73' Charger will not start

[Tim L Stockwell]

I have replaced the wiring harness. I have a dual ballast resistor that checked out fine on both high an low side. I have verified that the distributor is in time and points to #1 on the distributor when cylinder 1 is in the compression stroke. I tested the coil resistance for the primary and secondary and it checks out. The car is getting fuel since I have been spraying starting fluid down the carb. I have tested the reluctor and I get a spark from the coil that jumps over 1/2 while the engine cranks". Since I get spark, I assume the 5 wire ECU is good.
I have also bypassed the ignition switch to the coil side of the ballast to insure 12V to the coil. I have verified the firing order and someone said It may be 180 out of time, but after testing this, I get a back fire up the carb.
I also noticed that the vacuum advance was bad on the distributor, so I replaced it.
Thinking that the battery was marginal, I jumped the battery with my 2001 Dodge 3/4 ton that has a Cummins and dual batteries.

All without success.

I have two hunches and would love your feedback.
1. Since I do not have a coil tester, could this still be the problem?
2. I acquired this project as a basket case and wonder if the timing chain could be out of alignment. Is there a easy way to check this without tearing down the front end of the engine?

Please help!!!! I am running out of ideas.

Tim

 

[Lefty71]

Two things... Did you pull an actual spark plug and verify a fat spark there?? Also, I imagine any car that doesn't fire right up is going to be prone to flooding at these temps outside, and I know Mopars can fall victim when everything not just so-so. That being said, have you tried holding the gas pedal to the floor and cranking with a jump for 20 seconds or so?? If so, did you get any different result? Or does it just not fire?

 

[Blackbee603]

I have replaced the wiring harness. I have a dual ballast resistor that checked out fine on both high an low side. I have verified that the distributor is in time and points to #1 on the distributor when cylinder 1 is in the compression stroke. I tested the coil resistance for the primary and secondary and it checks out. The car is getting fuel since I have been spraying starting fluid down the carb. I have tested the reluctor and I get a spark from the coil that jumps over 1/2 while the engine cranks". Since I get spark, I assume the 5 wire ECU is good.
I have also bypassed the ignition switch to the coil side of the ballast to insure 12V to the coil. I have verified the firing order and someone said It may be 180 out of time, but after testing this, I get a back fire up the carb.
I also noticed that the vacuum advance was bad on the distributor, so I replaced it.
Thinking that the battery was marginal, I jumped the battery with my 2001 Dodge 3/4 ton that has a Cummins and dual batteries.

All without success.

I have two hunches and would love your feedback.
1. Since I do not have a coil tester, could this still be the problem?
2. I acquired this project as a basket case and wonder if the timing chain could be out of alignment. Is there a easy way to check this without tearing down the front end of the engine?

Please help!!!! I am running out of ideas.

Tim

FIRST pull all plugs and clean, squirt some oil down all cylinders so you know they are not "gas washed" which will lower compression enough for a no start. Turn engine over a bunch for times over a couple minuits to work in oil. verify spark first by a tester or putting in a screwdriver in the boot, holding the boot and handle close to engine block/good ground, then turn the car over and checking for spark .Replace all plugs but for #1 spark plug, insert your/ a finger in the hole, Click the key to turn over engine until your/ who's ever finger is blown out by the compression. verify that the timing mark is on/close to zero on the balancer,then verify the rotor is pointing at /close to number one spark plug wire. If good THEN put timing mark on 12* BTDC and put the rotor DEAD NUTS on #1 spark plug wire and try.

 

[Tim L Stockwell]

Two things... Did you pull an actual spark plug and verify a fat spark there?? Also, I imagine any car that doesn't fire right up is going to be prone to flooding at these temps outside, and I know Mopars can fall victim when everything not just so-so. That being said, have you tried holding the gas pedal to the floor and cranking with a jump for 20 seconds or so?? If so, did you get any different result? Or does it just not fire?

Thanks for replying Lefty,
The car is in a semi conditioned barn I converted into a shop. Temps do not get below 60. I do not have the gas line connected since I need to fabricate one. Therefore, I just spray starting fluid into the carb that I just rebuilt or pour a little gas into it. You point about a FAT spark is my hunch as well. I just got back from the parts store with a new coil, cap and rotor.

 

[Ironbuilt]

@Blackbee603 nailed it. Sounds like you flooded the engine. Also, keep the ether for the diesels. Not necessary in your Mopar if you follow the steps listed by Blackbee603. All ether will do is cause unnecessary damage.

 

[400sforever]

I'm betting the timing chain has jumped and you never will get it going until that is fixed. I don't want to be a buzzkill but I've got a basket case 74 charger doing the exact same thing and that's the issue. That will be my guess! Keep us posted!

 

[moparisbest]

Make damb sure the ecu is grounded good my 73 would show spark . But was week. Pull ecu off sand and put back on . I ended up put bolt with nut to keep tight and grounded.

 

[Tim L Stockwell]

FIRST pull all plugs and clean, squirt some oil down all cylinders so you know they are not "gas washed" which will lower compression enough for a no start. Turn engine over a bunch for times over a couple minuits to work in oil. verify spark first by a tester or putting in a screwdriver in the boot, holding the boot and handle close to engine block/good ground, then turn the car over and checking for spark .Replace all plugs but for #1 spark plug, insert your/ a finger in the hole, Click the key to turn over engine until your/ who's ever finger is blown out by the compression. verify that the timing mark is on/close to zero on the balancer,then verify the rotor is pointing at /close to number one spark plug wire. If good THEN put timing mark on 12* BTDC and put the rotor DEAD NUTS on #1 spark plug wire and try.

Thank you Blackbee for your reply.
I do plan to pull all the plugs and do a compression test. I have a feeling that some of the valves may be bent do to a dump *** installing the timing chain wrong. Oil in the cylinders is a good idea. Getting the engine to what I think is TDC is simple and I have done it several times. I need to test for the compression at other cylinders other than #1 with a compression gauge.... Mine just failed.. go figure. It sat in a drawer for decades while I dealt with other things in live.
A comment about the balancer...It has 4 notches on it and so I can only assume that on the #1 compression stroke the closest one is the correct one. I have never seen this before. One last thing. I know the spark is good. I just replaced the coil with a new one.
Tim

 

[Tim L Stockwell]

Make damb sure the ecu is grounded good my 73 would show spark . But was week. Pull ecu off sand and put back on . I ended up put bolt with nut to keep tight and grounded.

I did all you say...Still no results.

 

[Tim L Stockwell]

I'm betting the timing chain has jumped and you never will get it going until that is fixed. I don't want to be a buzzkill but I've got a basket case 74 charger doing the exact same thing and that's the issue. That will be my guess! Keep us posted!

Wow!... I know this is more work, but it is good to hear other cases of it. I want to do a compression test yet. It may not tell me much, but it tried to this tonight, but my compression tester gave it up. go figure, it sat in my tool box for decades. Do you think the compression test will make sense if the timing has jumped?

Tim

 

[400sforever]

I'm not sure about the compression test as far as the timing chain goes. If the chain has jumped your valves would be opening/closing at the wrong times obviously

 

[Tim L Stockwell]

Classic sign distributor is 180 out.
Gonna get a little messy here. IF you want to keep #1 plug wire located, where you have it on the cap, rotor pointing towards #1 cylinder, need to do this...

If you simply loosened the distributor, and turned the rotor 180 degrees, rotor would point opposite where it is.

BB or SB? Pull the distributor completely out. BB has a flat tang at the end of the distributor shaft. It fits into a slot, in the drive gear. That drive gear works off the cam, and drives both the oil pump, and distributor. Lift the drive gear enough, so it can be rotated 180 degrees, keeping the slot in the same direction, but opposite.
Then drop the distributor back in, set timing, and see if it starts.

once I did what you recommended by putting the distributor 180 degrees from where it was it back fires up the carb, so that is not it.

 

[Tim L Stockwell]

Make damb sure the ecu is grounded good my 73 would show spark . But was week. Pull ecu off sand and put back on . I ended up put bolt with nut to keep tight and grounded.

It is.

 

[Lefty71]

I back fires up the carb

Progress!!
That's sounding more like a distributor 180 out. I think if you follow BlackBee603's instructions carefully, it's going to fire up for you. I would try and verify top dead center on #1, and then have another look at your damper to be sure of the timing mark. It sounds like you may have a slipping outer ring there, adding to the confooshun. HTH, lefty71

 

[Blackbee603]

It is.

Good morning! any luck?

 

[Tim L Stockwell]

Well good news. Yesterday after going thru the steps laid out by Blackbee, I found the compression tripled! It went from the 40s up to 120s. For each test, I looked at the grounded spark plug to see if the spark occurred at each compression stroke and for all cylinders it was confirmed. Getting number 7 plug out was quiet the pain and I expressed some choice explicates! I got all the plugs cleaned, adjusted and back in the engine last night and decided to call it a day. Today I plan to try and fire it up. Wish me luck. Tim

 

[Tim L Stockwell]

Good morning! any luck?

Yes and thank you for your help! I just replied with a long explanation in this thread.

 

[mopar 3 B]

Classic sign distributor is 180 out.
Gonna get a little messy here. IF you want to keep #1 plug wire located, where you have it on the cap, rotor pointing towards #1 cylinder, need to do this...

If you simply loosened the distributor, and turned the rotor 180 degrees, rotor would point opposite where it is.

BB or SB? Pull the distributor completely out. BB has a flat tang at the end of the distributor shaft. It fits into a slot, in the drive gear. That drive gear works off the cam, and drives both the oil pump, and distributor. Lift the drive gear enough, so it can be rotated 180 degrees, keeping the slot in the same direction, but opposite.
Then drop the distributor back in, set timing, and see if it starts.

What the heck was that with the gear? Lift the distributor and turn the rotor 180 and put it back.

 

[Blackbee603]

Yes and thank you for your help! I just replied with a long explanation in this thread.

Your very welcome,I just read it .I know its a long process but, it just assures your not missing anything. good luck!!

 

[Tim L Stockwell]

Your very welcome,I just read it .I know its a long process but, it just assures your not missing anything. good luck!!

I have bad news. I tried to start the car with no luck. I had help from a neighbor who used to be a mechanic in the 70s-80s the same time I was a mechanic working for my Dad's business. I also got a new coil just to be sure I was getting a hot spark. We cranked the engine with a timing light to verify TDC (or a little advanced) was showing itself on the damper. At first it sounded like it wanted to fire, but soon we got nothing. After multiple attempts, I pulled a spark plug and found we flood the engine again. How much vacuum pull should I get during cranking? I put my gage on an intake manifold port and got nothing. Now there are two old guys scratching our heads of what could be wrong. I also think it may still have jumped time, but that would not explain the good compression test I got. Any ideas would be appreciated.