My new shop.

[super-bee_ski]

That sounds great Dave...
At least the cement company or the contractors are supporting the fix.

All good news!

 

[northerndave]

Thanks for the positive enthusiasm, it's contagious, and I need it.

lol

 

[Cranky]

Looks like the same kind of luck I've had whenever I have someone come out to do anything!! When I did the pour for my shop (50 yards) it was in the middle of August and 98 degrees and the guy in charge wasn't here yet but the crew was along with his father in law who was from New York. The the concrete driver dropped a test slump, it landed like a kissy and I said too dry and the FIL said "it's fine, pour it" and I told him he would pay for it. Well, he did in the fact that he dropped 3 trucks right after the other and then couldn't work it. That's when his son in law finally showed up and said F#CK pretty loud. I should have told the driver to add some water to it because I'm in charge and am the one paying for it. I haven't done much concrete work but I've been around it for a lot of years starting at the age of 14 and know how it's supposed to look when you drop that first little bit to see how it looks. Yours looked kinda hot when it was poured but looked too wet when the power trowels were on it. When I did the drive way (another 50 yards), it was in the middle of winter and 38 degrees and it was way too wet right out of the truck. Had to cover a large portion with plastic to try and keep the heat in. That's the worse area. The shop floor had to be sanded because the power trowel did nothing but pull it up and then once it was dry, all it did was create dust when it was swept and I had to paint it to stop it from making dust clouds. What a freakin mess. My dream shop has a lousy floor. Thought about capping it but my dad did that to one and it cracked up. 1 1/2" cap wasn't enough I guess. I feel your pain!

 

[Duda]

I might have to fire my concrete guy before he stars. It's hard to believe all this can happen.

 

[northerndave]

I contacted the concrete company today. Explained that I needed something in print from Lafarge indicating that they stand behind this process, also asked for an engineer to sign off on it.

I hate to be a dick, but this is kind of important, it's not a sidewalk.

 

[super-bee_ski]

Yeah,
I have done concrete before and I'll be doing it soon again
I do know this:
Pouring concrete is such a "Dynamic" process.
There are many factors that can "affect" the process.

Like Cranky stated in his 2 LARGE pours...
The 1st pour it was too hot (temps) and it set-up too quickly. Iit's hard to do the finnish work as it is setting quickly.
The 2nd pour it was too cold and the "mud" was a "HOT" mix...Already doomed at this point.

My resoloution?
1. I always try to have enough support for finishing the cement on time
(Cranky's drivers dumped 30 yards all at once..thats tough)
2. I accecpt the fact that it is "hit or miss" with weather, temps and winds
(wind can set it up too quickly, more so than heat)
I dont expect my concrete to come out perfect anymore...I expect spider cracks, some rough areas & flaws, period.
I know this is a comprimise but it make me feel better.
It's cement and it is not a perfect process. It's OK.

Dave, as long as you are getting support form the Contractor, that is a "Good Thing"

 

[northerndave]

After several discussions with the concrete company and an independent engineering source, I feel better about the whole situation.

 

[Cranky]

He had two trucks on the ground pretty fast and that was ok because there were enough guys on site to handle it but when I saw the 3rd truck go down, I exploded on the jerk. That's when the son in law (the boss) showed up and said WTF too and I told him to let's get this right and I would deal with him later if it wasn't right.....and it wasn't. I worked my butt off right along with them which really pissed me off because all I was supposed to do was just watch and maybe help out with the small stuff (what small stuff lol). Some of the same kind of crap happened when I remodeled my home. I ended up doing way more work than bargained for because of inept morons. Another lousy concrete experience several years ago happened when I had a patio poured......and the sky decided to open up. It's not too bad but not as nice as it should be. Today, my wife wants to build a nice patio cover and I'm reluctant to do it. Just not worth the stress anymore. Glad you're feeling better with your build, Dave....

 

[super-bee_ski]

Yeah Cranky,
That 3rd truck driver should have held off.

As you stated...Morons!
It's not there "project"

 

[Cranky]

Yeah Cranky,
That 3rd truck driver should have held off.

As you stated...Morons!
It's not there "project"

Yup....but they do what the 'contractor' tells them to do. After unloading it and sitting in the sun for 5 minutes he had the audacity to tell me that I'd end up having a cold joint if it was left to sit for very much longer in the hot Texas August sun. Geez....kinda late now to put water to it ya think. Anyways, besides the lousy finish, it's held up pretty good considering all of that. It'll be 30 years old next month.

 

[Speedbird]

Top skinned over too fast, areas where the cream layer got "burned" the surface was too tight, water was still trying too bleed out but couldn't breathe through those burned spots. So, it basically blistered the cream layer loose.

Something like that.

That's basically the best theory right now and my own impression from what I've gathered.

The concrete guys are looking towards the company that supplies them with mix powder, thinking something caught them off guard with the condition or age of the powder itself that lead to a "hot mix".

These guys batch a good volume on a daily basis, they aren't what you'd call a now and then small time operation. One of the crew guys is a friend of mine, he came out to look this morning. He said he's been doing this for 20 yrs and he's only seen this happen once before.


I guess I'm just lucky as phuck huh?

Yep, from what little I know about concrete that looks like standing water on it. Probably hurried the trowel work and sealed it too soon.
Never put steel on it before it finishes bleeding.
I must have gotten real lucky with my little garage slab. Old retired fellow that pored it knew what he was doing and took his time and did it right.
Not so lucky with my roofing contractor last year. What a nightmare.

 

[northerndave]

My slab is fixed.


We pulled an all nighter wed night into thurs morning. We had chipped off all of the questionable surface area on the old slab, then formed for a new pour which was around 3.5' to 4". I made riser sleeves for my floor drains and installed a water closet flange extender to raise the water closet flange about 4" for the toilet.

We used steel mesh panels which were cut, fit and wired together on top of the old slab. Then we wet the old surface with a bonding agent, sprinkled on many bags of straight Portland cement powder and broomed it all together making a paste/slurry layer over the old chipped surface.

The new mix used pea rock and 3# of fiber mesh per yd. The last of the crete was in the forms at around 10 PM wed night. We did a night pour so we would have cool temps for longer finishing time.

The last power trowel was pulled from the slab at around 9:30 AM Thurs morning.

It looks really good, nice finish, nice drain slopes. I watched the entire process and helped with what ever I could. I do have confidence in this fix after watching it all happen, and I'm happy with the end result.

Now maybe we can get a damn building on this thing.

:headbang:

 

[MT_Mopar]

Good deal Dave, I am glad you got it resolved and you are happy with it.

Here come the walls!

One more thing: BE SAFE

 

[Budnicks]

We trenched my new water line yesterday from my well to the new shop (still an imaginary shop at this point).

You northern folk might be interested to hear that when crossing my driveway with the back-hoe with the trench.... We hit frost at 8' depth on June 12.

Huh.... I'm starting to think I might be living a little bit too far north?

Southern guys be like "What's ground frost? "

lol.

As we called it PERMAFROST in Alaska

- - - Updated - - -

Sounds cheap. Want to say it was over $125 a few years ago here in MN.

most everything cost more in the far north, except the land

- - - Updated - - -

I've tried the radiant heated floors & floorboards with radiant heat also, in a couple of my places,
also in a few dealerships/customers, where moneys no issue, I don't deal with many in the far north anymore,
did way back in the mid 80's to 90's thou....
it's not the most efficient/cheapest way to heat {or at-least wasn't, maybe the technology is better now},
electric bills won't be cheap, I hope you get a cheaper rate, using "all electric"
{we actually get a discounted KWH rate here, if all electric, like a 30% discount, you have to ask/file for it thou}
maybe you could supplement it with some, wind & solar to help the electrical costs of heating...
then you have the cost of solar &/or wind, but can get a grant many places,
to help somewhat offset the costs of installation at-least...

hopefully it's an instant heat, like a tankless heater system, where it just heats the water passing thru & not heating a large vessel or holding tank & then pumping it too, adding to the extra costs & parts to maintain...

Disclaimer, I haven't installed or haven't had installed, any of these in years now...

but it will make working in the garage in sub-zero temps & working or rolling around on the cold a$$ floor,
much more comfortable, it will make/help a forced air or propane/natural gas system, heating the air,
much more effective/efficient too...

Good luck !!, it's looking great so far, it will be nice, I'm sure... I'm a little envious...
I hope they get some walls & roof up pretty damn soon, it's almost August, not much time before good old mother nature/winter shows her ugly head again....

 

[red 69 runner]

So is that extra concrete going to affect the way the heat radiates?

 

[Speedbird]

So is that extra concrete going to affect the way the heat radiates?

And is this a whole new slab on top of the previous slab?

 

[northerndave]

This is a new 3.5" slab over the "old" one.

Pretty extensive surface prep and bonding process, I watched the whole thing. I'm confident in it, and it finished well this time. The slopes to my drains are nice, it all looks good.

As far as the floor heat, more mass means 2 things. Slower reacting to the thermostat, but... More "storage" of heat which is a bonus to me since our electrical rate is discounted because they can turn my boiler off when the elect company is having a hard time fulfilling customer demand. That's how it works up here. You invest in a heating system that can store heat for sustained periods of time, that way you don't even realize it when they have cut your power. My boiler will be on a separate meter that the power company can control remotely. It will not effect my shop power, my lights will still work, air compressor, welder etc, it's just the boiler that they control. We're on our second home that is heated with this system and it works very well in homes. We have one winter under our belt in our new home that uses floor heat, previous to that we have 12 winters experience in another home that used floor heat. Both were set up the same way, separate meters for heating system which the power company can shut off to help divert power to other customers under high demand periods. The kilowatt rate is drastically reduced, it's a nice way to go in my opinion.



The building starts going up on Wed this week.

 

[coronet340]

Plus you have another 4" of flood protection on all the important stuff. lol

 

[northerndave]

That's the sort of mindset I need to get the enthusiasm train back on the tracks up here, lol!

I'm placing a large (by my standards) order today for things like my 2 post hoist, tons of shop tools ranging from lenco panel spotter with a couple handy attachments to old school drum brake tools. It's a good list, ball joint service set, coil spring compressor kit, torque wrench, big industrial shop vac, a bunch of new hutchins sanders, flammable storage cabinet, a big media blast cabinet, 25 ton press, shop vice, drill press, bench grinder, go-jack wheel dolly set, body panel work stands, drill bit sets, deep vice grip clamps, various pullers... blah, blah, blah, so on and so forth... my head is spinning... lol!



Now wtf am I going to do? I wont have any excuses for not being able to get anything done any more!

LMAO!

 

[northerndave]