Re-Rebuilding the 440-493 in a 1970 Charger

[ckessel]

There are several open areas to be gusseted like what you have shown that I'll deal with on mine when its time to do the topside. Plus some places to be trimmed of excess material. Looking good Greg.

 

[Kern Dog]

With the K member painted and cleared and the other parts cleaned and coated with the RPM paste, I could actually start reassembly. I've been distracted the past few days with a patio deck job that I halted 2 months ago.
I made a small mistake with the tie rod ends and sleeves.
I had them positioned for left side and right and for inner and outer....then I moved them and forgot which was which.
I needed two grease boots and one outer tie rod felt a bit sloppy so I took this opportunity to upgrade to the larger C-Body 11/16" size tie rods and sleeves from PST. I figure that with everything apart, plus the change from the Firm Feel steering box and Fast Ratio arms to the Borgeson and stock arms, I'd need an alignment anyway. I replaced an inner tie rod end when I swapped in the Borgeson so the remaining two that are in place may be on the way out too.
The last time it was aligned was 7-8 years ago. Back then I was able to get 4 degrees of caster, 3/4 degree of NEGative camber and 1/8" toe in. I guess that with all these parts being moved around, the alignment may have shifted a bit.

 

[beanhead]

With the K member painted and cleared and the other parts cleaned and coated with the RPM paste, I could actually start reassembly. I've been distracted the past few days with a patio deck job that I halted 2 months ago.
I made a small mistake with the tie rod ends and sleeves.
I had them positioned for left side and right and for inner and outer....then I moved them and forgot which was which.
I needed two grease boots and one outer tie rod felt a bit sloppy so I took this opportunity to upgrade to the larger C-Body 11/16" size tie rods and sleeves from PST. I figure that with everything apart, plus the change from the Firm Feel steering box and Fast Ratio arms to the Borgeson and stock arms, I'd need an alignment anyway. I replaced an inner tie rod end when I swapped in the Borgeson so the remaining two that are in place may be on the way out too.
The last time it was aligned was 7-8 years ago. Back then I was able to get 4 degrees of caster, 3/4 degree of NEGative camber and 1/8" toe in. I guess that with all these parts being moved around, the alignment may have shifted a bit.

Those changes should make for a nice improvement.
I'm still trying to get off my *** (well, get some actual garage time) and swap in the idler and pitman arms you sent me...Yep folks, as if you needed to be reminded the KernDog is a heckuva guy! Thanks again Greg.

 

[Kern Dog]

Hey I’m obnoxious but I can be a good guy to know too.

 

[ckessel]

And you have furry children.

 

[70ChargerRT]

I have a .64 overdrive in the Tremec 5 speed. The diff is a 3.55 for a 2.27 final drive. I don't see the need for the 6th gear which is often a .050 gear.
I did have the Lunati in place when I had a Gear Vendors. Back then I had a 3.91 and with the .78 Gear Vendors, it was a 3.04 final drive. The loose converter I had then made throttle response in overdrive soggy and unsatisfying. The pedal felt like mush until I was at the floor.

I don’t like the .50 gear, never did it’s useless. In saying that I don’t like the Tremecs 5 Speed gear ratio or the regular T-56 gear ratio either. The first gear in both of those are way too low and useless. I do like the final gear in the Tremec 5. I’m running 3.91 gears in my close ratio T-56 Magnum and it’s perfect. If and when I make the switch to a Dana I’ll use a 4.10 gear.

 

[Kern Dog]

I don’t like the .50 gear, never did it’s useless. In saying that I don’t like the Tremecs 5 Speed gear ratio or the regular T-56 gear ratio either. The first gear in both of those are way too low and useless.

The TKO was available with different ratios. Mine has the 2.87 1st gear. The other version has something like a 3.27 1st gear ratio.
I wouldn't want a 1st gear any taller than what I have. The 833 with its 2.44 1st gear seemed too tall for me when I had a 4 speed Duster with 3.55s.

 

[Cheapsunglasses]

The TKO was available with different ratios. Mine has the 2.87 1st gear. The other version has something like a 3.27 1st gear ratio.
I wouldn't want a 1st gear any taller than what I have. The 833 with its 2.44 1st gear seemed too tall for me when I had a 4 speed Duster with 3.55s.

3.27 1st? Geez, and here I am thinking my Frankenstein 833 od iron cases 3.09 1st is a tractor gear

 

[Kern Dog]

The 3.09 wouldn't be so bad if 2nd gear wasn't such a drop off.
The 833 OD has a 3.09 then a 1.67 2nd gear. Holy crap....what a spread that is.

Progress is slow but I am making headway. The PST tie rod ends and sleeves were ordered and received. I got a dented sleeve and contacted PST about it. They apologized and are sending a replacement.

The machinist has had the engine for 5 weeks but only works a couple hours a day, 3 days a week. The block is bored and honed, Next is to install the crank , rods and pistons and measure to get it between zero deck height and .005. This will put my compression ratio at 9.7 with .005 clearance and 9.8 to 1 at zero deck. The reason that I mention this range is because if the block is really hard to mill due to the high nickle content of Mopar blocks, I'm not going to make the man sweat over a few thousandths. I was at .012 with the old pistons.

I'm also working on what to do about the brakes. After seeing the video with that red '64 Comet where the idiot owner roasted the brakes and crashed, I want to get the brakes working better on this car. Of all the combinations that I have tried, I've never felt as confident of the brakes as I have in my '72 Duster with non power 11" discs and 10" drums. That car is impressive.
I've been in contact with Dr Diff and I'm looking at his 13" Cobra front disc kit along with an upgrade to his 11.7" rear setup. I already have the 10.7" kit so I'd just need the rotors and mounting brackets. He mentioned that he offers a hydroboost system but I couldn't find it on his site.

 

[Cheapsunglasses]

Yeah, the 833od gear spread isn’t great, but it’s cheap, so it’ll have to do for now.

Don’t forget that dip **** also had a sticking throttle he did nothing about, and the brakes were gone long before he came close to the intersection. But yes, brakes are definitely a priority.

 

[70ChargerRT]

The TKO was available with different ratios. Mine has the 2.87 1st gear. The other version has something like a 3.27 1st gear ratio.
I wouldn't want a 1st gear any taller than what I have. The 833 with its 2.44 1st gear seemed too tall for me when I had a 4 speed Duster with 3.55s.

That’s great that you went with the 2.87 which indeed is good for the 3.55 gears. I’m thinking my close ratio Magnum has 2.66 for 1st gear but can’t remember right off hand.

 

[beanhead]

That 2.87 low is a nice feature...with your 3.91 rear axle it's basically the 1st gear equivalent of what you'd get with a 4.56 rear/TF727 combo.

 

[Kern Dog]

I have a 3.91 in Jigsaw....

This car has a 3.55.

 

[beanhead]

I have a 3.91 in Jigsaw....

View attachment 1312950

This car has a 3.55.

View attachment 1312951

Right. I got confused between the two...hey even geniuses like me make a mistake once every 5-10 years or so!

 

[Kern Dog]

Some days come along and make me really anxious to drive this car. Today is one of those days. It has been apart for over 6 weeks. I have the engine bay repainted. The K member and suspension are ready to reassemble. I'm currently waiting on the machinist. I'd like to get this dude back together to drive before the weather turns cold and rainy.....though it hasn't rained much here the last couple of years.

 

[beanhead]

Some days come along and make me really anxious to drive this car. Today is one of those days. It has been apart for over 6 weeks. I have the engine bay repainted. The K member and suspension are ready to reassemble. I'm currently waiting on the machinist. I'd like to get this dude back together to drive before the weather turns cold and rainy.....though it hasn't rained much here the last couple of years.

I know the feeling. That's part of why it's been hard to take mine down to do some upgrades I have planned. It's just too much fun to keep cruising and beating on especially this time of year. I figured it would be so hot and miserable about now that I wouldn't want to be driving it much anyway..but it's been a pretty nice summer so far, in relative terms for us. We haven't yet had the day-after-day highs of 110+.

 

[Cheapsunglasses]

Your red charger is absolutely stunning…..but I really like jigsaw, because I’m dealing with a tight budget, I’m more mechanical 1st, looks 2nd.

You’re doing a great job “re-rebuilding” the car. I hope it’s more enjoyable after all of this, and we won’t see a re-re-rebuilding thread.

 

[Kern Dog]

Thanks for the kind words. I like that we have these forums to share these experiences. I have learned from others so I hope that my threads can encourage others to fix their own cars instead of paying a shop to do it all.
Jigsaw does run and drive just fine. The gauges work, the fuel system is new, the engine is rebuilt and runs quite well.
I actually don't mind doing these huge projects. I enjoy the build as much as the driving of them. I do like it more when I'm not waiting on someone else.
I'm naturally impatient......which explains why I jump in and do things and hope that I can figure things out along the way.

 

[70ChargerRT]

Thanks for the kind words. I like that we have these forums to share these experiences. I have learned from others so I hope that my threads can encourage others to fix their own cars instead of paying a shop to do it all.
Jigsaw does run and drive just fine. The gauges work, the fuel system is new, the engine is rebuilt and runs quite well.
I actually don't mind doing these huge projects. I enjoy the build as much as the driving of them. I do like it more when I'm not waiting on someone else.
I'm naturally impatient......which explains why I jump in and do things and hope that I can figure things out along the way.

You said a mouth full there. I enjoy doing my own stuff but I come from a family that has always wrenched on their own stuff. Some metal work, simple fabbing, electrical, engine and so forth. I’ve been working so much the last several years I hadn’t had time to do anything. My car was completely together but I tore it all apart and redoing it. Wasn’t happy with it. I got a few people put it back together that were supposed to be good. Rear main leaked, rear end wasn’t set up right.Starter never did sound right and went out, the guy put the trans in didn’t dial the bell in. I’m finally on a job that I can be home on the weekends so I’m going to put it back together myself. I’m very impatient also. I love these old school big blocks but if my motor ever goes it’s getting a hellcrate. I don’t have time or patience with machinist anymore or engine builders. I think I could drop a hellcrate in one weekend if I had everything there. Putting the rear main seal in tonight and putting the Charger on the lift tomorrow and dropping the K-frame for a respray.

 

[66 Sat]

Some days come along and make me really anxious to drive this car. Today is one of those days. It has been apart for over 6 weeks. I have the engine bay repainted. The K member and suspension are ready to reassemble. I'm currently waiting on the machinist. I'd like to get this dude back together to drive before the weather turns cold and rainy.....though it hasn't rained much here the last couple of years.

I'm hearing you.
I dropped my engine off at the builder on April 4th and still no sign. Not his fault, waiting on custom pistons that were due weeks ago.
At first it was ok as I had jobs to do. Painted the engine bay, installed the 1.03" torsion bars, re-installed everything I could after the painting, but now I'm just waiting, and waiting. Cleaning the dust off the car gets pretty boring after awhile. He reckons 2-3 weeks once he gets the pistons, but JE tell him they are "in the system" and we just have to be patient.
It's one of the reasons I never went for an exterior repaint - paint jail would just be the worst.