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Get brighter headlights

Photon440 said:
I didn't know that my car had a relay, I thought the headlight switch handled the full load. My 1970 Plymouth shop manual doesn't show me a relay, except in the case of Fury with headlamp delay.
Click to expand...
Well, 747Mopar posted this..... "OEM wiring goes threw the headlight switch and dimmer switch feeding the headlights directly. This means minimal wire size, multiple connections, contacts that have to deliver the full amp draw and added wire length. The relays make it where the switches have a very minimal draw (longer life) and give you a more direct voltage without all the possibilities for voltage drop." So looks like I was wrong.

Crackedback said:
No relay. There is a breaker in the switch. Maybe that's what he meant.
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I knew about the breaker....all these years and I'm still learning lol

Another problem I have with wiring is I'm shade blind and as the wiring gets older (especially under the hood) and the colors fade, I have even more of a problem. Before LED traffic lights, there were some that were either really dirty or faded and I had trouble knowing what color the light was and had to pay attention to what light was actually on. Years ago a very small city close by had a horizontal light with the green and red reversed until they got hit with a nasty lawsuit because someone mistook the green for red. Someone got hurt real bad and another person died. There's a law that governs which side the green is on....and they were using it as a money maker. Shame on them.....
 
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Photon440 said:
I didn't know that my car had a relay, I thought the headlight switch handled the full load. My 1970 Plymouth shop manual doesn't show me a relay, except in the case of Fury with headlamp delay.
Click to expand...
I didn`t read all these posts. I rewired my car, no relays, no problem.
 
Crackedback said:
Ron,

The issues lie in the the charging system design. Not Mopars best effort. I make 6 and 8 gauge wire around wires and other products for the cars.

The more load you can effectively remove from the bulkhead connectors, the better. I'm not a fan of ammeters. Many love them. Ammeters must be OK, mopar put them in the cars... not me! There are other, MUCH safer, ways to monitor the charging system.

Rob
Click to expand...
I have learned much on the BH ills and mine shows some of that from overheating due to the amm gauge now disconnected after new harness installed. Another member (another post) gave advice on bypassing the BH to wire the gauge and have to re-study that as I'm still not certain on all the connections. Headlight relays are new to me as being discussed on this post!
 
Crackedback said:
No sweat... All good. I know that electrical scares the dickens out of people. I'm bombarded from friends when they are doing their cars with how to do this or that. Much like doing work around the house. There are some things that I'd prefer to pay someone else to do (Plumbing). Even though I'm capable of performing the work. If someone charges me $100 for something that will take me 5+ hours to do... have at it. Much like this stuff. A friend wanted to build a kit for his car, I let him have at it with my tools. It took him a little over 3 hours to build it, not including installation. He asked me how long it would have taken me... "Not that long!" :) Most installs from start to finish are under 1.5 hours and some are as quick as 30 minutes. Time is money to some folks.

I suggest that if people want to buy the 35-60 kits that are built in china, they best take it completely apart and re-crimp everything. Also carry spare relays!!! I've had people send me the chinese kits and replace it with my product. Most of the other kits have one fuse or breaker. What happens when that pops... it goes DARK and you have no power even trying to swap low to high. I build redundancy into my system. If low beams go out, you can kick over to high beam and get stopped, provided the light itself isn't damaged.

I can buy those chinese kits for under $7 landed on my doorstep, place them in a shipping box and make $35-55. I choose to build a MUCH better product. I do sell all the parts to build a kit sans, or with wire.

I have a nice database of wire lengths for our mopars and it's as close to plug and play as you can get. I've even simplified it further from the kits I first started building. Tell me where you want the relays, I can usually get the wires to the correct lengths for a stealthy fit. No GM style loom on my stuff and it hides well in the factory clips/wire runs. My instructions are very detailed, unlike some of the other setups I've seen.

I'm not the most expensive, nor am I the least expensive. Some of the other products that are much more expensive, still need termination. I try to provide a great value for the products I produce. If or when an issue arises, as sometimes they do, I'm the guy that helps troubleshoot.
Click to expand...
Your inbox is full. How much for a relay kit for a 72 Satellite?
 
Sorry about the full in box. I made some room and sent you a PM.

Those kits posted above are the ones my customers have replaced.
 
Ron H said:
I have learned much on the BH ills and mine shows some of that from overheating due to the amm gauge now disconnected after new harness installed. Another member (another post) gave advice on bypassing the BH to wire the gauge and have to re-study that as I'm still not certain on all the connections. Headlight relays are new to me as being discussed on this post!
Click to expand...
Once you take the time to understand a relay you'll say wow... now that's incredibly simple. The rest is choosing the right size and type of wires, connections and fuses. I highly recommend anybody who works on cars to take the time to understand them.

In simple terms it's nothing more than a switch turned on by electromagnetic force. Looking at this one 30, 87 and 87a are the switch, apply 12V to 30 then depending whether you want normally open 87 (no continuity while deenergized) or normally closed 87a (continuity while deenergized) you route that to the load (headlights in this case). 85 and 86 are the magnetic coil that pulls the switch in, one side grounded and the other is where your switch provides 12V to activate the relay. The diagrams are drawn in a relaxed (deenergized) state so looking at it makes it's clear which terminal to use.

Screenshot_20180222-155005.png
 
Please excuse my ignorance and bear with me as I try to understand: Dimming lights at idle has been addressed by three remedies if I followed all posts (ok aside from other items like a decent alt and such). 1) A rely kit 2) LED bulbs(?) and 3) "additional" wiring between the alt and batt and other wiring through firewall. I wouldn't think right off the new bulbs alone would solve the dimming problem yes/no? And if additional wiring...where is this connected on the alt and where on the batt side? Where are the wires going through the firewall (I assume bypassing the BH or maybe not) connected that's solved the dimming? Thanks!
 
Does anyone actually have before and after photos of their lights showing the difference with a relay kit versus factory wiring? Just curious if it makes that much of a difference. I have all new everything, factory wiring, lights, and switch, I think the lights are pretty darn bright, and they are even better now that I have properly aligned the headlights!
 
You can measure the voltage drop to the headlight pin by backprobe of the socket. More than 1.8 volts drop will reduce the candle power.
 
idrivemopar said:
Does anyone actually have before and after photos of their lights showing the difference with a relay kit versus factory wiring? Just curious if it makes that much of a difference. I have all new everything, factory wiring, lights, and switch, I think the lights are pretty darn bright, and they are even better now that I have properly aligned the headlights!
Click to expand...
Can't speak for others, but my problems were because of the wiring not allowing enough current from the alternator at idle. My turn signals would not blink. Lol. Once I added extra wires, the current was available for everything that needed it. My lights got and stayed brighter and my turn signals blink properly now.
A rely would guarantee plenty of juice for for the headlights if someone is having issues.
 
Ron H said:
Please excuse my ignorance and bear with me as I try to understand: Dimming lights at idle has been addressed by three remedies if I followed all posts (ok aside from other items like a decent alt and such). 1) A rely kit 2) LED bulbs(?) and 3) "additional" wiring between the alt and batt and other wiring through firewall. I wouldn't think right off the new bulbs alone would solve the dimming problem yes/no? And if additional wiring...where is this connected on the alt and where on the batt side? Where are the wires going through the firewall (I assume bypassing the BH or maybe not) connected that's solved the dimming? Thanks!
Click to expand...
New bulbs by themselves could improve the dimming issue. To keep it simple, bulbs get dim when the electrical system can not supply enough current to fully illuminate the headlight (or any other accessory). If an LED bulb requires less power (current times voltage) than a standard headlight, it will not dim as much, or at all. The true explanation is a bit more involved, and I won't bore the group to death with it. The bulkhead connector and ammeter act like resistors when they age and lose good continuity. This is why things get dim and wires get hot.
Tim
 
Smaller pulley on the alternator will give you more juice at idle.
I was having a some dimming at idle issues and went from a 3 inch to 2.5 inch pulley and no dimming at all, a local alt shop replaced it for me for $25 including the used pulley they supplied.
 
idrivemopar said:
Does anyone actually have before and after photos of their lights showing the difference with a relay kit versus factory wiring? Just curious if it makes that much of a difference. I have all new everything, factory wiring, lights, and switch, I think the lights are pretty darn bright, and they are even better now that I have properly aligned the headlights!
Click to expand...

headlight-relay-kit-2-jpg.jpg


Same headlights in both pictures. I have a couple more before and after pics. Relays flat out work better than the stock wiring regardless of the charging wire improvements that are made. This car also had my charge wire around set up on it. Dash lights are on the same setting.

Lights lose output exponentially when voltage is reduced. A 5% reduction in voltage will usually reduce output by at least 8% or more. It a losing game with insufficient power at hand.

There might be some other pics in this thread on FABO
https://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/threads/plug-and-play-headlight-relay-kits.216514/
 
Last edited:
440+6 said:
Smaller pulley on the alternator will give you more juice at idle.
I was having a some dimming at idle issues and went from a 3 inch to 2.5 inch pulley and no dimming at all, a local alt shop replaced it for me for $25 including the used pulley they supplied.
Click to expand...
Interesting; my pulley is 2.75" on the alt I had bought several years back when I converted to electronic ignition.
 
Harness from Crackedback with relays with motor not on, just battery. I need to adjust the aim of the headlights but am happy with it. This is a '71 but I mounted the relays on the battery tray arm

Headlights.jpg thumbnail_20170204_161837.jpg
 
BTW- Thanks Cracked!!!!!!!
 
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