Who really knows Carter and Edelbrock carbs on here?

[rumblefish360]

There's the guy for the carb issue. (Hey Fugly!)

I'm pretty OK with the Carter/Edelbrocks. The level of for which your at is a bit more than I have gotten to myself. In all honesty, I would have sent you to the Diamondback boards to get ahold of Fugly. I thought about ding out the jets but the cluster? I'm not to sure about that one myself.

The last thing I got to do to my Edel. carb was make it a double pumper and (LOL) I never got to test it on the car. (Dang!)

 

[fugly]

There's the guy for the carb issue. (Hey Fugly!)

I'm pretty OK with the Carter/Edelbrocks. The level of for which your at is a bit more than I have gotten to myself. In all honesty, I would have sent you to the Diamondback boards to get ahold of Fugly. I thought about ding out the jets but the cluster? I'm not to sure about that one myself.

The last thing I got to do to my Edel. carb was make it a double pumper and (LOL) I never got to test it on the car. (Dang!)

Hey how are you doing.....just for fun the max size on most 800's is approximately .167 on the primaries and .214 on the secondaries before the clusters become a problem......not thinking anybody will need to exceed that....actually the idle wells and transfer passages will restrict before the clusters.....

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

First off pull the secondary boosters and measure the ID, which should be about .210-.216.....so the aforementioned is BS on the secondary side....on the primaries it is necked down, however there are two holes just Obote the base which also draw fuel. All that said, you have to figure the area of the jet not the diameter to figure this out using the formula PI r squared....as an example if you are using 119 jets on all four corners which I will come back to, your secondary area per jet is .011 inches and 10% more would be .0121...back figuring from there yields a required jet size of .124' which is very doable.....on the primary side you have to subtract the area of the metering rod which if you are using a XX47 rod leaves you with a total area of .00926 X1.1 (10% more) Means a required area of .0101 which would be had by using a XX34 rod which you might have to turn down from something else.....totally possible with some work.....now back to your combo....everything I have seen shows you running 2 sizes bigger on average then most....this leads me to believe you have other issues like fuel delivery, hood scoop too close to the carb, plenum area too big for engine or not enough timing....I suggest working with your combo some, as you should not need anything bigger than 116 jets even in cool air...

thanks for the reply and yes you are right about not exceeding .116 and that should be fine and that's where I have been running VP c14 and A/F is 12.8-13.1 respectfully. Using a dual O2 controller. Also keep in mind that we run at sea level and also with multiple days of sub-sealevel conditions so what that in mind, I want to run VP Q16 which needs more jet according to the guidelines from VP go up 6 jet sizes.. From my past experience even in july in the hot humid heat where DA was over 2800-3000 feet, I tried VP Q16 and left .116 jets and I was way lean and even slowed down using the VP Q16 then switching back to the C14 went a little faster due to the better A/F which was better than the Q16
Im at a loss and don't know even if I drilled out .124 metering jets that I would be able to richen it due to the other variables within the carter or edelbrock carbs.

 

[rumblefish360]

SS racer, where do you run and what class?

Fugly, I'm doin OK. Lots of work and not on cars. (BOOO)

On the Edel. carbs, have you been able to take note or experiment on the smaller 600's at this level? Do they also have this issue/clearance/size problems?

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

SS racer, where do you run and what class?

Fugly, I'm doin OK. Lots of work and not on cars. (BOOO)

On the Edel. carbs, have you been able to take note or experiment on the smaller 600's at this level? Do they also have this issue/clearance/size problems?

thanks combo is 588 ci with 1049 hp @6800 going to a smaller combo would restrict the fuel flow even more.
i'm already tapping into both sides with dual inlets so fuel delivery isn't a issue .magnafuel prostar 500 fuel pump with a product engineering regulator with a return system.

 

[fugly]

What I am trying to tell you is there is no issue at this level.....when you exceed approx .135 primary and .148 secondary, the air bleeds become an issue, up to there you have no issues. These carbs can be made to flow enough for alky ( far more than you need ) with minor alterations, the problem with alky is the floats and internal passage flow.....the smaller carbs can use existing jets for q16 as they start off with smaller jets. Unless you really know what you are doing, you do not want to play with air bleeds as that will screw with the fuel curve and you will go lean or rich in the midrange if you do it wrong.take a primary cluster out and you will see there are large holes which supplement the feed , however they are higher on the tube than the bottom and on wheelies they can be uncovered , leaning you out ( one of the issues addressed in my mods).on the secondaries, the tube I'd is .2XX so that is not an issue. At a certain level, the idle wells at the AF screws needs to be enlarged or you will have flat spots and going further up, you need to cross drill the jet to well feeds, but both of those are reserved for far more flow than you are talking about. Remember drilling the jets is not exact as you are messing up the entry taper....I would suggest drilling out for .121 and . 123 on some jets and playing with those until you find the combo ( start with the big ones and try the smaller if you want.....not rocket science and certainly possible to do what you want.....

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

Damon thanks for your help. im going out on Saturday and ill try it out. I did drill out jets with numbered drill bits so I do have exact sizes done already. i'll keep everyone posted.

 

[dvw]

First off pull the secondary boosters and measure the ID, which should be about .210-.216.....so the aforementioned is BS on the secondary side....on the primaries it is necked down, however there are two holes just Obote the base which also draw fuel. All that said, you have to figure the area of the jet not the diameter to figure this out using the formula PI r squared....as an example if you are using 119 jets on all four corners which I will come back to, your secondary area per jet is .011 inches and 10% more would be .0121...back figuring from there yields a required jet size of .124' which is very doable.....on the primary side you have to subtract the area of the metering rod which if you are using a XX47 rod leaves you with a total area of .00926 X1.1 (10% more) Means a required area of .0101 which would be had by using a XX34 rod which you might have to turn down from something else.....totally possible with some work.....now back to your combo....everything I have seen shows you running 2 sizes bigger on average then most....this leads me to believe you have other issues like fuel delivery, hood scoop too close to the carb, plenum area too big for engine or not enough timing....I suggest working with your combo some, as you should not need anything bigger than 116 jets even in cool air...

I agree with Damon. Mine is .113 square. My belief is that it may need 116/110 or 113/110 with a custom made metering rod. I believe Jake actually runs 113 w/ Q16. Our altitude .990 Ft. Even my small block blower motor w/750 Carters runs stock jetting, O2 sensor shows 11.8-1 at speed.
Doug

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

I agree with Damon. Mine is .113 square. My belief is that it may need 116/110 or 113/110 with a custom made metering rod. I believe Jake actually runs 113 w/ Q16. Our altitude .990 Ft. Even my small block blower motor w/750 Carters runs stock jetting, O2 sensor shows 11.8-1 at speed.
Doug

jake runs .116 squared and my motor is basically the same as his but his heads flow better than mine. your elevation is higher than where I race at.
.116 is what I raced with for the last 4 years with c14.with an A/F ratio of 12.8-13.1
Q16 with my elevation and .116 jets was a formula for disaster. A/F was 15.7-16.2
didn't try .119 jets with the Q16 because I knew it was still going to be lean.

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

Ok I'm all rejetted and ready to try this out. Put on my other set of Carter Carbs and jetted .121 square and also have another 8 jets drilled to .124 and .123.

 

[daredevil]

Try asking Damon.

Knew youd have an answer to this. Also knew he knew where to find ya if you didnt pop in. Did you go by the show at the KC hall?

 

[RustyRatRod]

Cool thread. I had no idea these carburetors were tunable for this much power. Learn sumffin new everyday.

 

[MarPar]

Learn sumffin new everyday.

I always try to anyways!!

:happy1:

 

[67 coronet]

very interested to see how this turns out ssr.have not thought of going to those fuels with my car yet.interested to see if it is worth the hassel.

 

[dvw]

How fast has your blue car gone Chris? I'll bet yours, Jakes, and my motor are pretty similar. Similar weight. What's in it?
Doug

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

How fast has your blue car gone Chris? I'll bet yours, Jakes, and my motor are pretty similar. Similar weight. What's in it?
Doug

It is always [email protected] in april may then 9.05@149. in the heat. 1.24 60 foot. I wish i had your heads Doug.mine only flow 402 [email protected]

 

[wedge5]

The real question is how fast/quick is the Black 65? Or is that still top secret?

 

[rumblefish360]

Thanks Fugly.

 

[fugly]

Knew youd have an answer to this. Also knew he knew where to find ya if you didnt pop in. Did you go by the show at the KC hall?

Did not go to the show, busy with other things.....going to Sealy for so e test runs in the morning...

 

[dvw]

It is always [email protected] in april may then 9.05@149. in the heat. 1.24 60 foot. I wish i had your heads Doug.mine only flow 402 [email protected]

402? wanna trade?
Doug