HV oil pump and pan capacity

[Glenwood]

Just wondering if a deeper pan is necessary with a HV oil pump. My main bearing clearance is .003, so I'm thinking a HV pump is needed over the stock pump, but then should I look at going to a 6qt pan?
Also, with a HV pump, is a 1/2" pu tube necessary for street use of will a 3/8" be sufficient?

 

[not so famous bob]

Just wondering if a deeper pan is necessary with a HV oil pump. My main bearing clearance is .003, so I'm thinking a HV pump is needed over the stock pump, but then should I look at going to a 6qt pan?
Also, with a HV pump, is a 1/2" pu tube necessary for street use of will a 3/8" be sufficient?

I think the hi volume and 3/8 p/u don`t go together good. just my opinion ! 7 qt rear sump "old" funny car alum. pan, w/ single line swinging p/u, under a girdle here, .0025 bearing clearance..

 

[lewtot184]

if you insist on a HV pump with a 3/8" pick-up try using a stock relief spring in the pump. the heavy HV pump relief spring is unnecessary for a lot of applications. 5qts are ok for driving but 6qts-7qts would be better for a performance engine.

 

[Yatzee]

Just wondering if a deeper pan is necessary with a HV oil pump. My main bearing clearance is .003, so I'm thinking a HV pump is needed over the stock pump, but then should I look at going to a 6qt pan?
Also, with a HV pump, is a 1/2" pu tube necessary for street use of will a 3/8" be sufficient?

I think what your wondering is "How much is enough?" when it comes to an oil pump. Unless your racing, a standard oil pump that's been lightly ported is sufficient. The real issue is weather or not you'll drain the pan and put all your oil up top faster than it can drain back. The unfortunate thing with Mopar motors is they oil from the top down so the question becomes, high volume or high pressure and high pressure is preferable. Keeping in mind the relationship between pressure and volume, high pressure means high volume and vise versa.
Smoke and mirrors, I say, because a high volume pump should have taller rotors to accommodate a higher volume but most manufacturers tend to play around with the relief valves spring value to accomplish either/or. You can do this yourself with spacers. I run a standard oil pump that I ported and get 75 psi @ 3500 rpm and 35psi@775. High capacity oil pans are great not only for volume but the latent cooling you get from having more oil. Problem is, you have to get the position of the pickup just right (about 3/16 from the bottom of the pan) and should use 1/2 inch pickup for every type of pump. Imagine if you could piss in the toilet faster than the flush could take it away. Last thing you want to happen is pump cavitation or putting the oil up top faster than it can drain back. And before you even consider a new deeper pan, make sure you have clearance for the steering linkage with the wheels cranked full in both directions.

 

[IQ52]

I've run a high volume pump, 3/8 pickup with a 4qt oil pan and spun the thing to 7,600 rpm without loss of oil pressure. Use the shallow 6qt hemi style pan and the 3/8 pickup and you'll be fine.

 

[not so famous bob]

I've run a high volume pump, 3/8 pickup with a 4qt oil pan and spun the thing to 7,600 rpm without loss of oil pressure. Use the shallow 6qt hemi style pan and the 3/8 pickup and you'll be fine.

I wouldn`t, I have full time oiling to the rockers.

 

[Glenwood]

I'm not bent on having a HV pump over the stock pump, but I'm wondering if with my bearing clearances, more volume is warranted. This video from Melling demonstrates flow with different bearing clearances. I'm waiting on my cam to arrive before assembling the motor, so I could drill and tap it to 1/2 NPT now, but I'd rather not if it isn't really necessary for a street motor.

 

[747mopar]

In my case I think a HV pump was a waste and will be going back to a factory pump although my clearances are a bit tighter. I run 70 psi all the time which is wasted power IMO.

On the oil pan, the factory one has done fine but it leaves no reserve if you spring a small leak. I'd go with a bigger pan but not a deep pan instead one that is wider which is offered as well for better clearance.

 

[Glenwood]

the problem as many of us know is that the early 60s k-frames are not oil pan friendly. Finding a 6qt pan that is reasonably priced is challenging.
Here's the C body 699 (same as the 187) pan that just fits, although I notched the k-frame a little.
440Source has a similar pan, which is a 6qt, but seems expensive at $249.
http://store.440source.com/Big-Bloc...Pan-with-Tie-Rod-Relief/productinfo/200-1133/

 

[Thunderlugs]

Just an FYI. Its been a long time , 15 years or so, but if my memory serves me correct, the pan I am using is a Moroso 8 qt. Just did a test fit and notching yesterday. I have no Idea if this pan can be had anymore.

 

[Thunderlugs]

One More pic.

 

[AMX364]

The problem with the 4 quart pan will only show up IF you maintain 100 mph for more then 2 minutes. The oil pressure will start falling very quickly and if you do not back down it will fail. The pickup size of 3/8 will work for most engines. If you are running a "stroked" crank, I would change to the 1/2 inch size. The only real issue against the 1/2 inch pickup is it will not fit every pan. It is very easy to change to the 1/2 inch pickup if the motor is apart and can be cleaned after tapping. I myself have used the 6 qt. street hemi pan and have been happy with it, if the pan can fit the car.

 

[747mopar]

One More pic.

View attachment 417215

This is the pan I was referring to about not using, no offense but I had one on mine and it didn't take long to get scrape marks in it.

Glenwood
Moroso and Miloden both make pans that sit higher but as you've found... they're not cheap which is why I haven't bought one yet.

 

[68 HEMI GTS]

I've run a high volume pump, 3/8 pickup with a 4qt oil pan and spun the thing to 7,600 rpm without loss of oil pressure. Use the shallow 6qt hemi style pan and the 3/8 pickup and you'll be fine.

Was it on a dyno or in a car? I've ran HV pumps with stock pans. Didn't work out so hot When you were slamming through the gears.

 

[AMX364]

With a non-stock pan, even the 6 qt street hemi pan, a skid plate is your friend. Protect that pan.

 

[mopar 3 B]

If your not willing to properly prep the top half of the engine save your money. Run the stock pump and pan and just hope you never need the reserve. Otherwise get the diegrinder out and due the prep. 10 quarts of oil will be of no advantage if it's all stuck in the heads at can not get back to the pan.
I use the high volume and high pressure system with 3/8" pickup and have had no problems with high speed runs in excess of posted speed limits for hours.
The question is do you really need the extra protection of a high volume system and extra capacity.
At runs of 4800 rpm you have less than 5 minites before there is no oil in the pan with a stock 5 quart system.

 

[mopar 3 B]

This is the pan I was referring to about not using, no offense but I had one on mine and it didn't take long to get scrape marks in it.

Glenwood
Moroso and Miloden both make pans that sit higher but as you've found... they're not cheap which is why I haven't bought one yet.

Why are you buying large capacity oil pans? I have built two with pickups for less than $50 bucks.

 

[747mopar]

Why are you buying large capacity oil pans? I have built two with pickups for less than $50 bucks.

That's exactly what I plan to do.

 

[miller]

I'll find out one of these days, on mine (lol). But, I put a 6-quart pan on my 64, but went with a 1/2" pickup. (not much choice, since the port was corroded.)
I will comment that there's nothing wrong with a 'good' stock pump. Just needs good clearances, and the right pressure relief spring. Never had a problem, with flow, or pressure...even with an extra .0005 bearing clearance. As far as I'm concerned, a great deal of results, is with the oil weight you use.

Nothing on the pump, but an example...ug, on a new 2001 Chevy truck. Oil 'recommended' was 5w30! Took the damn thing on a trip, just after buying it, and halfway through, got an oil light. Checked the level, 3 quarts low! Wow.
Got back into town, to the dealer, had it checked out. Told me nothing was wrong. Really. Straight down the the oil changers, and had 10w40 put in it...and never used a drop of oil, after swapping weights. Take it for what it's worth. (Used to run 50w VR1 in my 69 RR, no probs.)

 

[lewtot184]

back when the max wedge s/s cars were built chrysler recommended not to exceed 15 seconds at wide open throttle. the 1/2" pick-up is to feed the pump. how many people think in terms of feeding oil to the engine but ignore feeding the pump that supplies the oil. the whole thing needs to be thought out from the oil in the bottle to getting the oil back in the pan and everywhere in between. my thoughts are that bottom end bleeders can benefit from a HV pump but needs
to be fed to supply the oil. stock type clearances (no excessive throw off) with 3/8" pick-up will live with a stock pump and 6qts but be reasonable on engine rpm.