Holley Street Dominator on RB Stroker

[BSB67]

Mr Porter told me the Street Dominator would work well and the idle differences between the Edel RPM and Dominator would be different but not a huge difference. Mr Porter did the top end for me with a custom roller cam and mildly worked Stealth heads. So why do I ask this then?
I ordered a few days ago the 440 source bottom end etc. I was speaking to the guy there at 440 source and asked about the Street Dominator intake. He did not recommend it and said the Performer RPM was the way to go. He was not too specific why the Holley wasn't recommended. Didn't have good luck with it or something. Or is it as simple as they don't sell it?? That is why I came here as there is a lot of experience with strokers and high performance in general. As I said my build isn't radical and rather conservative compared to what some of you do here. If I make an honest 500 hp and high 500's tq with good behavior on pump gas I will be happy. I like the low design of the Holley SD as I can use the Dual Snorkel stock air cleaner easily but wanted to make sure.
I appreciate your thoughts. Kern Dog's too!

Ahhhhhh, Hmmmmmmm. How do I put this. Always assess the true background and experience, the best you can, of those giving advise. Dwayne is a true professional and in expert on this subject.

 

[Turboomni]

Yes I was leaning that way [Holley SD] and was hoping for reassurance in this decision.
Mr Porter's name came to my attention and is very highly regarded by everyone it seems.
I drove up to his place to pick up my heads and it was great to meet him. He was very happy to answer all my questions ,no matter how stupid lol.
By the way BSB67 your engine looks really great ,thankyou for posting the pics and your thoughts.
Love the HP exhaust manifolds!!

 

[BSB67]

Love your car. I like C Bodies. Had a 67 Chrysler 300 with Magnum 500 wheels. I got T-boned by some hoodlums that ran a red light while running from the police. The 300 stopped em. Pretty dramatic scene.

 

[Turboomni]

Thanks I appreciate it. I thought it might be a good idea to post all 19+ feet and 4100 lbs of her so to give a better idea what I want from the engine. Definitely not a drag car!!
Sorry to hear about your 300. That sucks big time.

 

[PRHeads]

My preference based on the forecast operating conditions of the motor would be to use the RPM.
I have about zero experience with what will or won’t fit under the stock hood of a 69 C body.

Edelbrock claims the RPM is 1.7” taller than OE.

Get some clay..... roll up a piece and stick it on the highest point of the air filter.
Close the hood fully......reopen the hood, measure the length of the clay.
Is there 1.7” to spare?

If not....... you need either a lower air filter or a lower manifold.

If I had to build the motor without access to that info, it would get the SD to insure no fitment issues.

The cam to be used with this build is a bit smaller than the one in Russ’s motor, along with the heads being noticeably smaller.
I feel the low speed driving characteristics would be very good with the SD....... but the very low speed response would likely be improved with the RPM.
However...... It if it doesn’t fit.....it doesn’t fit.

It’s nice seeing the car the motor will be going in.
Those are rare and cool cars.

 

[Turboomni]

Thanks for the reply Mr Porter! Yes I rolled up a loose ball of aluminum foil and put it on top of the air cleaner, closed the hood and I got a measurement of 1 3/4 inches between the hood and air cleaner with the stock manifold.
I believe it is settled then. Holley Street Dominator.

 

[PRHeads]

Okay....... so that would only leave you .050.
Not enough imo.

But..... to add another possible obstacle....... is the current carb exactly the same height from the bottom of the baseplate to the top of the air cleaner mounting surface as what you’ll be putting on with the new motor?

Will it be getting new motor mounts?
Are the current ones collapsed at all?

 

[BSB67]

Thanks for the reply Mr Porter! Yes I rolled up a loose ball of aluminum foil and put it on top of the air cleaner, closed the hood and I got a measurement of 1 3/4 inches between the hood and air cleaner with the stock manifold.
I believe it is settled then. Holley Street Dominator.

If you had 1.75" with the stock set up, then you can definitely get that to work with the RPM, with just a touch of creativity. In stock intake/air cleaner configuration, mine was touching the hood insulating pad. My intake, the 440 2D is also 1.75 taller than stock and got it all to work.

 

[Turboomni]

Yes I have new motor mounts to be installed with the new engine. I have no idea of the current ones but they are from the early 80's when the the current low compression iron head 440 was installed.That had crossed my mind too, it all works out on paper for the Edelbrock measurement wise and the new motor mounts bites me in the a$$.

 

[BSB67]

But..... to add another possible obstacle....... is the current carb exactly the same height from the bottom of the baseplate to the top of the air cleaner mounting surface as what you’ll be putting on with the new motor?

I think they usually measure the same.

The 69 air cleaner design leaves you with a lot of height control options, starting with a Ford style drop base. Use to be able to get them from Mancini at one time I think.

 

[Turboomni]

Yes I looked into the Mancini drop base plate. I have also heard of someone saying they milled off some of the top of the RPM too. Don't know about that one. I would like to put some kind of spacer /isolator between the intake and carb like I have now as it seemed to help a bit with hot starts.

 

[hunt2elk]

Not certain on a C-body, but I used a RPM on a 440 in my 69 Charger. It was tight, but I made it work. 1.25" drop air cleaner base and a shorter K&N element. I'd have to look through my paperwork for the actual filter. I also used a K&N filtered top because I didnt like restriction under the lid. Pretty sure you won't get you stock air cleaner in there. If I was doing another 440, I would go with the Street Dominator, just for this problem.

 

[PRHeads]

Russ....... where were you starting the dyno pulls, and how much difference in TQ at that point?

As a point of reference...... I just drove a 71 Charger the other day with a 446, Ede heads, SD, headers, and Sniper EFI.....6 speed manual trans.
No issues at all cruising along in 6th gear at 1800rpm.
The cam is very close to the one going in this 505.

 

[BSB67]

The pull recording started at 3000. The 2D made an average of 18 lb-ft over the Holley from 3000 to 3500. This was with the divider still intact. W/O it looks like about 20. These were all with the same, looser lash setting. The largest peak difference was at about 3300

My converter is tight tight tight. I have no part throttle kick down. I'll roll through a stop or roll through a slow turn and the car pulls smoothly in third from these conditions, i.e essentially pull from nearly a dead stop in third gear with 3.23 gears. 1100 to 1200 rpm is about where the torque converter lands when pulling from these conditions. It also cruises through the neighborhood in 3 rd at 25 at about that rpm too. As you know, that's with the 440 2D, divider milled and a 1/2" open spacer. And those runners have a huge cross section. Hard to imaging the SD would be noticeable different down there for just pulling the car around under normal conditions. That said you would think that the RPM throttle response would be a little sharper under those conditions. With that cam the car is a bit lazy under those conditions.

 

[68 HEMI GTS]

I’d have no issues with the small single plane on the big motor. The single plane will probably have better idle quality as well. Does on my 511

 

[Challenger340]

I don't understand this thread at all ?
Dual Planes are intended to provide a better idle quality than single planes.
That said,
we've never seen or felt much ? if any ? noticeable difference in idle quality or throttle response between the RPM and the SD Manifold ?
One FITS all the time under hood ? (SD)
One only FITS sometimes and usually after dinkin around under the hood ? (RPM)

 

[PRHeads]

As you know, that's with the 440 2D, divider milled and a 1/2" open spacer. And those runners have a huge cross section. Hard to imaging the SD would be noticeable different down there for just pulling the car around under normal conditions.

My thoughts exactly.
Plus, there would be room to add a small insulating spacer between the carb
and the SD.

 

[Turboomni]

Thanks for all the replies. The 440 Source bottom end is on it's way.

 

[wyrmrider]

easy to change to a later VB and get Part throttle
put a transgo stage II reprogramming kit in (not the little shift kits)
Dual Planes are for 2 or 4 bbl carbs, not necessary with EFI- MPEFI
still needed with a dual throttle body
It's the sucking of two adjacent cylinders that mess things up amongst firing order in general

 

[andyf]

I'd use the SD for clearance and then add a Holley Sniper. The Sniper will allow you to easily "super tune" the engine combination. But don't do it unless you know something about computers since tuning EFI does require at least a basic understanding of attaching files and finding folders on a computer.