, they work great" only to have them get softer and the pedal get lower over the next few days or a couple of weeks. That's not going to be a problem because now EVERYTHING has been replaced in the braking system, even the lines, and not just some kind of "replacements" but 6 piston Wilwood disc brakes on all 4 corners. When was the first or last or ONLY time any of you saw 6 piston Wilwood calipers on ALL 4 corners of a 70 Roadrunner?
So now that I can count on it stopping, and steering, and nothing involving in making it GO breaking, the launch control, new split mono leaf springs, and traction aids will keep me from blowing the tires off every time I launch, without having to launch from an idle roll, which was producing crappy 60 ft times and the associated 1320 times that were consistently disappointing because I know the car is faster than I could drive it.
Now once I get it dialed in, and even the process of doing so, that all adds up to more trips to the drag strip, and that leads to more exposure, more stories of "V-Code" performance and unique characteristics, and a DAMN FINE looking ambassador for the B-Body nation (and my car is pretty nice looking too..lol)
So I see it all as a WIN, and I'm absolutely guilt free.
I wouldn't have done ANYTHING to that black Roadrunner that this thread was about, other than everything I could to keep it looking new, running great with all stock parts, and making it as correct and original as possible, but that is one V-Code that is WAY out of my budget, and other than appreciating it deeply for what it is, I'd be a nervous wreck with it on the road, in a parking lot or spot, I sure would have been reluctant to take it to the drag strip, and what kind of conversations would it start? "Nice Roadrunner man" "Oh, thanks, it's 100% factory original and correct." and then what?? Sure, what makes a V-Code special could have been the ensuing conversation, but the same goes for my car now. I'm sure I'd get the rare Mopar guy who would really be stoked by an original, correct car, but the stories and comments and conversations and hopefully new friends and acquaintances (and fan base) I may get with the "flashy/cool/racey" stuff I think will be a lot more people, and depending on what aspect of the changes I've made are the ones that garner the greatest interest of each individual, I think I'll ALWAYS have a good chance of chats with lots of people, and maybe even help them out making choices by sharing my experiences.

Damn must be a long lost brother from another mother

Build your car with whatever parts you deem necessary
drive & use your car however you deem appropriate
drive your car like it was meant to be driven, hard & put away wet
it's your car, do as you see fit, it's your money, do with it what you will
who cares what anyone else thinks, they don't pay your build costs
(well in most cases, it isn't given to US)
they can do whatever they want with theirs

it's just a car, we are all just here for this ride a short time
we need to do the most with what we have & enjoy life
with what we have, not some way-out 'fantasy'
or later wish we did something else, we wanted when we had the chance
later in life & live to regret it

enjoy your car, your way, that's what it's all about

 

[super-bee_ski]

Damn must be a long lost brother from another mother

View attachment 998005

Build your car with whatever parts you deem necessary
drive & use your car however you deem appropriate
drive your car like it was meant to be driven, hard & put away wet
it's your car, do as you see fit, it's your money, do with it what you will
who cares what anyone else thinks, they don't pay your build costs
(well in most cases, it isn't given to US)
they can do whatever they want with theirs

it's just a car, we are all just here for this ride a short time
we need to do the most with what we have & enjoy life
with what we have, not some way-out 'fantasy'
or later wish we did something else, we wanted when we had the chance
later in life & live to regret it

enjoy your car, your way, that's what it's all about

Hmm,
Haven't I seen a Wall of Text before?

 

[biomedtechguy]

must be a long lost brother from another mother

Between the "Wall of Text" and the love of dogs in general, Labrador or Lab mix dogs in particular, more likely than not!

we are all just here for this ride a short time
we need to do the most with what we have & enjoy life

You hit the mark there Budnicks!
I said that the funds and the best prices and the vendors hungry for a sale were the reasons why my wife and I dropped $10K on parts and systems, but the REAL reason is that I've lost 3 friends in the last 3 years, so "next year" or "some day" got to be something that I've really started to see for what it is: not a promise.
I could go back and see when I started posting about wanting a stroker motor, but it came down to realizing that to have one, I had to get started on one, so I did.
All of the stuff I'm doing now either fits together, compliments each other, and if it had to be done now, may as well do it once in a way that would work for the stroker too. The traction aids, (including trying some taller sidewall tires soon ) and launch control are going to put more stress on the unibody, so now was a good time to add subframe connectors and torque boxes. The leaf springs had to be replaced, so Assassin traction bars, spring hanger reinforcement plates, and sliders made sense. Same for the Viking rear shocks. I've been to 2 years of Cruisin the Coast since I first had a problem with the UCAs giving me trouble, and this November would have been 2 years since I bought the QA1 K-member and front suspension (thanks again for helping me with that). So without writing another Wall of Text, what I quoted really is the truth. I don't know how many more Test and Tune nights I may have available, I got tired of fighting bad brakes and front suspension alignment, rear springs that were shot. It wasn't as much fun as frustrating to go to the track knowing I was fighting worn or substandard parts. Air Conditioning is going to make EVERY hot weather month on the calendar a lot more likely to see me and my Roadrunner out doing something instead of skipping because it's brutally hot. Hopefully the power steering will keep the Grim Reaper from showing up when I'm parallel parking at 2pm in July.

 

[cosgig]

I consider it to be an honor to own a survivor V code car, and tried to keep it as close as possible to the way it left the streets back in 1978. Being in touch with the original owner, I also get the firsthand story of why something is the way it is. As for “that’s the way we did it back in the day”, all I can say is that the original owner of my car did just that, he drove it, it was his daily driver, and never did anything to it that it didn’t need. It was all the car he could ask for and more, and other than the vintage Accel dual point he installed, nothing but service items were ever changed. Sure, it was a hot car, and his 13:9 time at the track was plenty good enough for him, and a class win. When I asked if he ever raced it, he said no, that was the only time, he couldn’t take the chance that he couldn’t get to work on Monday. I guess that’s the way it was really done back in the day!

 

[biomedtechguy]

I consider it to be an honor to own a survivor V code car, and tried to keep it as close as possible to the way it left the streets back in 1978.

Congratulations! That is a real sleeper V-Code. Auto or 4 speed? Still has the 4.10?
Matching numbers drivetrain?

his 13:9 time at the track was plenty good enough for him

My first trip or 2 to the track was 13.9s, but that's not a stock 440 6bbl under my hood. Then again, lots of what it is turned out to be worn out and detrimental to traction. I compensated by switching from BF Goodrich tires to Drag Radials, and power shifting got me into the mid 13s.
A new ignition system and some more practice had me in the 13.3s, but that's about all I could do, with all that was working against traction.

 

[cosgig]

Congratulations! That is a real sleeper V-Code. Auto or 4 speed? Still has the 4.10?
Matching numbers drivetrain?

this car is completely matching numbers, and is a TrakPak car so it has a 3:54. It’s a 4 speed, and currently has 72k miles. It has no options, the fender tag is blank except for the driveline specifics and the paint codes. This is just the way it was sitting on the lot, except it had whitewall tires. One thing I questioned, and he answered, was why it has a 383 call out in the rear area of the hood, that’s just the way it came, and no 440/6 stickers on the hood either. Even he assumed that it was a 383 car until the salesman opened the hood, and his quote was priceless...where do I sign”?

 

[kiwigtx]

Let's see...who could that be??
I'll get back to you on the "picking apart" classification...

Maybe me? And yet I still make it a point to put the phrase "real V-code" in some of my posts...because IT IS.
I'll get to that "won't even resemble what a V-code is" comment too.
You know, not only did I notice the all black, (triple black isn't accurate, since it doesn't have a vinyl or convertible top)
19,100 original miles, original drivetrain, one concours repaint in 2017 (I'm going to guess, just a guess, probably cost $15 grand, but surely could have been more, way more) one owner, drop dead gorgeous V-code Roadrunner, I re-scanned the Saturday Mecum auction after I watched it because in the preview of the car I saw, they said it was crossing the block Saturday, but nope! I didn't see it on the first nor second time I reviewed the auction.
I record ALL Mecum auctions, so I don't miss any, and I can skip the stuff I'm not interested in knowing anything about. I don't just watch for the cool cars I like, I watch to see what trends are happening and how buyers are responding to those trends. It's been interesting, watching the trends. Resto-Mods and some "Pro Street" style rides bring huge money, FAR more than even one owner, pristine, numbers matching, low mileage examples of the exact same car! Not always, but it's a noticeable trend. On the "Pro Street" side of that equation, they too may bring major coin, but not nearly as often as Resto-Mods, but they sure look cool and menacing, and the majority of them can back up the look with lightning fast track times.
Now, I am going to address Ed's comments.
The "picking apart" of my Roadrunner happened over the years from 1970 up to March 29th, 2014, the day I exchanged a check for my baby, my dream car, actually the "beyond my hopes" dream car, my real V-code 70 Roadrunner. I had seen it advertised for $58,000 or thereabouts, and I saw in the description it was a real V-code car, although the ad didn't say anything about it being numbers matching or not. I was pretty sure at that price it couldn't be numbers matching, but I knew it was a 440 6bbl 4 speed Dana 60 equipped car, my favorite color combo, BY FAR, and looked like it was in good shape, very nice looking driver.
None of that really mattered all that much, because at $58K it was about $16K-$18K OVER the price I was shopping at. All of that cool stuff, how beautiful the Lemon Twist and Black paint combo looked, the legendary Pistol Grip shifter, in this case the "boldest" Pistol Grip shifter made, w/no console and a bench seat, they are the longest/tallest kind, and REALLY stand out. Yeah, that oval air cleaner cover was sure nice, especially knowing that 1,350 CFM worth of Holley six barrel beauty and neck snapping performance was lurking underneath, and for me, the only thing missing from that picture was my all time favorite, bar NONE, fresh air setup, the N96 Air Grabber. The 15" Rallye wheels, so stylish and a little more tire capacity to improve performance compared to the Magnum 5 spoke 14" factory wheels like I had back in 1978 on my factory stock 71 Charger R/T. Yeah, I really liked those Rallye wheels, especially on this car.
All of that just made my despair worse, because there she was, SO FINE, and I had been looking for a few months, but as far as I knew when I found her, it was just going to be another beautiful car that checked off the boxes of what I had been generally looking for, and on top of that, she checked off boxes that I certainly knew about, but dare not put on MY "list" because cars like that were just out of my reach.
Still, ya never know, and I went ahead and called the dealership anyway.
I let them know I had been looking at 68-70 B-Body Dodge and Plymouth cars, and although I had started out looking for a Coronet Super Bee or R/T, I had opened up the search parameters to the same 68-70 year models Roadrunner and GTX cars, because my parents' 69 Roadrunner was the car (and the one year they owned it, the experiences I had riding in it, a couple "unforgettable") that made me forever a MOPAR Man, and my best friend had a bad *** 1970 Pistol Grip, warmed over 383 Roadrunner I had hooked him up with the owner of, and we had a lot of memories of that car from the late 70s, early 80s when we were heavily into the street cruising, street racing, and car club show lifestyle, for guys our age.
We were too far apart on their asking price and what I was looking for, but I left it at "I am definitely interested and I am definitely going to be buying a car like that soon, but I would keep on looking, but please see what you can do, because I REALLY loved the car they had for sale.
I continued looking in my search parameters, and over the next day or two found out that USAA, my bank certainly appreciated the value of that "V" in the VIN, because they really stepped up for me on the loan offer, and gave me some hope AND some "firepower" to negotiate with. Yes! Yes I was a prequalified buyer, so take me seriously because someone is going to earn my business. So I saw a car or two that I "liked" but once I saw that beautiful car I just didn't see "lesser" cars quite the same, and I was close...
Well beyond hope, they came down far enough for me to step up to the point where we made a deal. I did the paperwork with my bank, and they overnighted the check.
My wife had just got her dream car about a week earlier, and although her 1965 original 4bbl real GTO, that had been upgraded to a very well executed "Royal Bobcat Tribute" car with its 421 Tripower where the original 389 4bbl had sat at one time and the Hurst 4 speed didn't qualify for as big a loan as my Roadrunner did, it was beautiful, and her search that I had been helping with for some 5 or 6 years since a Mayfair Maze (light yellow) 65 Royal Bobcat 421 Tripower GTO 4 speed car had planted a seed in both our minds, a car that we missed out on, well this one was a rare color called Iris Mist, and while it wasn't yellow, it had the 421 Tripower and 3rd pedal, and the mystique of the whole "Royal Bobcat" legacy, and we were both happy that that long wait had ended...for her.
So that same best friend I had hooked up with his 70 383 4 speed Roadrunner way back around 1979 jumped in for the "turn and burn" driving marathon that was going to be challenging, leaving late Friday and towing his car trailer all the way from south Louisiana up to Missouri, do a quick in person checkout of my Roadrunner, swap the check that my bank had printed out the agreed upon price for, load her up and make it back, and back to the grind Monday morning.
I was giddy when we rolled up on Fast Lane Classic Cars dealership, and the visual impact was damn near overwhelming! So many beautiful classic muscle cars, including some of those really special ones, LS-6 Corvette, real Shelby Cobra cars, just too many to list. I looked around a bit and there was MY car, and with the rear facing a concrete bulkhead, when we fired it up and the Purple Stripe 292°/.509 cam conducted the symphony of internal combustion through a full 3" exhaust system, only somewhat restrained by Flowmaster 40 series mufflers, but bouncing off that bulkhead which served to amplify that wonderful sound, MAN was I happy!
Then I started the close up inspection. The exterior paint and stripes were beautiful, but the trunk floor looked a little heavy with body filler, and a chunk of it had cracked, and when I gave that edge a little tug, I wound up with a chunk of yellow painted body filler in my hand, the actual trunk floor surface revealed. Rusty? Sure, but fortunately not perforated, but that really cranked up my senses, because now I saw that I was going to have to look more than just skin deep.
Hey Ed, I guess that was the first thing I "picked apart" on my car, but it certainly wouldn't be the last.
I got in and sat behind the wheel on the driver's side of what seemed like a couch. The factory bench seat, which was in great condition, just a little ambiguous as to where my butt and body belonged, because it was a BENCH seat after all, not nearly as secure feeling as a bucket seat, but hey, enough of that, time to fire up that 440 6bbl and hit the road with the sales rep in the back seat and my best friend on the other side of "the couch".
I turned the key, but the key cylinder was sloppy and "sticky" and although it fired right up, I could hear the starter spinning and realized the sticky key cylinder hadn't rotated back into its proper "run" position.
Hmm..add that to the list that "trunk rust abatement" had started.
Head out on the road, the shifter, while super cool, sure was sloppy, and the steering wheel pulled to the right, and applying the brakes made that pull a LOT worse. Well, that may be those outdated drum brakes, so I had plans of putting disc brakes up front anyway, so add that to the now ever growing list. It ran ok, no noticeable problems, but I didn't know just what to expect and not having piloted any old school big block cars for decades, other than the GTO when we picked up my wife's car about a week earlier, and the 87 octane piss fuel that dealer put in all their cars along with what I would come to find was a really bad combination of way too far advanced timing and the static high compression of a performance 65 421. That test drive revealed a very unhappy 421 and the possibility of the need to do an engine rebuild in the future, and that led to me demanding an additional discount off our previously agreed upon price.
So after a test drive in the Roadrunner that was "ok" and the problems that kept popping up, I did a careful walk around and saw the grill and passenger side of the front of the fender weren't lined up quite as cleanly as the other side, and the headlight was out of alignment. I had them work on that before I left. I also had them put the driver's side roll up window back on the track, because that whole time I was driving it it was resting on the bottom of the door. I had found enough problems just like on the GTO, and although they were of a different nature, I was still concerned enough that if they didn't cut about 1,400 off I was going to come home with my check and leave the car behind. I was actually pissed that them knowing I was coming there to close the deal we had made, they didn't bother to check the window was on track.
So that was the beginning of what I would find over the course of me working on my car, over the 6 years I've had her, that there had been I don't know how many people "picking it apart" for one reason or another, including some track time I'm sure, but they used "whatever fit" in the process, to where there were bolts and nuts of all different kinds all over the place, and I was going to at least try to use the same kinds of nuts and bolts to replace the grab bag of crap that had been put on this car over the 44 years of her life before we met.
You see, when I was driving my Roadrunner on the test drive, and the unexpected problems list was getting longer and longer, problems that I wasn't expecting and certainly wasn't going to be able to get them to fully compensate me for in the form of a discount big enough to cover getting ALL of that stuff fixed, I decided that this ol' girl truly is something VERY special, and definitely was a real V-code car, and that she had had kind of a rough life in some ways, mainly not caring about the quality or attention to detail that such an awesome car deserved, but I was blessed to have been able to make a deal on what is a true benchmark of old school muscle, the renowned "V-code 6 pack" of legend and lore, and although she had lost the original warrior spirit that was under the hood, the replacement mill was good enough to work with, and that "V" would always be present in the VIN, and that I was going to take her home with me, and anytime I could afford to fix, repair, replace, bring order to chaos, polish, clean, or upgrade the package I was committing myself to that I would, and give her a good home where she will be loved and respected.
So that is exactly what I have done! As the opportunity to replace a mixed bag of nuts and bolts with the same kind of high quality hardware all doing the same job has presented itself, that is what you will find. Are all of the nuts and bolts and clips "correct"? For the most part, no, they are not factory original correct parts, but they are nice looking, strong, and if they do the same task, they are at least ALL THE SAME. The bad front drum brakes were replaced w/Dr. Diff disc conversion brakes, drilled and slotted in keeping my promise to my baby that I was going to do the BEST I could when I could, to make her look and perform better, stronger, and look beautiful doing it, and increasing her value to ME as I go along, that value being increasing the JOY I GET from the responsibility of ownership. I found another reason why it pulled right, and bought a used stock lower control arm for the passenger side, replacing the bent LCA that I discovered.
I got those outboard carbs opening properly, and I was rewarded with that unique RUSH of power that the legendary 6bbl brings in a way that only "the 6bbl guys" know
I replaced worn valve springs and lifters, and while I was at it, replaced the pushrods, locks, and retainers. She rewarded me with an INCREDIBLE amount of power that had been missing beyond the artificial wall that she used to hit, hit because of worn parts no one else bothered to look at.
Even though I brought her to experienced highly regarded front suspension technicians, they never could get her alignment perfect, and in keeping with my promise, perfection is what I demand. It's not because of any kind of damage and the frame is certainly straight and in great shape, as is the K-member, but it's the limited adjustments available with the cams on the UCAs. I have had 2 brand new sets of front tires wear down to the belts, but only about 1/4 of the tread width, because of a failure of the nut that holds one of the factory UCAs in adjustment and in place. I found out that there are offset bushings that can take care of that, but much much better designed suspension components have been engineered and developed since then, and I am keeping my promise to give my baby the BEST that I can. So QA1 and SPC now take care of ALL of my front suspension duties, with new materials and technology that make the driving experience FAR BETTER than even new cars had back in the day. Viking shocks front and rear that give her some of the best in the business, and give me the performance I want at the track and a nice ride on the street. I still have my non #s matching a833 18 spline 4 speed, but now she has a Passon Performance a855 5 speed, that when you get one the way they all should be-an amazing combination of top notch, highest quality materials parts and engineering that makes this fantastic 5 speed fit right where the original transmission fits, WITHOUT CUTTING UP any part of the precious "V-code" sheetmetal. I'm not sacrificing performance for the "honor" of keeping the transmission tunnel intact, but I sure as heck have sacrificed a LOT OF MONEY to keep it and the very important transmission crossmember intact too.
I've never had brakes that no matter how I tried, or Cass tried, work quite like I wanted them to, but the Wilwood system on my wife's GTO has been outstanding, and now, I can say my car is likely going to be the ONLY one, or certainly one of a very few, B-Body Mopars with 6 piston Wilwood disc brake calipers on ALL 4 corners, because what woman doesn't like fancy shoes, and I promised her the best after all...
Promax modded Holley carbs take the major progress that I've made over the years tuning my 6bbl to be a FINE example vs the terrifying nightmare of what a 6 pack could be to the highest level of performance and reliability now, and make it easier to get the ultimate performance I am going to need and demand for when I put them on the Bill Mitchell aluminum block I have in the works, again a MAJOR investment to buy the best, not something that will be on the edge of survival in a few seasons or years, but something that is so strong, so exceptionally well designed and produced, that it will be reliable and powerful, more powerful than "average" high performance builds, and although it's likely to have my old school Super Stock Weiand CrossFlow 6bbl intake atop its 541 cubic inches, my V-code Roadrunner is ALWAYS, ALWAYS going to have 3x2 of "something" atop it, feeding her fuel and air, copious amounts of it, BECAUSE THAT IS ONE OF THE MOST ICONIC IMAGES of what a "V-code car is. I already had my VHX gauges from Dakota Digital for almost 3 years, and I was so excited to finally be able to get it installed, but damn Dakota Digital, they just HAD TO come out with their RETRO RTX series gauge system, that looks just like the original factory Rally gauges, including the "revered Tic-Toc Tach" that my car didn't have, but now that I've spent DOUBLE the cost of the VHX series I would have been happy with, now I can have a dash and gauges that sure look like the BEST ever factory dash and gauges, but it WORKS far, far better than any 1970 factory dash worked.
All of these parts and power increasing performance improvements would be useless without traction, so I replaced my worn out leaf springs with....
Split mono Calvert leaf springs!! That happened in a thread where some experienced forum members talked me down off the ledge I had been standing on for a year, "certain" I was going "to jump" into a RMS or Gerst triangulated 4 link rear suspension, but in the interests of preserving the integrity of that critical area of my car, and being assured by many members that I would have all of the performance capabilities I could ever use, and it may be even better because of ease of adjustability, I abandoned the 4 link. Now I did add Assassin traction bars, because once again, I have to have traction or the biggest part of that kind of fun I have with my car, that I've always wanted, that is expected of a muscle car, is get up and go, not sit still and smoke.
So "resembling a V-Code"?
It is more of what the heart and soul of a V-Code is now than it was when I rescued it. It no longer stutters or fails to open the outboards and ROAR. It steers and stops, FAR BETTER than it EVER did. The power it puts out now can be put to use, so when someone is expecting "legendary six pack" performance, I'm going to show them what that looks like, turned up to ELEVEN!
Oh, and it offers comfort no factory V-code ever did because it has Vintage Air AC, and that's really nice when you live in the swampy south like I do. Last but not least, while I'm keeping cool, the Wraptor serpentine belt and accessories system and Cold Case radiator is going to keep her cool and I'll enjoy parallel parking in July at 2pm with my Borgeson power steering, and that cool, dry Vintage Air!

Man that is quite the story....

That RR is going to be so badass when you're finished....I need a ride in it one day.

 

[kiwigtx]

A new ignition system and some more practice had me in the 13.3s, but that's about all I could do, with all that was working against traction.

That's what I ran in my GTX with the 6BBL and 4-speed back in 1999. 13.3 @107mph. A small amount of giggle juice in the tank, and a set of Hoosier stickies.....fast foot work, and no power shifting. Possibly could have squeaked a bit more that day ....nice crisp air and low humidity.