Can a Clutch Car be Competitive in Bracket?

[padam]

Doesn't even compare to the Centerforce dual friction for street / strip.

By that do you mean the center force is better?

 

[BanginGears]

By that do you mean the center force is better?

.no

 

[padam]

I think it’s standard equipment!

Unfortunately, with a cigar I would look more like Boss Hog than Dick or Grumpy.

 

[biomedtechguy]

Needs more cowbell.

NEVER ENOUGH COWBELL!!

 

[Jeremiah]

The winner of 2021 pro AND super pto at our local track races a low 10 second 66 Mustang with a dr4 4-speed. Facts can be a bastard when you make your opinion of of thin air lol. Stick cars are competitive in all forms of racing.

 

[33 IMP]

The winner of 2021 pro AND super pto at our local track races a low 10 second 66 Mustang with a dr4 4-speed. Facts can be a bastard when you make your opinion of of thin air lol. Stick cars are competitive in all forms of racing.

So, one very talented driver wins a LOCAL track championship. What about the thousands of local track championships won by automatic cars? I wouldn't consider one of a thousand, competitive.....

 

[biomedtechguy]

I revived this old thread with the "cowbell" video, after doing a search for "Jericho" and "G Force"
I contacted Jamie Passon today about my intent to use my Passon 855 behind the Bill Mitchell aluminum RB block 572 I'm having built. Power goal is a wide 700 ft lbs torque. HitMaster clutch hit controller should help. 4.10 gears, McLeod RXT dual disc clutch system.
If the 855 gets torn up, then I will be looking for a 5 speed w/OD 5th gear that I won't have to worry about breaking.

 

[440rb]

Don't know any stick cars that run brkts over here at all and its all brkts or index apart from pro. But there's no reason they couldn't, this guy could certainly get somewhere>

 

[biomedtechguy]

I watched the interior video a few times and it looks like he grabs 2nd gear with the wheels still up! Very close, had to watch the 1-2 shift, or listen for it while I watched the car's relative height, but it didn't come down because of the shift to 2nd, that's for sure.
EDIT: In the 2nd video, he definitely grabs 2nd with the wheels still up in the air!
Wow, just WOW!
FWIW, I think I'm only going to be interested in beating a few people, mostly guys I know or those I run across that either I or they or both of us want to have it out. I've done the bracket racing thing for fun, and for me, it's too competitive for me to dedicate the time and effort to compete.
Test and Tune, YES, and hopefully LOTS of it. I enjoy that, my friends go, a number of them have cars and run them. I will probably pick up some "grudge" races just from that.
The one guy I know I'd like to be competitive with, if I can be, is running 9.5s at 139 in his supercharged LS Vette. It's going to take some time for me to get a handle on the power of the 572, but it's being ring gapped for a 350 HP shot of N2O and the rest of the engine parts are definitely up to the task.
If I'm too far off the mark, or have to tear up my car to do it, it's not worth it.
I want it to look great, and I want to have fun, more than anything else.
Being able to smoke the tires on the street from a slow roll then lift, yeah, that's fun, and quite the "hit" at Cruisin the Coast.

 

[33 IMP]

I will readily agree, there are THOUSANDS of VERY talented stick shift drivers out there, lots of them in stock and superstock stickshift classes. And it is a lot of fun to drag race a stickshift car!
...... but it is NOT the way to win bracket races.

 

[ykf7b0]

I love the cool factor of shifting gears but I don't know of anyone who can out shift an automatic using a 4 speed. I really love 4 and 5 speed manual transmissions and they are my choice for my daily drivers. My wife loves her 6 speed manual as well.

 

[33 IMP]

Wille's car is FAST, AWESOME, FUN!




But at a big dollar bracket race there will be a hundred big block Chevy dragsters LINED UP to race him, that have a whole package less than half of his .060 light. NOT putting him down, AT ALL, its a wonderful car, but a competitive bracket racer, well.......

 

[RemCharger]

If showing up for first round means competitive, then yes.

 

[440rb]

Yep, 2 step at 3k, 5500stall or a brake is hard to beat in a door car with .00 lights with a stick. Here's just 1 more bit of fun though

 

[haywire 440]

As a friend of mine asked, at a drag strip event, years ago to a rather large fellow in one of them there automatic shifted hot rods as he prepped his 4-speed, Omaha Orange ‘69 Super Bee for a run….”Exactly what size dress do you wear?”.

 

[padam]

I never could get in a groove last year, since I kept breaking stuff and I had some other commitments.

I think as long as I race this Charger it will be a four speed. I made some upgrades this winter that should help with reliability.

If I ever buy another race car I would probably get an automatic. But I don't really think I would be better at it than all the other guys doing it.

 

[Budnicks]

All of the "fast 4 speed guys" that have any power to speak of
all of them have far from stock trans,
very highly modified & not cheap OE equipment too
I garrendamntee it

I love a manual as much as the next guy
all my real races cars had a clutch peddle,
none were any 833/855 Mopar trans, or M22 or T10 etc.
either Jeffco or Lenco
now Liberty

just because a few can do it well,
all of them "all" that have highly modified trans
& high dollar clutches or some "tamer" hydraulic clutch/throughout bearing
to slow the clutch down or like a Crower slipper clutch
sorry but,
almost nobody on here has that kind of power to use that
with 1 or possibly 2 exceptions I can think of...

even then if the man. tranny isn't designed for it,
even when it is, it will not last
It will break, sooner or later, garrendamntee'd

it's just simple history & logic
been there done that, don't repeat old mistakes

nobody is putting down a manual car
it's just common sense & common knowledge
It's;
just far easier on parts, far more consistent,
with very, very few 'REAL' exceptions
& especially at the track, to have & to use an
Automatic set up properly
with a good torque converter,
'properly matched' to gears, cam shifting points, tires/type & size etc.
& with a Transbrake especially (or even foot brake'd) neither are cheap either

almost;
anyone can/will be
far more consistent too
that's what bracket racing is all about,
constantly running 'the #'

nobody not Ronnie Sox or Dick Landy even (RIP)
can shift a manual trans as fast as or consistently as
a good manual valve-body Auto
period, end of story

 

[biomedtechguy]

Yep, 2 step at 3k, 5500stall or a brake is hard to beat in a door car with .00 lights with a stick. Here's just 1 more bit of fun though

Man! That was INCREDIBLE!!

 

[65Fury440]

It really is a struggle to get the 1-2 shift done without hitting the rev limiter this year with the new engine. It comes fast and hard. Throw a little tire slip in, and every shift time changes.

We went to our local 1/8 miles to try getting the rear bars and shocks dialed in on the new tires. Only got three runs in and an S-10 wadded up at the top end, shut it down for the night.

So far consistent is not the word that comes to mind for my stick shift experience. Going to take time. A 500 hp car is easy to get down the track compared to a 700 hp car.

 

[dvw]

Maybe I am overthinking things.
My last couple times out my timing started to come back.
Last Sunday l cut
.463 red, .522, .508, .606 (tried to ease off), .553, .590 (opponent red).

So I think if I make some improvements, I can be consistent around . 520- .540.

But you are talking some of the best racers in the world, In very scienced-out full-on race cars in stock eliminator, not brackets. (Yes, I realize stock/superstock is just very expensive bracket racing.) Your exceptions prove the rule. The VERY BEST are competitive, the average has no chance. If stick shifts were the way to go, why are 99 out of a hundred bracket cars automatics?
[/QUOTE]

My very biased opinion, hard core bracket racing displayed much tighter work at the tree than the NHRA legal classes. The class cars were more expensive & drivers tended not to make nearly as many runs as a regular bracket racer.
[/QUOTE]

Lets talk weekend bracket racing. If you can be consistent .020-.040 you are going to win a fair share of rounds. If the car runs the number. However staying that good over a period of time is easier said than done. Doesn't matter if it's stick, trans brake, foot brake. But watch the rounds. Same group is usually there in the end with a few exceptions. Go to a Monster Mopar event. I bet I could name more than half the racers that will make the 1/4 finals. As far as big dollar brackets you are talking the worlds best. Cars and the drivers. And many of these would be NHRA Stock, S/S racers. Many of these racers have won Big Dollar bracket races. Part of the equation is the car. Some is the driver. Another factor is running a race with no time trial over a 3 day period. How good can you dial? Has the track changed? Big difference in getting a few time slots in the AM before the race. A good stick or foot brake racer is better over the long haul than an average trans brake racer. Obliviously removing any variable makes it easier. But it doesn't mean you'll be good.
Doug