Gun safety

[F4R/T]

You know Ballwin won’t get touched.. Hollywood elite. Dumbass!

 

[1 Wild R/T]

It takes less than THREE seconds!

1. finger OFF the trigger and point at the GROUND.
2a. (semiauto) drop the mag, pull the slide back and look IN the chamber.
2b. (revolver) pull the rod and drop the cylinder, and look to see if there are bullets in the cylinder.

I Agree... I offered thirty seconds so even a dummy (Like Baldwin) has time to do a through job.... Either way it doesn't take much time & even if it took 5-10 minutes it's worth it to know the weapon is safe.... Hollywood may say it's the armourers job but the rules of firearm safety say otherwise.....

 

[1 Wild R/T]

 

[turbine68rt]

"If you ever watch trap shooters, they always shoot both shells off even if they hit on the first one."
Not exactly. I've been shooting trap competitively for 8 years, and with the exception of doubles, regulation trap requires only one shell to be loaded per target.

 

[HEMIGTX70]

Clear the mag FIRST.

If you have a full mag and rack the slide to check the chamber...when you release the slide, you just loaded the chamber.

Mag FIRST is drilled into my head due to the disassembly requirements of my Springfield's (XDs and Hellcat) - lock back slide, rotate slide release lever, release slide, pull trigger, remove slide.

Mag.
Out.
FIRST.

Always.

Sorry, I never thought of Semi's or Auto's. I have never touched one. All I ever had were shot guns, bolt action, and pump rifles. You make a very good point! Thank you!

 

[HEMIGTX70]

"If you ever watch trap shooters, they always shoot both shells off even if they hit on the first one."
Not exactly. I've been shooting trap competitively for 8 years, and with the exception of doubles, regulation trap requires only one shell to be loaded per target.

I'm not an expert and I have only been to a few shoots, but every time I saw them load two shells, they would shoot both shells. Regardless of hit or miss on first shot. I'm sure there are different requirements for different shoots.

 

[turbine68rt]

I'm not an expert and I have only been to a few shoots, but every time I saw them load two shells, they would shoot both shells. Regardless of hit or miss on first shot. I'm sure there are different requirements for different shoots.

Any organized shoot that I'm aware of or participated in follows ATA rules which only allows one live round in singles, two for doubles. Maybe you were watching a session of doubles at the time. It wouldn't make much sense to have 50 rounds of ammo for only 25 targets, nor economically feasible.

 

[dla4567]

I'm not an expert and I have only been to a few shoots, but every time I saw them load two shells, they would shoot both shells. Regardless of hit or miss on first shot. I'm sure there are different requirements for different shoots.

Typically if you load 2 shells it’s because there are 2 targets. And in the event you hit both targets with 1 shot, rarely do you shoot the second.
There are events such as five stand or pyramid in which you load 2 shells for only 1 target. Again, rarely does the shooter shoot the second shot if he hits the target with the first shot.
That being said… in a competition if I’m not sure I hit it with the first shot I will absolutely shoot at it a second time. And sometimes in practice I’ll take a second shot at the biggest piece left of the broken target because it’s fun. Has nothing to do with safety.

 

[HEMIGTX70]

Any organized shoot that I'm aware of or participated in follows ATA rules which only allows one live round in singles, two for doubles. Maybe you were watching a session of doubles at the time. It wouldn't make much sense to have 50 rounds of ammo for only 25 targets, nor economically feasible.

I thought the same thing when they emptied the second shell after the first one hit, but what do I know. I was just there watching.

 

[72redbird]

I would be curious to know, that if the script had asked Baldwin to point the gun at his head and pull the trigger, if he would have checked to see if the gun was loaded or not before he pulled the trigger?

 

[Xp29h]

I think it's on the director who picked the gun up (should not have), and handed it to Baldwin, declaring it safe. Nevertheless, a sad and tragic event for all involved.

Certainly there are several people here in trouble, or should be! However, as a long time firearms instructor, you NEVER trust anyone that a weapon is safe! When you receive a weapon from anyone, it should be magazine removed and locked open handed butt first for a semi auto and for a revolver - cylinder open, empty and passed butt first showing empty cylinder to the person so they can see its empty. If it’s not that way, you don’t take it! Period! If you pick a firearm up, it is your job to clear it. Period. It’s on Baldwin! He received it, pointed it, and squeezed the trigger! Yes others have fault in this but they didn’t pull the trigger!

I agree 100% very tragic for cinematographer! Needless accident!

 

[Cojohnso1]

Ultimately Baldwin is guilty of negligent homicide. I'm not sure what degree? Since I'm not any sort of law expert. Or knowledge of New Mexico law. But certainly a felony. Are others also guilty of negligence? Very likely. I'm betting Baldwin does 6-9 months of a 2+ year sentence in a min security facility?

 

[dadsbee]

300 rounds of ammo on set.. WHY?

 

[zyzzyx]

I'm not going to judge anyone at this point because we don't have all the facts ma'm!
I'm just glad yuse guys aren't on MY jury! I prefer to wait and see what shakes out.
I'm sure things will change five or six more times before it's over.

 

[Cojohnso1]

I'm not going to judge anyone at this point because we don't have all the facts ma'm!
I'm just glad yuse guys aren't on MY jury! I prefer to wait and see what shakes out.
I'm sure things will change five or six more times before it's over.

He has already confessed. And that he didn't check. As well as one of the producers? There is no doubt to the accounts. It's the liabilities. Which can be very argumentative.

 

[Ron H]

Posting on the thread about this tragedy, there are a lot of questions still to be answered, some of them obvious questions…some maybe not so much. Example, was the gun supposed to be empty or have blanks in it? If the latter, it would be a matter of removing the cartridges to determine if they’re blanks. Don’t think looking at the base of the cartridges in the cylinder would be sufficient. Was this an immediate live shoot of the scene or a rehearsal? My quick guess would be a rehearsal; but don’t believe this has been confirmed yet. Real weapons, used for a prop, have been modified so the injection of a real bullet can’t be done. A real bullet can’t be fully set in the chamber. Seems this might not have been the case, unless whatever ‘matter’ was propelled from the gun was enough to kill. The AD, Walls, has a poor history with safety, if what I had read is near accurate, this guy should have been in a different career by now. How is it that this guy handed the gun off to AB? Where da eff was the armorer? Haven’t heard squat yet about where she was. Cold gun supposed to be dead EMPTY or does this include blanks? Have heard more than one definition. The use of guns on TV shows and movies are in the multiple thousands going on without a tragedy. Many used are not real weapons. If the projectile was a real bullet…oly chit, how many **** ups could make this remotely possible?

 

[Sam69sat]

Posting on the thread about this tragedy, there are a lot of questions still to be answered, some of them obvious questions…some maybe not so much. Example, was the gun supposed to be empty or have blanks in it? If the latter, it would be a matter of removing the cartridges to determine if they’re blanks. Don’t think looking at the base of the cartridges in the cylinder would be sufficient. Was this an immediate live shoot of the scene or a rehearsal? My quick guess would be a rehearsal; but don’t believe this has been confirmed yet. Real weapons, used for a prop, have been modified so the injection of a real bullet can’t be done. A real bullet can’t be fully set in the chamber. Seems this might not have been the case, unless whatever ‘matter’ was propelled from the gun was enough to kill. The AD, Walls, has a poor history with safety, if what I had read is near accurate, this guy should have been in a different career by now. How is it that this guy handed the gun off to AB? Where da eff was the armorer? Haven’t heard squat yet about where she was. Cold gun supposed to be dead EMPTY or does this include blanks? Have heard more than one definition. The use of guns on TV shows and movies are in the multiple thousands going on without a tragedy. Many used are not real weapons. If the projectile was a real bullet…oly chit, how many **** ups could make this remotely possible?

Heard on the news they were using the prop guns (real guns) during breaks to shoot beer cans for fun. Don't know if it's true but it's been reported.

 

[Triplegreen500]

Don’t think looking at the base of the cartridges in the cylinder would be sufficient.

ANY cartridge in the chamber means DON'T POINT IT AT ANYONE.

Hell...I don't even like pointing a gun I know is clear (because I just cleared it personally) at another person...or a pet...

It's a gun, fercrissakes....not a toy!!

 

[Sahara]

I genuinely feel bad for Alec; like his politics or not this is a tough burden for anyone to bear and I don’t wish it on anyone.
There is so much that went wrong on so many levels.
On my worksite (the gov’t) we are not allowed to have firearms at work for any reason, even though it is otherwise legal to do so. It is one way that we avoid having dumb **** happen with firearms on the job site. The same with beer.
This business of: a.) shooting beer cans during off times, and
b.) having live ammo on the site as a result, and
C.) having beer on the job site to provide the cans to shoot
is just wrong. Just because these are pampered, entitled, wealthy people should not make their job site any different then yours or mine.
Hollywood is happy to make staggering amounts of money from the lowest possible investment. Everyone on set should have to take, take seriously, and pass a real firearms safety course. Any horseplay or breaking of any of the rules should result in removal of the person from the set. Famous celebrity? Who cares. Bullets don’t care who fires them or who they kill.

 

[Budnicks]

Alec Baldwin pulled the trigger, he's guilty
(Alec Baldwin is also responsible for the production, budget & staffing he is the executive producer)
he should know what he has in his hand
he is 100% responsible, negligence in no defense

staff cutbacks, budget & cost savings (by the executive producer),
union squabbles, unqualified personnel etc. all played a hand

gun safety 101
you never point any gun at anything or anyone
you don't intend to shot, kill or do harm
movie set or not, acting or not

simple logic, some are too stupid to recognise it